The ULEZ of rural life

[EffortlessDesmond]

There is a Government proposal to ban replacement oil boilers from 2026. Of course, it's important to shift away from fossil fuels, but this is going to affect rural houses disproportionately. The existing electricity grid is unable to support demand if there's a mass switch to heat pumps, and most villages don't have a gas supply.

Given the £15k installing a heat pump and its ancillaries, versus £4-£6k for a new oil boiler, how many more rural households are going to find themselves old and cold and damp in pursuit of Net Zero? The Countryside Alliance estimates the number at 1.7m.

It has been in several newspapers, yesterday and today, for anyone who hasn't already seen it.

Wood pellet boiler. Bio oil boiler.

You could also go for some combination of wood burning stove(s) and electric, maybe coupled with solar.

Electric heating is very expensive, but a 10-20k installation cost buys you an awful lot of electricity.

We looked at solar but again not allowed (listed and conservation area). It's like a class of preservation vs environmental depts!

*clash sorry

Good job we have such a plentiful and resilient electricity supply.

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2022/07/28/no-new-homes-west-london-electricity-grid-runs-capacity/
July 2022
West London faces a de facto ban on new homes for over a decade because the electricity grid has run out of capacity.

https://www.chroniclelive.co.uk/news/uk-news/national-grid-power-blackout-cuts-25290360
The National Grid says power may be shut off between 4pm and 7pm on 'really cold evenings' if Britain can't secure enough gas during extreme cold

https://www.northumberlandgazette.co.uk/business/two-weeks-of-hell-for-alnwick-businesses-after-power-cut-3354912
Businesses in Alnwick suffered almost two weeks of ‘hell’ after the town’s recent power outage.

We live in a 5 bed granite Victorian house - original windows, no insulation etc. Currently have 35yr old oil heating. Our entire area has no connection to the gas network (northern Scotland).

We need to change the heating as the current boiler is old and very inefficient.

Looked at ASHP - but in order to make it efficient (and not cost the earth to run), we'd need new windows (got quotes - £110k +), retrofit insulation (which means ripping off all internal lath and plaster linings, fitting insulation and then putting up plasterboard - losing 10cm off each side of every room.... at a cost of 10's of thousands) and we'd then have change all the heating pipes and radiators to larger capacity ones to account for the lower operating temperature of ASHP vs oil. So basically a non-starter because of the insane cost and upheaval required.

Gas isn't possible. LPG isn't possible unless we want a tank in the middle of the garden (we do not).

So, we're essentially left with no choice but** to replace our ancient oil boiler with a new one and knowingly kicking the can further down the road about how to improve the sustainability of the house.

My concern is that there'll be some kind of punishment (especially given the power the Green Party have in Scotland) for homeowners who haven't converted. There's been talk of restrictions made on EPC ratings and the mortgageability of houses that have oil/gas boilers - basically making the house unsellable.

I was at a NT property this week which had signs saying it had been fitted with heat pumps. I also noticed that nearly every room had a portable electric oil filled radiator in it too….

@BarrelLegs we have an LPG tank in the middle of our front garden but you wouldn’t have no idea that it’s there as it’s underground.

@BarrelLegs sorry meant to say you would have no idea it’s there!

Electric heating has very low (or zero) installation cost, no regular maintenance or inspection is required. When you include installation and maintenance costs electric heating isn't expensive. In fact if the cost of electricity wasn't kept artificially high by linking it to the price of gas it would be cheaper.

Many rural properties could also benefit from wind or water generation to reduce reliance on the grid.

Time of use tariffs could be encouraged (rather than penalised as they are now) to avoid shortages of supply at peak times.

That's very interesting, thank you! I've only ever seen them above ground so was imagining a hulking great tank sat on the lawn. We'll definitely look into an underground one!

Given I think the measures have no impact at all internationally unless China, India, Russia also do the same we are p issing in the wind whilst people suffer. It will cost locals to me £12.50 to go to the doctor, 12,50 to collect someone from the tube station from end of month (ulez coming and I hav a diesel car as the petrol version was far too expensive) and we are virtually rural 200 acre wood opposite - nothing like inner London.

The impact for some in rural areas will be they will burn logs and coal again like the old days and thus cause more pollution than had they stuck to their oil burners.

@BarrelLegs all my neighbours have theirs sunk into the front garden too as the houses were built at the same time. I presume that it costs more to sink it in the ground but it looks so much better. As it’s in the front garden it also means that Calor can fill it up even if we are not in the house.

It would cost me an extra £1K a year to heat my house with electric vs gas currently. So a replacement boiler recovers the cost vs. electric in about 3 years.

A heat pump would take 10-15 years for my place. And that assumes I would be able to use the heat in the same way (for example I can turn the heat off when I am out for a day whereas with the heat pump that is more difficult).

It's pretty telling that if you went to a corporate accountant and proposed a 10-15 year return on your money most would laugh at you (in the UK anyway).

China is still the biggest polluter but it has made enormous gains in solar, wind and hydro that far outstrip the rest of the world’s combined efforts.
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2023/jun/29/china-wind-solar-power-global-renewable-energy-leader

They've still got a long way to go but you can’t deny they’re making massive investment and with a clarity of purpose and policy that is lacking from our own government.

I wonder if people in the 70’s and 80’s talked of ROI when they made the massive financial commitment to install CH? Or when £30k is spent on a new kitchen to replace something perfectly usable?

The government needs to step in with a clear vision and policy though to support the transition to renewables. Decoupling the price of electricity from the price of gas as well as moving the green levy where it belongs will bring the price of gas and electric much closer together to make savings more pronounced. Investment in the smart meter network in rural areas will also open up smart tariffs to a wider audience. All this dithering achieves nothing and puts off private investment.

We have a heat pump in a rented house and would never buy or install one. The issue is not being able to turn it off and on. Our usage was far far lower when we could have an hour of heating in the morning when we woke up then a couple of hours in the evening. If it suddenly got very cold we could give the house a quick blast of heat. Now we only turn the heat pump on overnight when electricity is cheaper and stay in the smallest room with an electric fan heater for a few minutes every hour. We were freezing and poorer last winter in the heat pump house.

Is that 110k quote just to replace the windows?!

@KievLoverTwo Yep, and that was the cheapest quote of three. They have to be basically like for like replacements (with the exception of being double glazed) so hardwood etc. we have 5 big bay windows, so the total number of units is high, but even still I was genuinely shocked by the cost. Needless to say, we'll be doing them in stages over a long time!

It that because the building is listed, or because you want to maintain the original character?

We had a heat pump fitted a couple of years back in our rural (1880s) house to replace an oil boiler. I've been pleasantly surprised so far that it's now warmer and cheaper than when we were on oil. Our annual electricity bill is about £1000. We had to have a couple of radiators replaced but no other changes.

I get that heat pumps aren't a straightforward solution for everyone, and that 2026 seems very soon (though remember that's only for installing NEW oil boilers), but oil boilers really are a very polluting and expensive technology and we do need to phase them out.

The comparison for the move from gas CH fro coal fires is not particularly apt as the resultant change was better not worse. It was in the 21960s my parents had radiators installed throughout our detached house and could pain and use the coal area as an additional utitliy room. Gas cookers/ hobs ere instant clean and much better than lugging coal around bed rooms. Yes, not everyone could afford it but no one was forced into it as we seem to be doing with the current eco measures.

@KievLoverTwo Both - although given the prices if we didn't have to use hardwood I would certainly consider using softwood regardless of preserving the original character or not. Once it's painted you can't even tell!

It isn't true that heat pumps don't work in old, poorly insulated buildings. They do. How well a heat pump works depends on the size of the radiators (or extent of ufh) and, just as with a boiler, the heat pump being the right size.

At work rn but if I remember latwr I will share some links that explain this in more detail. The "heat pumps won't work in old buildings" myth is very convenient for people who want us to go on buying gas and oil....

I saw this post earlier and thought it put it rather well.