Help me answer the kitchen designer's questions

[pantalo]

We're getting a new kitchen, and planning to use a recommended local company. They came for an initial visit and asked lots of questions, to get more information for the design. Trouble is, we haven't put in a kitchen for 20 years, so we haven't got a clue! For background, it's a fairly small kitchen which will be very well used - we cook a lot and we're not the sort to be wanting to worry about lots of special maintenance. We're looking for modern style (probably flat front grey/black/brown/cream) and want to maximise work surface and storage (it's for cooking in, no space for dining table). Money certainly isn't 'no object', but we're not on a tight budget either - we're prepared to spend a bit more than standard Wickes etc. It needs absolutely everything doing to it (though nothing structural), and we don't want to have to manage any of it ourselves.

So, I'd love some MN help on the pros and cons of the following.

Worktop - do I want laminate, quartz, corian (apparently that's a real thing) or granite?

Do I want integrated appliances?

I definitely want a double oven, but do I want the top oven to be a combi microwave?

Hob - will definitely be induction (no gas supply) but how big - standard or bigger? What kind of splashback behind?

Do I want drawers? A larder unit? Whirly corner cupboard things?

Do I want an exposed extractor fan or one in a cupboard?

Do I want a boiling water tap? (I rarely boil a kettle, but I do often boil pans of water.)

What kind of fridge do I want? I have space for a freezer in the garage - but do i still want an icebox?

So I want tiles or luxury vinyl flooring?

I would really welcome any MN wisdom on all of this - and on any other likely questions that I don't even know that I don't know how to answer yet!!

We are in the planning stages, and I have spent a lot of time watching YouTube videos from "Kitchinsider". He's got lots of useful hints and tips.

This is his video on choosing worktops -

but there are loads of other videos which are really helpful.

I've changed my mind about six times from my original "this is my dream kitchen" ideas

Some of it is purely down to taste - have a look at a few showrooms and if you have a friend who has a new kitchen then pop round and try out drawers et...We've just had a new one in and friends have popped round to 'try it out'.

Worktop - we went for quartz. It looks fantastic, but is quite clinky. Very easy to clean. A bit of me thinks we could have just had good laminate instead, cheaper, easier to install and if you change hob or sink etc much easier.

Do I want integrated appliances? - I wasn't sure on that - but now we've got them I like the look. It does mean we have nowhere to put fridge magnets.

(We also got a full height freezer and a full height fridge - really like them both). Under counter wide freezers with drawers are available that look very useful.

I definitely want a double oven, but do I want the top oven to be a combi microwave? We went for combi microwave.

1) check the wattage on the microwave - we didn't and it's piddly - 600. - I'm considering getting a more powerful separate microwave or replacing it (££s)
2)we've never used it as a combi - so either as a microwave or handy spare oven.

Hob - will definitely be induction (no gas supply) but how big - standard or bigger? What kind of splashback behind?

We went for one with a duct built in - vented induction hob- its great but the venting takes up most of the cupboard underneath - so check that - and it also needed ducting put under the floor in our case.....

Do I want drawers? A larder unit? Whirly corner cupboard things? I'd say the wide deep drawers are the best thing we put in. We put all our crockery and pans in them.

Do I want an exposed extractor fan or one in a cupboard?

Do I want a boiling water tap? (I rarely boil a kettle, but I do often boil pans of water.)
REally like ours...but you can buy a lot of kettles for what it cost. I'd also consider getting one that has a chilled tap.
What kind of fridge do I want? I have space for a freezer in the garage - but do i still want an icebox?

So I want tiles or luxury vinyl flooring? - We went for LVT and like it, easy to clean and stuff you drop doesn't break. in contrast I hate the glossy white tiles we put on the bathroom flor.

Extras - we have a pull out larder cupboard that holds masses. And I wish I'd put a small pull out cupboard for oil and spices next to the hob.

I moved to a place with granite worksurfaces and I love that I don't have to worry about putting a pan / oven tray down anywhere. I'm quite scatty, so this might not be a benefit your need!

Yes to pantry cupboards, including small one for oils. Yes to drawers generally. I'd go for a built in combi .

I'd have cupboards right up to the ceiling. More storage for things you don't use often, and no horrible sticky greasy dust on top.

If it's an option, I'd have my oven at waist height (not under the hob) with a deep two-level level pan/roasting tin/colander drawer underneath. I've had both and much prefer lifting heavy trays out and across rather than out and up.

I didn't think I had strong feelings on worktops, but my DSis has quartz and I'm
nervous every time I put something down, it's just so hard and noisy! Laminate seems a bit more forgiving somehow.

There is a great “kitchen lessons learnt” thread on MN somewhere - time we’ll spent.

I have that Fisher and Paykel fridge freezer linked to upthread - it’s great, the width of the fridge is amazing and the water cooler great. The freezer isn’t massive though, but we have another one in the garage. It keeps food fresh for ages.

One of our ovens is a combi and it’s never used as a microwave, as it’s such a low power microwave (our standalone mw is 1000W, the built in is only 600W).

Plan out your activities - if you want to make a cup of tea, where does your kettle live in relation to the cups/teabags/milk? Same for cooking. We have a small fridge by the cooking area and the larger fridge is round the corner in the utility. Where do you put hot stuff when it comes out of the oven?

Islands can be a pain - it’s hard to keep them free of crap and suitable for cooking/prep. Ours is also right in the way between hob and big fridge, so you have to walk around it.

The kitchen in our old house was IKEA which was at least as good as our current kitchen, which cost 5 times more (we didn’t put it in!). Designers are not as good as Mumsnet for figuring out what you want.

The only appliance I wouldn't have integrated is a fridge/fridge freezer as their internal dimensions are smaller than freestanding fridges and they're a pain to replace. Integrated dishwashers don't have the same issue as they are basically a normal dishwasher with a plain door that you can fit a doorfront on to match the cabinet doors.

What about a solid laminate? Much more durable than normal laminate but very reasonable priced. We love it! And 5 years on it looks like new still.

We've also just finished having our kitchen redone and the things that I love most so far are:

• the built in bin - it's just to the side of the worktop where I prep so can slide bits straight in. Having had years of traipsing across the room to a stand alone bin, it's wonderful to have
• the deep pan drawers - they make it so much easier to find things
• having the dishwasher, fridge/freezer and microwave built in. It looks so much better and will be so much easier to keep clean
• tall units that go right up to the ceiling - again make cleaning so much easier and give very useful extra storage space
• having no tiles at all, just an upstand around the worktop. Again, it's so much easier cleaning-wise
• going for an extra-wide induction hob. I'll probably never use all 5 zones at the same time but having that bit of extra width when cooking makes everything feel less cramped. It also means that the drawer underneath is very wide too, so great for fitting all my pans in
• the 'secret' drawers inside the top row of pan drawers - perfect for cutlery and all the utensils
• having LVT flooring - it's so much warmer underfoot and easier to clean that the tiles we had before
• having pull out drawers in the tall larder cupboard - makes everything so much easier to find

I spent a long time reading threads on MN to get ideas of what I wanted and spent a long time at the planning stage (we've had 12 years in an awful kitchen to work out what we didn't want!) In fact the designer said to me that he'd rarely seen anyone with such a clear picture of what they wanted, and never had anyone come back to him with so many questions! I'd just assumed that was the normal way of doing things!

Pull out bin - a decent sized one that holds a swing bin liner And think about where your recycling will go. Also, if you don't have a utility, some sort of tall cupboard for brushes/ironing board etc.

We would have had room for a nook for chopping board which I kind of wish we'd done.

I'm not sure that's as much of an issue as it used to be. They are fairly standard not.

I fitted a new kitchen a couple of months ago - yes to drawers - I have 1 each for pots and pans, serving dishes/pyrex jugs and bowls, cake tins/baking stuff and one for my everyday crockery as well as narrower ones for cutlery and utensils. I also had one put in under my oven to hold baking trays and it also fits 2 litre bottles. Larder cupboard in kitchen is fab - partially shelved and has drawers in the bottom - I also have another one in the utility that is just shelved and holds an amazing amount of stuff. Oven and dishwasher are integrated but my microwave is in a cupboard above the oven (it's a combi microwave). Fridge Freezer is freestanding but unit is built around it so I have a cupboard above it. Hob is induction but it has 2 zones that can be joined to make a much larger one (its a Hotpoint one). I went for a laminate worktop which I am happy with as I wanted oak effect without the hassle of real oak and having to oil it etc. I love my pull out drawer for bins but other half doesn't like it as he has to walk a further 2 steps to get to it compared to where they sat before! We did go round various independent suppliers and chains before making our final choice - a local independent who came in cheaper than some of the chains we went to and they were also able to sort out trades cor me.

1. Granite or quartz in a light colour. Flecks in the stone hide any specks of dirt as well as smears. We have black granite and it’s fab & durable but hard work to keep it looking nice and non-smeary.
2. Definitely a Quooker tap, we rarely boil a kettle but use it constantly
3. We have a 90cm hob and I love it, but 80cm would be enough.
4. Deep drawers are fantastic. We have wide, shallow drawers underneath the hob and these are very useful for knives, spices (laid flat in an iDesign rack), chopping boards, foil rolls etc.
5. Integrated microwave, oven and dishwasher but skip integrated fridge as they are smaller than freestanding fridges of the same size. We have a combi Neff microwave and I really love it.
6. Think hard about your prep space. We inherited a kitchen with no areas without overhead cupboards and it’s tiresome. Also think about your lighting.
7. Glass or steel splashback. Grout gets dirty.
8. Integrated bin cupboard is a must, do think about how many different waste/recycling bins you have - we have 4 in our county so ours has four sections.
9. If you get a pull out larder cupboard, don’t put it against a wall, or you can’t access both sides! Have been in a few kitchens where they’ve done this.

We had a new kitchen a year ago and I now know what was great and what not

90cm hob with large middle burner. I have a large single oven and love it for our family. Quartz behind to match the worktop

Quartz. Beautiful, hardwearing, and thinner than laminate which just looks nice. Quartz upstands instead of tiles. Easier to clean

Lots of drawers. 5 shallower ones and 5 pan drawers hold almost everything. The large ones are right opposite the dishwasher and hold plates, bowls and baking dishes

Larder cupboard. It holds so much, in addition to a large pantry

Long enough cupboards for brooms / mop / vac if you don't have a utility

Shelves inside the corner unit. Spinny / pull out ones are shite

American f/f with double width fridge shelves. Just better

Double pull out bin under where I food prep - small recycling / gen rubbish

LVT. Warm, hard and attractive

Double the sockets. Keep them close to where you work

Sinks with corners get grotty FAST

Wow, this is amazingly helpful, thank you.

A couple more... Sink type - I don't want a butler style white china sink, so is stainless steel the best option? In the showrooms, nobody seems to have a double or 1.5 sink, or a drainer, any more. We've never had a dishwasher before, so maybe that makes a huge difference - but surely you still have to wash up??

Those recommending glass splashback behind the hob - do you just have painted walls otherwise, apart from upstand? Or any tiling?

Cost - everyone is being very British! I know there are huge variables, but is anyone willing to volunteer an estimate, particularly those who have done their kitchen recently? The designer we saw has given us a complete 'finger in the air' estimate of 30-35k, but that was based on very little guidance from us. Does that sound likely/reasonable?

I paid just under £27k 2 years ago.
That included painted wood doors/cabinets. It's a big kitchen so cabinet wise think it's 15 lower cabinets (including the fancy corner ones with the s pullout shelves, the integrated pullout bins and the integrated dish washer

Tall double oven unit with cupboard above and pan drawers below

Single tall pantry unit with pull out shelves

180cm x 120cm island with pan drawers and pull out spice drawers

1 1/2 stainless steel sink that is fitted underneath worktop cutouts with draining board engraved into worktop

Appliances:
Neff 1 1/2 oven
Neff fitted microwave
Neff 80cm 5 ring induction hob
Neff pop up extractor fan
Fisher & paykal French style fridge freezer

All fitting of the kitchen

I paid a plumber separately

I paid electrician separately to moves sockets - NOTE FOR AN INDUCTION HOB YOU MAY NEED NEW CIRCUIT THINGY. Not a big job for an electrician.

Flooring was separate

I got all my cupboard/drawer handles from website ironmongerydirect who I can highly recommend.

Oh and 8 head height cupboards too!

Water boils super quickly on an induction hob with a boost mode, so really no need for a hot water tap if you don't often have hot drinks.

I am having my new kitchen fitted as this very moment. (Absolute pain but presume it will be worth it in the end. )
we are having a large 'french style' three door fridge freezer.
A boiling tap because I am completely over kettles.
A large 'larder' floor to ceiling corner cupboard.
A five ring hob with wok burner (gas)
A 'gadget cupboard' with lots of power points and lighting, for my large food processor, mini chopper, coffee grinder, toaster, hand blender etc to sit all in one place and usable in situ. Hopefully will free up lots of counter space.
Synthetic worktops but LVT flooring (Amtico) because i really dislike the ceramic floor tiles we had.
Built in electric oven with combi microwave/grill.
1-1/2 stainless steel sinks, integrated into worktop. Glass upstands, no tiles.
Cost -- about £30k.

Worktop - do I want laminate, quartz, corian (apparently that's a real thing) or granite? Quartz

Do I want integrated appliances? Yes to dishwasher and if you don't have a utility for washjng machine. I have utility so have exposed washer. I have a large american fridge freezer but integrated larder fridge also nice.

I definitely want a double oven, but do I want the top oven to be a combi microwave? Yes.

Hob - will definitely be induction (no gas supply) but how big - standard or bigger? What kind of splashback behind? Bigger if you have space. I am still deliberating on splashback but wish i got quartz supplier to run it up the wall as wouldn't have cost much more then.

Do I want drawers? A larder unit? Whirly corner cupboard things? Larder. Whirly things are rubbish.

Do I want an exposed extractor fan or one in a cupboard? Whatever look you prefer.

Do I want a boiling water tap? (I rarely boil a kettle, but I do often boil pans of water.) no need if you have induction. I have an alessi kettle on my induction.

What kind of fridge do I want? I have space for a freezer in the garage - but do i still want an icebox? I like big larder fridge freezer with jntegrated ive maker.

So I want tiles or luxury vinyl flooring?
Tiles imo. I do 't like vinyl

Plain glass splashback, take it out as far as possible either side of the hob. No grout to clean, a quick wipe I've and it's sparkling. If you have room, two dishwashers. There's never enough room in one for all the extra pots and trays.

I’d think carefully about putting in a boiling water tap to fill pans unless it’s next to the hob - those full pans will be very heavy and it’d be easier to carry over a cordless kettle.

we love our combi microwave and rarely put the “big oven” on now!

Worktop - not wood - no other opinions sorry

Do I want integrated appliances? - maybe - they look nicer but they are smaller and less energy efficient

I definitely want a double oven, but do I want the top oven to be a combi microwave? - separate microwave is better

Do I want a boiling water tap? (I rarely boil a kettle, but I do often boil pans of water.) - no they are awful - get a pot filler tap instead

Ok, so on cost, I can guarantee that what your designer has done is size up your property and the way you come across and work a budget from there. if you’d been on a cheaper road, or looked a bit less flush, the budget would have been lower. You saying there is no upper limit is a massive red rag to their sales targets. Don’t be a sitting duck!

corner carousel cupboards: no, waste of money and space
combo oven, also no, useless and more components to break - get a standalone micro like professional chefs.

absolutely get a double or 1.5 drainer. Plus a full size dishwasher. You’ll be grateful of the additional drainer when things need soaking.

flooring, I’d 100% recommend vinyl every day, or marine-quality laminate. definitely not shiny porcelain stuff, or tiles laid with adhesive: cold in winter unless you’re getting UFH. Wood is tricky if there are any leaks. Think what would happen if there was a leak or burst pipe, these are very common and any floor laid intricately or that is porous is going to be ruined.

check out DIY Kitchens or even Ikea or Howdens, they are ultra reliable modular kitchens for which you can always get replacement bits and bobs.

Oh, and worktops, hard composite artificial stuff is brilliant - silestone etc. laminate will eventually delaminate and wood will rot/ degrade to the point you can’t sand it out. Marble is unnecessarily expensive and aesthetically indistinguishable from the fake stuff IMO, unless you’re a top flight pastry chef ;)

Ours looks very swizz and was 27k from howdens. kitchen fitter liked it and said they were easy to work with. Silestone worktop was extra and quite a lot of money.

we got a white howdens deep sink, size is lovely but it’s stained badly. If you go for stainless steel get a decent grade one.