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Original poster

All those of you who have a deposit saved but cannot buy at the moment

27 replies

FlyingSoap · 23/06/2023 20:35

How are you feeling? We just darent because of the rates, I think it would be a stupid (and dangerous) decision and one that would land us in negative equity. It’s so frustrating though when you’ve worked hard towards your house goal and then have to put it on ice.

OP posts:
Sublime66 · 24/06/2023 09:21

KievLoverTwo · 24/06/2023 05:36

The conversation I had with the OH yesterday is that I am so peed off with the housing market in the UK that I am really not sure I want to buy here at all anymore.

Many people have extremely justifiable reasons for wanting to buy: they have children they want to pass inheritance onto, they have family nearby they will need to care for in future, they need the security of a home that's theirs whilst their kids are being schooled, they have had a slew of bad landlords and having to move home that makes it feel buying is the only option.

But the truth seems to be, home ownership in the UK seems to be an obsession of ours that's not nearly as prevalent in a lot of Europe where folks have a lot more rights in rentals. In Germany, it's normal for rentals not to have kitchens because people take them with them from one rental to another! And LLs can just terf you out. I mention Germany because the OH was out there working when we got together five years ago, and he was none too happy to have to come back (my mum was dying, he did it to support me).

Anyway, I am now thinking: move to Ireland for five years, get EU citizenship back, move somewhere else in Europe and either rent or find somewhere that has a reasonable standard of living and reasonable house prices. We are so sick of watching the poorest in our society get screwed by our government, and even if labour get in next time, it will take 15 years to undo the harm the Tories have done to our economy.

I was looking at ONS stats yesterday. House prices rose 31% in the two years because they gave stamp duty breaks to stimulate the housing market. They did that because so much of our GDP depends on it, not because they think people should be able to afford to buy homes. It was a political decision that's going to have a knock on effect for years. I am so tired of them treating homeowners like pawns that I am really not sure I want to be a part of it anymore.

We have no kids and we now have no family ties. The OH can WFH, and if we keep our money earning interest and decent savings, he could go consulting instead of being permanent tied to The Man. Maybe he could work 6 to 9 months of the year and we can travel the rest of it.

It seems any extra wealth you have when you retire these days just gets ploughed into absolutely exorbitant care homes, so what's the point? This is maybe a bit bonkers and radical, but I have told him that the first sign he sees of me having dementia or similar, take me to dignitas, save us both the misery and have a better standard of living for the rest of his life.

And yeah, perhaps we will still consider buying if prices drop 30% and what we can afford will no longer make my disability worse or significantly affect his autism (noise sensitivity), but right now, I am firmly on the fence of whether to bother anymore.

Re 6% plus BOE base rates - if they reach that high, we are likely to enter a recession anyway, because of all the medium sized businesses who have relied on cheap borrowing to prop up their growth - they won't be able to afford their borrowing without downsizing anymore. It feels like we will hit that by December.

It feels so fked up that people are penalised for spending their money (inflation) by being forced to pay more on their mortgages. I don't feel like this should be the way an economy should work.

This is a pretty good summary of how a lot of people are feeling, I think, and not only in the UK but all over the world.
We’ve essentially reached our “you’re getting fucked over by us in power” limit. Also the last few years having been fucking tough on people, I actually don’t think it will make any difference Tory or Labour anymore, i believe the way things are heading are more of a global movement in the west, it’s the result of decades of cheap money. The housing market is a joke here compared to some you’re right, but that is not sustainable for the next gen so must deflate as a natural progression. Still other countries have it worse.
Germany definitely has its own problems too, the housing market isn’t perfect by any means, depending where you’re looking of course. Here we are fuelled so much by greed, the whole BTL landlord movement and cheap money really screwed the country up. You’re right in Germany renters rights are better over there since a long time. Renters rights are starting to improve here now too tho, with changes in laws, it is causing casual landlords to cash out of the market, perhaps this will cause further issues with lack of supply and makes me question which corporates will swallow up property and become institutional landlords. But ultimately it’s improving.
Moving to Ireland is a great idea if you want an EU citizenship without the hassle but not sure if it’s necessary, it’s a long time to wait, 5-6 years. These days many EU and non EU countries are very open to allowing immigrants to settle as long as you can support yourself. Especially since the rise of remote working.
I’ve lived abroad for quite a few years, also in Germany and other countries. I understand your frustration about the property market and the care homes thing and agree about assisted suicide!. But I do think the housing market is about to unwind by 20-30% minimum, location dependant. However along with that will come job losses and unemployment, again location dependant. Especially combined with the rapid push towards automation/AI development.
If you have no family here, can’t you live in a cheaper part of the country?
I share your vibe but having lived abroad a lot, feeling ungrounded for a long time, and watching what’s happening in other developed countries, it is unfortunately happening everywhere, to different degrees, it is global. I decided to give up on all that and deal with what I’ve got in my comfort zone for the next decade or so at least. But I do have family here. I feel as though shit is continuing to hit the fan in the west. I always think there is something special about being in your home country and being able to confidently manoeuvre and dodge the system in your home environment in your language, which you can’t do to the same degree being an immigrant or guest abroad. I know that sounds like a shit position but it’s true. There are also many options for a better quality of life within the U.K. I do think things have been bad for the past few years that it can be very easy to think the grass is greener (though undoubtably it could be in many cases!). We are bombarded with media content from all angles, it doesn’t help with sometimes knowing too much information.
On a personal level with interest rates, let’s be thankful we don’t have 90% mortgage on a 500k property we bought in the last year or so. Some people are now finding themselves in that position and are about to be royally fucked in the next year when renewing their mortgage.
Let’s see where we are in 6 months to 1 year, I think we are going to see radical change in the housing market and it could be easily the best time to buy in the past 15 years, just keep saving in a high interest savings account and try not to listen to the news too much!!

Original poster
FlyingSoap · 27/06/2023 18:04

KievLoverTwo · 24/06/2023 05:36

The conversation I had with the OH yesterday is that I am so peed off with the housing market in the UK that I am really not sure I want to buy here at all anymore.

Many people have extremely justifiable reasons for wanting to buy: they have children they want to pass inheritance onto, they have family nearby they will need to care for in future, they need the security of a home that's theirs whilst their kids are being schooled, they have had a slew of bad landlords and having to move home that makes it feel buying is the only option.

But the truth seems to be, home ownership in the UK seems to be an obsession of ours that's not nearly as prevalent in a lot of Europe where folks have a lot more rights in rentals. In Germany, it's normal for rentals not to have kitchens because people take them with them from one rental to another! And LLs can just terf you out. I mention Germany because the OH was out there working when we got together five years ago, and he was none too happy to have to come back (my mum was dying, he did it to support me).

Anyway, I am now thinking: move to Ireland for five years, get EU citizenship back, move somewhere else in Europe and either rent or find somewhere that has a reasonable standard of living and reasonable house prices. We are so sick of watching the poorest in our society get screwed by our government, and even if labour get in next time, it will take 15 years to undo the harm the Tories have done to our economy.

I was looking at ONS stats yesterday. House prices rose 31% in the two years because they gave stamp duty breaks to stimulate the housing market. They did that because so much of our GDP depends on it, not because they think people should be able to afford to buy homes. It was a political decision that's going to have a knock on effect for years. I am so tired of them treating homeowners like pawns that I am really not sure I want to be a part of it anymore.

We have no kids and we now have no family ties. The OH can WFH, and if we keep our money earning interest and decent savings, he could go consulting instead of being permanent tied to The Man. Maybe he could work 6 to 9 months of the year and we can travel the rest of it.

It seems any extra wealth you have when you retire these days just gets ploughed into absolutely exorbitant care homes, so what's the point? This is maybe a bit bonkers and radical, but I have told him that the first sign he sees of me having dementia or similar, take me to dignitas, save us both the misery and have a better standard of living for the rest of his life.

And yeah, perhaps we will still consider buying if prices drop 30% and what we can afford will no longer make my disability worse or significantly affect his autism (noise sensitivity), but right now, I am firmly on the fence of whether to bother anymore.

Re 6% plus BOE base rates - if they reach that high, we are likely to enter a recession anyway, because of all the medium sized businesses who have relied on cheap borrowing to prop up their growth - they won't be able to afford their borrowing without downsizing anymore. It feels like we will hit that by December.

It feels so fked up that people are penalised for spending their money (inflation) by being forced to pay more on their mortgages. I don't feel like this should be the way an economy should work.

Solidarity. Tbh moving to Europe might not be the worst option here. Just so crap isn’t it

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