Water softener - worth it?

[GnomeDePlume]

We live in a hard water area. Limescale forms everywhere.

Reading on the bathroom thread a few people mentioned getting water softeners.

So, can you soften the water for the whole house? Is it worth it? What is the approximate cost?

Any thoughts gratefully received please.

Yes I would have one if I lived in a hard water area permanently.
For a 3 bedroom house, currently 1 resident plus higher weekend use, I was told 1800. A bigger unit would be needed if more residents.
If you are Cotswolds, I may be able to find the name of the company.

@youngerself thank you. Sadly not Cotswolds.

If you are doing a major renovation it’s worth it. It will dramatically extend the life of your boiler, washing machine, dishwasher etc.

I think they look good. I have a handy cupboard that I can fit one in.

Stuff I am concerned about :

i) They drop the water pressure a bit. Water pressure is useful in a shower, so anything that drops water pressure a lot is a no no for me.

ii) They replace all the calcuim/magnesium ions with salt. Which means you end up with saltwater in your taps. It's not very high concentration, but probably not recommended to drink it if you have health issues.

Other than that (and the cost), I think they have lots of advantages.

Yes, use a lot less soap, shampoo, detergent. Appliances last forever, and I spend minimal time cleaning because there's no limescale on taps etc.

Adding to what PP said - you can't put softener processed water into freshwater fish tanks, because of salt. So we decided against it, as we're into fish keeping hobby. Surely there are consequences for humans as well, if exposed long term?

Definitely worth it for us. You should have one tap that isn’t softened for drinking. Kitchen tap is the obvious one for the bypass. How feasible it is for you will depend on your pipework layout.

Am in London where pretty sure it's hard hard - a pain.
Question - maybe a daft one - since I have the idea that there are no advantages to hardwater, but plenty for soft, couldn't the water companies soften it before it comes out of your taps?
see - said it was a daft question - expecting to be flamed with water tech.

There was already one in our house when we bought it. I don't know if newer ones are better, but ours used so much fresh water to process and create the softened water that our water bill went down drastically once it was removed.

We also removed the softener as the only bypassed tap (for fresh tap water) in the house was in the utility room. Therefore, I couldn't use the softened water in the kitchen for cooking or drinking as the taste was vile. I also worried about potential health implications. The previous owners had fitted a filter tap in the kitchen that they used for drinking, but despite a new filter, it still tasted very obviously of softened water to me.

@GasPanic
i)They drop the water pressure a bit. Water pressure is useful in a shower, so anything that drops water pressure a lot is a no no for me.
We had a pump installed at the same time and a hot return, meaning we don't wait ages for hot water to come through the upstairs tap. We have 4 bathrooms (although never used all at once) and 2 storey and a pump was recommended anyways, so there is no loss of pressure.

ii) They replace all the calcuim/magnesium ions with salt. Which means you end up with saltwater in your taps. It's not very high concentration, but probably not recommended to drink it if you have health issues.
This is the reason that every, single softener company we contacted, recommended a hard water tap for drinking. The softened water is apparently fine to drink, if you don't have kidney issues or a baby, but I don't like the taste. Our hard water tap is filtered and tastes great.

OP- We have just renovated and did a huge amount of research into softners, had demos from multiple companies and read 100's of reviews. We were having new piping, new boiler etc installed, so easier to plan it from the start. Some things I learnt:

• some brands will accept small, compressed salt pellets, which are widely available from DIY stores, online and builders merchants. Some companies only fit a compressed, brick shape of salt. 1 company had a specifically shaped brick to fit their machine only. Personally, we got one which accepted pellets because you can shop around price wise
• This might not be right terminology! 1 type is electric and everyday, the system will refresh itself, using water and electricity- regardless of whether any water has been used or not. The other type doesn't use electric, and will refresh only once its required. There is only DH and myself, so it seemed a waste for a system to refresh itself more often than actually needed
• If you have a larger family or lots of guests, you might need to refill it with salt weekly, or even twice a week. If you have the space, get the largest hopper you can, to avoid this.
• Some builders used monarch brand from screwfix and recommended them. From memory, they were the electric type and just seemed a waste for us, but might be fine for a larger family
• We ended up with kinetico brand
• We have a filtered, hard water tap in the kitchen. Another thing to consider, if you are renovating, is one for the en-suite or upstairs bathroom. It means we can get a drink in the middle of the night, without coming downstairs.

To answer your question OP, then yes, I do think its worth it. No more limescale marks on mirrors and shower screens. The toilet bowl doesnt fur up and I spend far less on cleaning products now- plus the actual time to clean! My hair is softer and I'm sure we use less shampoo.

In a previous property, the limescale completely furred up the sink and shower plug holes which cost a fortunate to replace. No such issue now.

Yes it’s worth it.

I think we have the space as the mains water comes in to the utility room which is next to the kitchen.

Not sure if loss of water pressure would be an issue. Our combi boiler/CH system is idiosyncratic (I'm being polite about it). We have been in the house 18 years from new and we are already on boiler no.3

We fill ours up about every 3 months - 50kg of ordinary salt pellets, family of 5, lots of showers and baths.

Can't remember what is cost, 1500 installed maybe, but since we had to pay more than that to replace nearly blocked copper and plastic pipes when we moved in it seems like good value.

Water much much nicer, showers etc better, we drink it too as pipes don't work out for separate tap. Haven't noticed any drop in water pressure.

Really don't understand why everyone doesn't have one who can.

Can’t help with the water pressure I am afraid. We are on a hill so the water pressure is very high (in fact we have a limiter on to avoid damage).

Yes Yes Yes!
Best thing I've bought for the house, made a huge difference.
Pros

1. I can wash and rinse a wine glass under the tap and it dries without any marks.
2. Kitchen and bathroom much cleaner, no need for descaler.
3. Shower screen doesn't mark if you don't wipe it after a shower.
4. Glass kettle doesn't scale up at all.
5. Use less detergent, washing up, showering, and in washing machine.
6. Hard to judge but must save a lot of time cleaning.

Cons

1. Cost a grand 5 years ago
2. Cost £90 pa in salt
3. Loose a bit of space under the sink.

We bought an Ecowater eVolution compact 200, currently £1.4 K. There are much cheaper ones, but the eVolution ones are "smart" and alert you to the salt level and unusual usage (i.e. someone left a tap running). has an app to change settings etc.

It also knows how much water has passed though it, so it only regenerates when it needs to, ours does it at 2:00 AM every 5-6 days days depending on usage, it doesn't use much water when it does it.

I order 8 X 10KG a year from the saltman.

(Ecowater has been around since 1925, you might know the name Permutit, vaguely interesting background read more)

I know a couple of people with more basic ones, which don't seem to work as well judging by the calcium deposits on their taps etc.

We drink the softened water and can't tell the difference, but I would probably avoid if we had baby etc.

Didn't make any difference to the water pressure. (I think the more basic ones might)

.... and will be coming with us if we move.

Tip 1, be aware that your boiler's heating circuit may need to be re-filled with un-softened water, so bypass the softener first, by twiddling the valves.

Tip 2, my garden hose is still hard, but it would be handy to be able to use soft occasionally for cleaning car and windows etc. I'm tempted to add a outside soft tap, but haven't got round to it yet, you might want to consider it.

Loved mine best purchase ever, even got a black kitchen sink.

www.tradeplumbing.co.uk/atlantis-at210-hi-flow-water-softener-10.html?gclid=Cj0KCQjwhfipBhCqARIsAH9msbn4OfXAvfAGWjBi8yBiIRtunCcvrSi76xDLo584DlpBlTjFAhSS2E8aAn4sEALw_wcB

This is the only model my independent plumbing supplier would recommend. The guy that designed it took all the best things from existing ones and combined into one.

Absolutely do it. We had ours put in when we had our kitchen extension, and I just wish we had got one years ago.

We have our kitchen tap on separate supply, so that it doesn't get the salty water, it has a built-in filter instead. Your plumber should be able to advise on this.

Definitely worth it! We lost a small amount of space under the kitchen sink, probably about the size of a desk top PC (the hard drive bit, not the monitors! 😂). We live in a very hard water area, and after a while the softened water actually starts dissolving the limescale deposits that have built up. Ours was less than a grand, and we took it with us when we moved house. We also have a separate small non-softened tap in the kitchen sink, and water to the garden tap is not softened either.

Yes, we are in SW London and have softened water to all non potable outlets. As above you do need non softened for watering garden or household plants. No limescale here :) We put the appliance in the garage (can't remember the cost it was while doing a renovation). Salt price is very low. We get it delivered every year or so.

Thank you everyone!

Absolutely worth it. One of my favourite things from when we did an extension last year, along with the cat flap!

We got a BWT one that can take tablet or block salt - we use tablet. Was about £600 I think. My previously encrusted taps are now limescale free. We use less washing powder/liquid and shampoo etc. The toilet is much easier to clean too.

But the biggest benefit has been the effect on my skin - it is so much less dry and itchy. I really notice the difference when we go away now.

We have a separate supply for the kitchen and garden taps which isn't softened. My kitchen sink is a constant reminder that we live in a hard water area.

We rent one and have done for years. It’s brilliant and I’ll never not have one again. It doesn’t add salt to the water in fact. Salt is used to wash the resin that softens the water and the sodium levels are slightly higher but there are 5 x the level of sodium in a glass of milk compared to softened water and still well within limits for the majority of people.

No limescale, and our boiler etc have lasted years longer than they would have done as we live in a very hard water area. It also stopped my DC getting eczema which was the main reason we got one. We use softened water for pretty much everything although we have a hard water tap in the kitchen. We use about £90 of salt tablets a year. No loss of water pressure either but eek have a pressurised system and cold is off the mains.

All good positive comments.

My only concern now is the CH system (combi boiler) which is pressurised off the mains. Can we use softened water for that?

There is no practical way of keeping a separate, unsoftened supply for that. Boiler is on the top floor of a three storey house (this was how the house was built).

We used ours with our combi boiler.