Council tax for annexe

[FredInMn]

Hello. Does anyone has the experience dealing with additional council tax bill on annexe please?

We bought the current dwelling in last year. During the whole purchase, we have been told and confirmed there is only one council tax bill we have to pay. And then we completed the purchase and moved in. However, recently we received another council tax bill in another tax band claiming the payment. Having quick talk with council, they claimed it is because of the annexe exists in my dwelling.

Being a matter of fact, we do not live in that annexe as the last owner has vacated substantially, there is no bed, furniture or even oven, cooker left. Now we just use it as additional storage room. As such, can we ask for exemption from council? In addition, we have the following questions:

1. Can we sue the Solicitors/Estate Agent as they obviously didn't disclose this necessary property information to us?
2. Is it good idea to let V.O.A. to visit my house and survey it? We are aware of the potential re-banding incurred after assessment.

Any comments are welcome.

When we built an extension for FIL to move in with us, we looked into all of this. We were assured by the council, the builders and the architect that the council can only charge a separate tax if the annexe contains a kitchen.
You will have to get them to come and inspect the property.
Perhaps they have it on record that the annexe originally contained a kitchen?

Sorry, it isn't clear from your post whether you are being billed for 2 separate council taxes, or if the council have changed your band to a higher level. so maybe my situation is not the same.
They can increase your banding if you have added extra rooms.

The banding only increases when the property is sold. We added a bedroom and bathroom. I expect our council tax band will go up when we sell, but I would expect the estate agent to warn the buyer about that.

Sorry for multiple posts. I looked up lots of info about this at the time and it is all coming back to me.

It's normal for the council to either increase banding or add a separate charge if extension works were carried out by the previous owners. This usually is only applied when the property changes hands. Your solicitor absolutely should have made you aware this could happen. It's common knowledge but it's always a "might happen" depending on the council.

Do you mean you received an additional council tax bill. So now you receive 2 bills instead of one?

Hi porridgecake, Hi Sublime66,
Thanks so much for your promptly comment. Yes, we have two kitchens and one of them is incorporated into the annexe. And we initially received only one council tax bill in band D. All of sudden, 2 days ago we got the second council tax bill in band A, claiming us the payment dated back to last year the point when we moved in.

In short, if it is the law that requires us to additionally pay a separate council tax in response to the existence of annexe, we are not going to challenge it as long as it sounds reasonable, applicable and most importantly, is still valid.

As I mentioned, the kitchenware inside the annexe have been removed substantially although wall-fitted cabinets/cupboards, power points, faucet and sink/water pipe are still remained. Practically speaking, the kitchen becomes uninhabitable for people living in. So, it is nonsense to charge a unoccupied annexe like this.

If council insists to charge us for a second council tax, we'd like to be advised if there is any ways we can get it exempted. One of experience shared by my friends is the annexe needs to house the elderly family members in a bid to get it exempted. It is definitely a good idea if my parents agree with us. But before that, what about the younger family members, like my son/daughter who are under 18 and also full time students, to live in the annexe? Are they eligible for council tax exemption?

Please advise us and many thanks.

Is the annexe physically attached to the house, or does it have its own four walls?

As PP have suggested, adding extra space to a home can cause a council tax re-banding after a sale. If the annexe is attached to the house, I'd say the council should re-band your entire home, not charge an additional council tax for it.

Would your main home moving up a band or two cost more money than if you simply pay the extra council tax A for the annexe?

I use this tool to find out bandings:

https://www.mycounciltax.org.uk/content/index

With respect to annexe or not annexe, friends of mine had this argument with a council in North Yorkshire for several years. Theirs was a workshop, turned into an annexe (with planning approval), and not attached. The original purpose was to house an elderly relative but she died before it was complete.

Somewhat ironically, they were renting it out on Air B and B, and the council were all over this, in their adverts, looking at photos. It had a lounge with a kitchenette, a bedroom and a shower room.

The council argued that it was a separate dwelling because it had a kitchen. So, my friend removed the fitted oven, and put in a desktop oven with two rings on top of it.

Then the council argued that it was still a kitchen because it had an under-counter fridge in it. They said something along the lines of 'if it has white goods that you couldn't remove yourself in the event of an emergency, it's a separate dwelling.'

My friend said 'if there's an emergency, I'll put the fridge on my back and carry it out.' - at least - that's the story he told us, anyway.

They managed to make the council back off, but in all honesty that could just be because he's one of the most stubborn and pedantic people you have ever come across, it's possible they just didn't want to deal with him anymore, so they agreed just to get him off their backs.

Looking at his address now on mycounciltax, I see that two other properties in his postcode ARE paying an extra band A for a separate dwelling, but he is not.

So, my advice for you would be: make the kitchen(ette) as small as possible, remove any under counter fridges or freezers and/or ovens, leaving you with a few cabinets, plug points and a sink.

Here's what google says about council tax for older folks:

A granny annexe will be exempt from Council Tax charge so long as it is occupied by a dependent relative of the household as their main – or only, home. Family members are classed as dependent when any of the following applies: They are over the age of 65. They are substantially or permanently disabled, They are severely mentally impaired

As far as I'm aware, councils class dependents to be: sons, daughters, mothers, fathers and absolutely nobody else [edit: and husbands and wives]. So you couldn't move your uncle in and call him a dependent.

With respect to your kids using it, I would say it's their primary residence, and no charges should be applied.

I suggest you post over on Legal as to whether your Conveyancer should have told you it would attract a separate council tax.

We have a slightly different situation. We extended our detached garage upwards. It's effectively a granny annexe and has a shower room and a kitchen area. However the PP states it cannot be sold as a separate dwelling or building. So it's just part of our single council tax bill. I would say two council tax bills means two dwellings. Not sure if that bothers you. It seems sensible to try and get the council to review the valuation.

Hi KievLoverTwo,
So grateful to have your inspiring comments here and your friend's experience sharing. This is exactly what i am going to argue with council: the existing annex is not inhabitable any longer (no physical feature available) and there is no one living in. I hope they would accept this and then drop the charge.

Thanks for your council tax check link. From there, I found out my property has only one house number and falling into tax band E instead of D, while via government tax banding website (https://www.tax.service.gov.uk/check-council-tax-band/search), it indicates there are two house numbers: one for my main property, (i.e. 100), another for the concerning annexe, (i.e. 100A). In addition, I have crossed checked with HM Land Registry, only main property (i.e., 100) information has been shown.

I will fight the V.O.A for the decision against the 2nd council tax bill. If they are still not going to accept it, I will renovate the annex kitchen and move my children in. After all, they are more than happy to stay there. Taking the chance to get the 2nd council tax bill exempted, I am happy too.

We are also in a similar position, our council are a nightmare, trying to get council tax for our annexe yet at the same time saying there's a planning restriction & we can't rent it out.
Also we're trying to sell our house & they've dropped this on us!
Can I ask, how did you get on with the VOA?

This is a council tax question. I had an annexe built adjoining my property in 1998 for my parents to live in. It doesn't have its own boiler or water meter they are all in the main house. I applied for planning permission to separate the properties in 2015 which was accepted but I never went ahead. After this period I then was told it was classed as a separate dwelling and started charging council tax band A. I have contested this for years as it doesn't have its own cooker there is a kitchen but no fitted oven my mum always used a work top oven. The issue I have now is I want to sell but its putting people off as the 2 council tax bands. Please can you advise if I should argue this point
Many thanks

Is there any planning restrictions on your annexe? If there is you could apply for council tax to be nil if empty. It's usually worded something like 'an annex or part of the property that cannot be let due to a planning condition'.

If not you should not bother with the council but go to the valuation office to challenge the council tax, remove everything including the counter top cooker & if you have a linking door between your house & annexe this will be helpful. Calling the kitchen area a kitchenette or hobby room or something, argued that the house & annexe are one.
Or if it doesn't have a planning restriction I'd say it's either a granny annexe or it's a holiday let. Market it differently.

My in laws were also told it's all about the kitchen.

They were told by various builders that people get round this by building an annexe, get the place inspected and then stick the kitchen in after that.

But then on resale the new owners should be told and their survey should spot the difference and either take kitchen removal off the price or at least flag it up in terms of council tax?

Just to add to the above replies, an annexe has to have cooking facilities, a place to sleep and a toilet.

The government say that you need to make physical changes to your property in order for it to be no longer an annexe. They say specifically that:

It should be noted that you should not expect the following alterations to impact the VOA’s decision on whether a separate area of living accommodation still exists:

• removing a sink without removing the drainage and pipework
• removing a cooker without any other works

So, you can't just remove the sink, but you've got to remove all the pipework and drainage etc. The same with a gas cooker.

Once you've done all that you then contact the Valuation Office Agency (VOA) and they will get the council tax removed:

If you’ve removed a separate area of living accommodation by making physical changes to your house, flat or other domestic property, you should contact the VOA. The VOA will only be able to remove a Council Tax band if the area or annexe has been sufficiently altered so that it could no longer be lived in separately.

https://www.gov.uk/guidance/understand-how-council-tax-bands-are-assessed

We bought a property that had been split in half previously. We immediately turned it back into one property. Think of doorway created without door....but still had the 2nd kitchen downstairs but ended up having to take the appliances out to prove it was 1 property...even though we couldn't separate it from the others idea of house due to open doorway on first floor. We probably paid 2 lots of council tax for more than a year until it was solved!