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Original poster

Payment to builders

12 replies

Outonmyear · 09/08/2023 11:58

Hi we’ve been having work done on our house which we’ve agreed to pay £16k for and we understood it would take 3 weeks.
They are still here - end of this week is 6 weeks total work plus we had to get building control involved when they made a mistake and wouldn’t own up to it, said it was usual practice. That was horribly awkward and they had their knuckles rapped. Concerned at their knowledge.

We are not happy with some of the finish in the kitchen and on the roof although they do seem to be trying to rectify things (mostly).

they will still have a decent amount of exterior work to do and lots of finishing bits which will probably run past this week.

I am not happy with them at all, although some of the work is decent but just want this over.

they have been asking for payment in instalments throughout. We have £4K left to pay and I’m at the stage where I don’t want to pay anymore until
a) everything is finished
b) we get building control sign off and electrical certificates
c) we are happy with their work

What is the position on this? Can I withhold money at this stage? I’m thinking it would cost that much to finish/ put things right at this stage so I am wary at paying anything else.
I have paid everything else in good faith but unfortunately that faith has been sorely tested this week and it feels like this could go on for ever.

The agreement for work was with one builder who was coming round constantly quoting, discussing things and we decided to go with him as he was so knowledgeable. Come the day of work he springs his son on us who we had never met or heard of and original guy has done nothing and doesn’t really want to communicate with us if we have any issues as he is easing into retirement!!

one of the first things the son did was widen the kitchen window in the wrong place and couldn’t move it meaning a gate will have to be moved and we couldnt have an extra kitchen cupboard. My concern about this was totally dismissed as well but was mostly due to not knowing about all our discussions.

totally fed up and venting I know!

OP posts:
PimpMyFridge · 09/08/2023 13:08

Blimey. Definitely no more payment until satisfied.
Do you have anything in writing?

Original poster
Outonmyear · 09/08/2023 13:29

Thank you for the validation! You get a kind of Stockholm syndrome when they are in your house and it is going on so long.

Only got the quote which is itemised. stupid me I know would get timescale and payments and names in writing next time.

some of the work has gone so well but the thing that building control pulled them on is “something they do on every job” (stated before they got told off).

Building control said rest of the work looked ok.

i think payment will only be asked for on completion now but I am ready for a bit of a battle and will set conditions. I am going to be so so picky about finish and standards before they get the payment.

OP posts:
CRbear · 09/08/2023 13:30

Definitely no more until you’re completely happy!

userxx · 09/08/2023 13:30

Do not pay, this is your only bargaining tool.

Was he recommended ?

Original poster
Outonmyear · 09/08/2023 13:39

userxx · 09/08/2023 13:30

Do not pay, this is your only bargaining tool.

Was he recommended ?

He’s well known in the area and has done work for people on our road. Well the dad is.
He was also a stickler about building control being involved which is why what happened is so weird.

i can’t imagine if I got a job on the basis of several interviews and then sent my daughter in my place that would go down well so not too impressed with that either. He comes for 5 minutes each morning to tell son what to do and then off he goes. Bizarre.

nope no more money. This is helping my psyche myself up thank you.

OP posts:
userxx · 09/08/2023 13:42

Sounds like he has a few jobs on the go, I would be pissed off too. His son wasnt the one you took on.

KievLoverTwo · 09/08/2023 13:44

Sounds to me like he is doing a tricky balancing act between trying to let his son take over the business whilst also knowing he is not quite ready to yet.

I would be kind but firm, and make sure he is very aware that you thought you were employing someone with 40 years experience and the trained eye that comes with that, not someone with 5/10 who is not yet able to meet original builders standards. Whilst being sympathetic that he can't be there all the time, you employed him for his work level and standards, not his son.

I guess this is a lesson for some of us to ask who exactly will be doing your job when quotes come in.

Original poster
Outonmyear · 09/08/2023 13:56

KievLoverTwo · 09/08/2023 13:44

Sounds to me like he is doing a tricky balancing act between trying to let his son take over the business whilst also knowing he is not quite ready to yet.

I would be kind but firm, and make sure he is very aware that you thought you were employing someone with 40 years experience and the trained eye that comes with that, not someone with 5/10 who is not yet able to meet original builders standards. Whilst being sympathetic that he can't be there all the time, you employed him for his work level and standards, not his son.

I guess this is a lesson for some of us to ask who exactly will be doing your job when quotes come in.

Thank you. Yes definitely check. There is hardly anyone now around here who is actually doing the work - they all subcontract.

I’ve had people telling me I shouldn’t pay the rest and negotiate as they have breached regs and done damage inside roof which although can be fixed up will never be quite as good as if they hadn’t done it but I don’t want to cause ongoing stress and problems of anything legal and I’m not sure what that means as we don’t have an official contract.

I think what you said is a good way of asking dad to check it is to his standard and do snags as really it is the least he can do. It is all so so awkward which infuriates me as it should just be an exchange of money for services!

OP posts:
good96 · 09/08/2023 14:05

Don’t pay until work is fully completed and your satisfied. That’ll incentivise them to complete the work. If you pay them and work is outstanding chances are they’ll drag their heels even more.

PimpMyFridge · 09/08/2023 14:13

Building standards only check safety not quality of work, so their approval is of limited relevance.

It's an awkward dynamic cos if there is more work left than money to pay, they might cut their losses and leave the job incomplete. Whether they do that depends on how much they value their local reputation/what costs sticking with the job entails.
Where I live it would be unlikely as everyone talks and their name would be mud, where I used to live (city) it would happen easily because they're was always another 'mug' waiting.

But if you keep your installment, talk to the dad as pp suggested and give him the job interview analogy, and say that if your build work is a training exercise for his son to have as a learning opportunity he has a moral obligation to help this get over the line to a reasonable standard, as that's not what you thought you were getting.

Hopefully, if he wants to keep the firm's reputation he'll see sense.

PimpMyFridge · 09/08/2023 14:13

It's horrible isn't it!

Original poster
Outonmyear · 09/08/2023 15:30

PimpMyFridge · 09/08/2023 14:13

Building standards only check safety not quality of work, so their approval is of limited relevance.

It's an awkward dynamic cos if there is more work left than money to pay, they might cut their losses and leave the job incomplete. Whether they do that depends on how much they value their local reputation/what costs sticking with the job entails.
Where I live it would be unlikely as everyone talks and their name would be mud, where I used to live (city) it would happen easily because they're was always another 'mug' waiting.

But if you keep your installment, talk to the dad as pp suggested and give him the job interview analogy, and say that if your build work is a training exercise for his son to have as a learning opportunity he has a moral obligation to help this get over the line to a reasonable standard, as that's not what you thought you were getting.

Hopefully, if he wants to keep the firm's reputation he'll see sense.

Excellent advice thank you. Everyone here is helping me work out next move. I think reputation would be important to him.

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