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Original poster

Too cheeky?!

33 replies

USaYwHatNow · 13/07/2023 00:35

Found a house we'd possibly look to make an offer on.

1st time it's up for sale in 50 years (since it was built!)

'Guide price' of £385k.

Pretty obvious an elderly person/couple live there and would look to do the following to the house:

-New kitchen (very dated, very old free standing oven with no hood/extractor etc) and some cupboards look to be falling apart.
-Extend the 'new' kitchen into the adjacent utility room so new cabinets/sink etc in there too to match. To be clear there is already a utility room there.
-New bathroom, currently a shower room with disability aids in situ. We have a baby so would ideally like to turn it back into more of a family bathroom.
-RE carpet the hall, living room and dining room. All currently one piece of carpet and think victorian style tiles but in carpet form 😂 laminate/Vinyl in the kitchen (currently carpet tiles!) utility, WC and bathroom. Bedroom carpet to be replaced in one bedroom as its a bottle green colour. Everywhere else the standard beige.
-New boiler as the house is currently being heated by air vent system.
-Removal and making good of stairlift currently attached to wall. Just had a read and looks like it can be done professionally and sometimes free of charge!

Are these reasonable enough renovations/changes to be able to offer a lower amount, taking into account the above?

A quick Google suggests:

-Roughly £14k for a '3 wall' kitchen cupboard kitchen and appliances (can't take with us as live in a new build) and have factored in a bit to include utility room.
-£1k for bathroom (can get cost price due to family connections)
-Just under £3k for the flooring
-New boiler/system £4.5k

Then maybe £5k for unforseens?

So in all a possible (lower end of guestimations) figure of about £27.5K. Happy to live with the rest as would just need a paint job here and there.

Is a suggested offer of £358k absolutely ridiculous? Would it be expected that actually all that would be funded by the buyer on top of the full asking price?

This would be our first move since buying a new build as FTM's so not sure about asking prices and offering a price etc.

TIA!

OP posts:
Ponderingwindow · 13/07/2023 00:41

If the house is priced appropriately, it will have already been priced with an expectation of an extensive remodel. No one buys a house like you describe without doing renovations.

Flump9 · 13/07/2023 00:41

That's not really how it works. It will have been valued in it's current state knowing that it needs updating, you can't just take money off cos it needs doing.

BestServedChilled · 13/07/2023 00:43

It’s a reasonable offer but you may find the price was already set to reflect the fact work needs to be done

Moveoverdarlin · 13/07/2023 00:50

I think £358k is quite a cheeky offer. Like a previous poster said, it’s valued based on its current state. It’s not for the current owners to come down on price based on what plans you have for it. I’ve put a new kitchen / bathroom in every house I’ve bought and re carpeted as standard. I didn’t calculate what that totalled and take it off the asking price! Most of what you’re talking about is common for a house of that age.

You could put in a cheeky offer, but you could have weeks of going back and forth to get nearer the asking price or you could piss them off from the get-go for going in too low.

Kinneddar · 13/07/2023 00:51

As pp said the fact its needing work done will have been factored into the asking price. It'd probably be £30k dearer in walk in condition.

You can offer whatever you like but don't expect a low offer to be accepted just because it needs work done

KievLoverTwo · 13/07/2023 01:31

I would recommend going in at 346. This is because it is common in current market conditions to offer 10% under asking. Neither agent nor vendor should be shocked or offended. Be prepared to work that figure upwards if you love it.

WuTangGran · 13/07/2023 01:35

The vendor is not responsible for funding whatever you want to do to the house after you buy it.

Bluesheeps · 13/07/2023 01:41

It’s not cheeky. It’s an offer, it’s how you feel comfortable pricing it. They can tell you to walk!
Were currently looking at a property which initially went on the market for 1.1….has dropped to 1 within a month.
estate agents are telling me smaller property next door sold for 900k to i should consider that. I’m considering offering 925.
the market is different wherever you live.

Twiglets1 · 13/07/2023 06:30

USaYwHatNow · 13/07/2023 00:35

Found a house we'd possibly look to make an offer on.

1st time it's up for sale in 50 years (since it was built!)

'Guide price' of £385k.

Pretty obvious an elderly person/couple live there and would look to do the following to the house:

-New kitchen (very dated, very old free standing oven with no hood/extractor etc) and some cupboards look to be falling apart.
-Extend the 'new' kitchen into the adjacent utility room so new cabinets/sink etc in there too to match. To be clear there is already a utility room there.
-New bathroom, currently a shower room with disability aids in situ. We have a baby so would ideally like to turn it back into more of a family bathroom.
-RE carpet the hall, living room and dining room. All currently one piece of carpet and think victorian style tiles but in carpet form 😂 laminate/Vinyl in the kitchen (currently carpet tiles!) utility, WC and bathroom. Bedroom carpet to be replaced in one bedroom as its a bottle green colour. Everywhere else the standard beige.
-New boiler as the house is currently being heated by air vent system.
-Removal and making good of stairlift currently attached to wall. Just had a read and looks like it can be done professionally and sometimes free of charge!

Are these reasonable enough renovations/changes to be able to offer a lower amount, taking into account the above?

A quick Google suggests:

-Roughly £14k for a '3 wall' kitchen cupboard kitchen and appliances (can't take with us as live in a new build) and have factored in a bit to include utility room.
-£1k for bathroom (can get cost price due to family connections)
-Just under £3k for the flooring
-New boiler/system £4.5k

Then maybe £5k for unforseens?

So in all a possible (lower end of guestimations) figure of about £27.5K. Happy to live with the rest as would just need a paint job here and there.

Is a suggested offer of £358k absolutely ridiculous? Would it be expected that actually all that would be funded by the buyer on top of the full asking price?

This would be our first move since buying a new build as FTM's so not sure about asking prices and offering a price etc.

TIA!

It’s not cheeky at all. I was thinking an offer of around 350k would be fair. It’s less than a 10% discount and a nice round sum. A high enough amount that the agent will be encouraging the owner to seriously consider it, unless market conditions are very different where you are living to most of the country.

If it gets rejected I would just leave it on the table for a while and continue to view other properties. Unless you really like it a lot in which case you could increase your offer to 358k as best and final offer.

DrySherry · 13/07/2023 06:57

I agree that offering 10% under won't cause offence in the current climate. Id expect to have to negotiate up though. More important might be your proceedability. How far on are you with your sale ? LTV of your new mortgage? Or it might be important to the vendor that you are able to wait to complete (if they are buying a new build not quite finished etc etc). Every vendors situation is different. The offer itself is not offensive - when only yesterday the news was reporting expected mortgages will be so much higher in the near future. I'm sure they don't live under a rock.

Fab973 · 13/07/2023 07:04

100%,try it. We negotiated £60k off out home and it wasn’t as expensive as the house you are looking at. If they say no that’s fine too then you negotiate

Seaitoverthere · 13/07/2023 07:09

Definitely try but I would start at 345k saying you appreciate it won’t be what they are hoping for but in the context of the current climate of rising interest rates and the ever increasing costs of building work you this is what you feel you can offer. If you are in a good position emphasise that.

meddysam · 13/07/2023 07:11

Where I am in London it's usually quite normal to price a house higher allowing for a bit of negotiations. Only on MNs is the original asking price the right one, makes you wonder why there os reductions all the time.

meddysam · 13/07/2023 07:12
  • It’s not cheeky. It’s an offer, it’s how you feel comfortable pricing it. They can tell you to walk! Were currently looking at a property which initially went on the market for 1.1….has dropped to 1 within a month. *

Yep I've seen house reduced by 200k in a few weeks, and often still overpriced.

C4tastrophe · 13/07/2023 07:21

It could be a cheeky asking price.
What have other comparables sold for in the immediate area? And how much is it per square foot?

I think you are seriously underestimating the costs of your renovations, particularly a new central heating system for 4.5k? You’re avin’ a giraffe!
When was it last rewired?

somewhereovertherain · 13/07/2023 07:28

For me it would be more about how long it’s been on the market. Has it been reduced. What price would similar houses go for in decent condition.

Personally I’d be starting around 340 and see where we go from there.

we bought a similar house was on for £350 we paid £285 - had been on the martlet for a long time with very few viewers and had a number of flaws.

as for your budgets we’ve just spent £12k on a bathroom and budgeting more like £25k for a kitchen.

good luck.

PragmaticWench · 13/07/2023 07:57

I think things like carpet, kitchen and bathroom on your list are 'want to have' and shouldn't be funded by the vendor.

IF it has been priced correctly for local market
then take the price and reduce for age of:
heating systems
costs of rewiring entire house (if ancient wiring system)
if the kitchen is freestanding - can you get a mortgage on it?
Roof or drain issues or anything else shown on a structural survey

Original poster
USaYwHatNow · 13/07/2023 08:15

Thank you everyone, that's all really helpful!

OP posts:
Twiglets1 · 13/07/2023 08:30

USaYwHatNow · 13/07/2023 08:15

Thank you everyone, that's all really helpful!

Good Luck with your negotiations! And a future update would be great 😊

Original poster
USaYwHatNow · 23/07/2023 21:08

So as an update, my original post was just musing/pondering. Our house wasn't even on the market at the time but I wanted to get opinions.

In the mean time, we have decided to put our house on the market!

We had estate agent round on Thursday, for sale board went up yesterday, we've had our first viewing today before our house has even gone 'live' and they are first time buyers and seem really keen (hoping for good feedback/news tomorrow!)

We've got the professional photographer booked in on Thursday just in case.

The estate agent we've gone with is also managing the sale of the house we like (detailed in the OP).

We spoke to the bank re: affording the house at £385k which we could do but we'd literally be able to move in and then would need to save for the rest of the work. Fine, we can cope with a 'do-er upper!'

In the mean time, the sellers have dropped the price to £375k, but they have told the estate agent they would accept in the region of £360k as that's what they would need to move into the house they have their eye on.

The house has had views but no offers due to road noise apparently. We're currently used to living on a train line and I grew up next to a motorway so hoping it's something we can deal with!

We need to have an offer on our house/have sold before we can view the house we've fallen in love with.

Trying desperately not to get our hopes up, but everything seems quite promising at present.

Estate agent has advised us he will be telling the sellers that we have put our house on the market with a view to purchasing theirs, and that he'll keep us updated if any offers come in. Hoping they make take pity on us and let us go and view it.

Our potential buyers' mortgage offer runs out in September so they are super keen to get going.

Dare I get my hopes up?! If you're that way inclined, please cross your fingers for us!

OP posts:
jennyjones198080 · 23/07/2023 22:48

I managed a move like this. Was able to view and after a terrifying bidding war, a few false starts before getting sale agreed on mine I am now sitting int he new house.

I have spent £120k far on renovations - and this place is only 20 years old. I love love love it!! Still need to do the garden, patio, sitting room and recarpet the whole upstairs. Most expensive year of my life!!

I probably wouldn’t get all the money back now given market moves - but I don’t care - I’m here for good.

Original poster
USaYwHatNow · 24/07/2023 01:04

@jennyjones198080 ah amazing, congratulations on getting the house! That's pretty much our argument for doing it now, as we'll (hopefully!) be in the house forever, so we'll have the time to get it all done, in theory.

The house likely needs a full re-wire and then the heating system updating, so we have resigned ourselves to the fact that if we did manage to buy the house, our savings would be wiped by those two rather massive jobs, and then it's a case of, a room or two a year. But it's too good of a shell to forget about it.

Just the waiting game now I guess 😂

OP posts:
C4tastrophe · 24/07/2023 06:38

I’d be concerned about the road noise and pollution.
Hiw busy is the road? Is it also trucks and buses?

BlueMongoose · 24/07/2023 20:10

USaYwHatNow · 24/07/2023 01:04

@jennyjones198080 ah amazing, congratulations on getting the house! That's pretty much our argument for doing it now, as we'll (hopefully!) be in the house forever, so we'll have the time to get it all done, in theory.

The house likely needs a full re-wire and then the heating system updating, so we have resigned ourselves to the fact that if we did manage to buy the house, our savings would be wiped by those two rather massive jobs, and then it's a case of, a room or two a year. But it's too good of a shell to forget about it.

Just the waiting game now I guess 😂

You seem to be in their ballpark pricewise, and also seem to be realistic about taking time to do what you want, so it sounds doable. Best of luck!

Seaitoverthere · 26/07/2023 03:46

Fingers crossed for you ! We’ve bought a house that had same owner in for 45 years and we are currently renovating. Moving and installing new boiler and 16 radiators is 10k. Electric looks like we are hopefully going to get away without rewire but will be a few grand I think as moving kitchen, chasing light switches in and some other bits.