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Boiler problem

48 replies

Symposium · 23/07/2024 17:43

My combi boiler keeps losing pressure. It's still giving hot water but I noticed the gauge on zero so called out a Hometree. They send an engineer initially just topped up the water. I explained that I knew how to do that but wanted to know why the pressure had dropped as surely something must be leaking. We went round the house checking the pipes etc but nothing is showing. He said to call him out again if the pressure dropped. 2 days later sure enough the pressure was gone so I called him back. We checked everything again but there's no sign of water anywhere. He says that it may be an internal leak and if so we need a new boiler. He's left me to keep topping it up and checking for leaks over the next week. I'm wondering if I need a second opinion? Not sure if hometree would send anyone else but I'm concerned that he can't confirm what the problem is. He says there is no test for it as it's an old boiler and he can't isolate the part he would need to test. He hasn't looked inside the boiler but perhaps that's normal for this kind of issue.

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Hannahthepink · 24/07/2024 16:44

We had this problem recently. I thought at first that it must be a little leak hidden somewhere, but the plumber said that if we were having to top up the water every day/couple of days then we would almost certainly be able to see the leak that was causing it.
It was our expansion vessel (can't remember exactly what was wrong with it, but they replaced it). We have a large house and we're also getting an additional larger expansion vessel fitted because the standard one is not coping well with the size of the system.

Symposium · 24/07/2024 16:52

Thank you everyone. I think the expansion vessel idea may be correct. I've just tried putting the heating on and the pressure has risen up to the red zone 3 . I had topped it up to 1 earlier which I'm gabbing to do every 48 hours.

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KatiesMumWoof · 24/07/2024 16:57

Symposium · 24/07/2024 10:32

Boiler was in the house when we moved in so not sure of the age but we think 15 years at least. It's a decent Worcester Bosch. I've been in touch with Hometree this morning and they say they cannot help me anymore! They are even refunding my call out fee. The engineer has sent a report that does not mention a possible internal leak but suggested a hidden leak in pipe work that requires trace and access. There is only one area of hidden pipe work as most is surface mounted. Unfortunately I don't have a good enough home insurance policy to cover this, I've been in touch with them and they will only cover a claim after I have had the problem fixed myself!(less the excess) . I am going to contact a local gas engineer/plumber that I have used before and hope that he can help me!

WB are brilliant to deal with. If you sign up to their annual plan ((£17 per month & includes annual service)) leave it 30 days then call with a fault, they'll look after you.

Sisterdeloris · 24/07/2024 17:41

Yes a local engineer thats trusted is a good bet. Once they fix it (Assuming they can), make sure they add some new inhibitor, as all the fresh water you've added will have diluted whatever was in the system.

The pressure jump from 1 to 3 is weird just by turning heating on so does point to expansion vessel.

Dbank · 24/07/2024 18:18

Symposium · 24/07/2024 13:56

Sorry didn't mean to ignore your advice about radiators. Would that happen even though the heating is not in use right now and all radiators cold?

No problem, yes air could still vent out if the heating is off, as the system is still pressurised. It's a bit of a log shot, as you may not have "auto venting" anyway.

They usually look like this
https://aladdin-products.co.uk/aladdin-autovents-radiator-bleeder/products/

They work well, I have 12 fitted and never need to vent any of my radiators anymore.

Autovent Products - Aladdin Products

Comprehensive list of Aladdin Autovents products. See an image of each product and read the technical description.

https://aladdin-products.co.uk/aladdin-autovents-radiator-bleeder/products

whowhatwerewhy · 24/07/2024 18:40

This happened to my boiler. An internal seal had perished . A few new parts and it was as good as new 🤞

Bishbashboshing · 24/07/2024 19:03

Definitely get a second opinion by a qualified gas engineer. DH is a gas engineer, he never leaves a property without identifying the fault. It’s also really easy for gas engineers to work out if there is a leak, they should have a thermo imaging camera, the image is a different colour where the leak is

Symposium · 24/07/2024 19:18

Thanks all, I've just looked at his report again and he has written "expansion vessel checked-pressure is ok" I wonder what check he made?

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Symposium · 24/07/2024 19:19

I definitely don't have auto venting on the radiators , so can rule that out.

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Sisterdeloris · 24/07/2024 19:24

Symposium · 24/07/2024 19:18

Thanks all, I've just looked at his report again and he has written "expansion vessel checked-pressure is ok" I wonder what check he made?

I think they can put a bicycle pump style pump on it and check the pressure and repressurise if needed.

After the pressure on the system (not the same as the pressure on the vessel) shot up to 3, did the pressure relief valve blow? If I were you I'd be tempted to tie a bag over the metal pipe on the outside wall (assuming it has one) to check for it releasing pressure i.e. dumping the system water outside.

VolvoFan · 24/07/2024 19:30

The central heating is a closed loop pressurised system. There is a leak somewhere, it just hasn't been found yet. I had this once on an older boiler when I first moved in. It was still giving hot water and heating and never cut out, but the boiler pressure was always zero. It turned out to be a leaking pressure release valve inside the boiler. It had given up and was letting by water every time we topped the pressure off. How it was still providing heating and hot water I don't know, but due to its age and the risk of more things going wrong with, we replaced it.

Side note: Always check the boiler pressure in a cold standing state, where it hasn't been used for several hours. The cold standing pressure should always be between 1 bar and 1.5 bar. Avoid setting it to anything beyond 1.5 bar as it will only increase when in use and you don't want to run the risk of it getting too high.

Symposium · 24/07/2024 19:32

Can he check the pressure without taking the front off the boiler ? As he definitely never fid that, I was with him the whole time.

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Sisterdeloris · 24/07/2024 19:33

Symposium · 24/07/2024 19:32

Can he check the pressure without taking the front off the boiler ? As he definitely never fid that, I was with him the whole time.

No not unless you have an external expansion vessel.

Symposium · 24/07/2024 19:59

That's interesting. I've managed to book an engineer to come in the morning. I'm not going to mention the guy that's already looked. I just want a fresh opinion.

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Symposium · 24/07/2024 20:01

The pipe outside doesn't appear to be dumping water but it's hard to see as it's positioned over next door's alleyway .

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Sisterdeloris · 24/07/2024 20:10

Just make sure you mention the pressure shooting up to 3 when heating on but at rest its at 1. That points to the vessel.

The obvious answer is a leak but they're usually slow rather than as quick as yours.

All the fresh water you're putting in has to go somewhere so its either out of the pressure relief valve via the expansion vessel or there's a big leak on the pipework somewhere. But if all the pipework is surface mounted you'd expect to see it.

Symposium · 24/07/2024 20:38

Yes, keep thinking about where this water could be going. I've had a thorough look in my kitchen which is directly below where the only concealed pipes are. I can't see a drop. When we had the tiniest leak under our bath there were puddles of water forming around and a very wet floor behind the cabinets. I'm finding it hard to believe it's leaking from there and not showing a drop below.

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Sunnyside4 · 24/07/2024 21:41

One good thing is that you know it shoots up over 3bar, so that should help identify possible sources of the problem. It'll be interesting to know if it's the expansion vessel, a valve/other.

Symposium · 25/07/2024 08:30

Actually maybe had better mention that someone has had a look an advised me to keep topping it up. I don't want him thinking I'm just doing that myself.

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Symposium · 25/07/2024 12:12

Ok so fingers crossed it's now fixed! It was the expansion vessel. So glad we got that sorted before ripping the bath panel off or booking expensive leak detection. I'm going to put a complaint into Hometree, it seems unbelievable that the first engineer didn't even check it. The engineer this morning said it was fairly obvious.

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Sisterdeloris · 25/07/2024 15:15

Glad that got sorted. Now give Hometree the boot!

whowhatwerewhy · 25/07/2024 18:22

Glad you have it fixed , you definitely need to put a complaint into hometree

Sunnyside4 · 25/07/2024 21:19

So glad you got it sorted.

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