Are we fools? Buying a house with a ROW over back patio

[Biscuitlover456]

FTB here - me and my partner are in the process of buying a house which has a ROW on the title register for the house next door, allowing neighbours access through a side gate along the side of the house we are buying, across the patio and in through another gate to their garden.

We are both now a bit spooked given the back and forth between ours and the buyers solicitors over this. Buyer’s solicitors haven’t answered some questions about the use of this ROW and I’ve been reading some horror stories online about disputes. Are we mad? All advice welcome!

I live in a Victorian mid terrace, I have a row going across the rear. It's massively common, it does get used, my neighbour has a gardner who turns up once a month. It's really no issue, the advantages of living in a Victorian house far outweigh this issue. It's actually quite nice, opens up the chance to meet each other. Big rooms, front and back gardens, brick walls, high ceilings etc are all great. Unless you are loaded, no house is perfect. It all just goes in the mix. To the folks fear mongering, yeah people can be awful but most really aren't.

All the best op

I wouldn’t buy with this access.

I personally would try very hard to find somewhere else without a ROW. My parents had a ROW over their front garden, we tried to re-route so it wasn't so close the house, but it was refused. If the neighbours are fine then of course no problems, but if they are not then it can obviously be a problem. The issues for us were that they would stand on the ROW and stare into the property - which unnerved my mum. It was weird - but you couldn't get them to move as legally they could be there.

@Biscuitlover456 I wouldn't buy it. There's absolutely no point in going to any lengths to find out what the current neighbours usage is, as you have NO idea how long they'll continue to live there. (Or that it's even the truth)

you say you're older, so maybe you don't intend to have children, but I wouldn't want children or pets vulnerable to neighbours entering the garden at any time and leaving the gate open.

I know it's hard when you live the house, can afford the house etc

My advice would be to do your future self a favour & take a swerve on this one!

Would not touch it with a bargepole. Could be a bloody nightmare.

Only if you’ve met and spoken to the neighbours about it. If they are difficult or don’t want to discuss it, avoid. I bought a house with this, and in 4 years they used it about 3 or 4 times to bring large appliances and garden equipment (think washing machines or paving slabs etc) in through their garden. Each time they let me know and were very polite, even though technically they didn’t need to. I sold it no problem.

Our Neighbours have a ROW across our back garden, we have it fenced off so you can’t see the garden from the ROW but the ROW is down our drive and across the back of the house. They use it once a fortnight to get their garden bin out, but always ask us first. It is a worry that they may move and a nightmare family move in, but luckily for us I don’t think they’re ever going anywhere. So it’s fine in practice. I do worry about resale but all the Victorian terraces in our village are like this, and there aren’t many available so if people want to move here they don’t have much option (& it’s desirable because of the schools), so hopefully we’ll be ok 🤞. In summary, it’s been ok for us but there are worries.

The issue isn’t how it’s being used at the moment, but what the exact wording says.

There are lots of court cases about rights of way so your solicitor should be advising you what the express wording is, and any implications of relevant case law (for example some rights are expressed as being “at all times and for all purposes” and this has been the subject of quite a few decisions).

It does say “at all times and for all purposes” - I’d be interested to look at those cases if you know of any specifically?

Definitely not if you have, or planning to have, children

It would be an absolute no from me. When you have problem neighbours you start realising that there are forums for this sort of thing (Garden Law forum) and ROW is one you have no control over. There is usually no stipulation for numbers of times it can be used and not only do the neighbours use it but their visitors too.

There are issues further down the line too, like your or the future owner of the property's children playing in the garden and anyone has a legal right to enter that private garden space to access next door. Would they remember to close the gate each time? What if the neighbours get a dog? Again the gate may be left open and then the dog is in your garden.

My friend has a ROW that goes past her kitchen window and every person who passes does a side eye look in. It is unpleasant.

through our solicitors we are asking how things are working in practice but what else can we do

I see lots of others have pointed out the fallacy here. How it's working at the moment really tells you nothing useful about how it might impact you in future.

The only circumstances in which I would go ahead with this purchase, would be if I genuinely could not afford anything else and do accepted the risk as part of housing myself and my family.

Downsizing into a house with such potential to go wrong is, for me, unfathomable.

I wouldn't consider the house with the right of way running close to the house, across your patio and in front of your windows. It would be different if it was at the end of the garden and you could fence off the last meter.

People could come and go through the back at all hours - even if the current neighbours don't.

My house used to have a small half height gate with no lock and I didn't think about it too much but would often close the back curtains if I went out and not leave laptops/purses/handbags in sight. When we got a tall gate with a padlock I was surprised how different it felt. No curtain closing or hiding valuables (there are privacy blinds on the front windows). I felt I could doze on the couch with the back door ajar and feel safe and comfortable.

Your garden will not be private and secure which in turn means your house will not be private or secure.

If you do go for the house and the neighbours are not heavy users of the path perhaps you could use a gate and combination padlock with a code that you can share with them for some level of security.

I would not touch it with a barge pole - when you come to sell it, your potential buyers will be doing exactly as you are and wondering if they are doing the right thing - and it might reduce the value of the property.

It is fine as long as your neighbours are nice respectful people, but you can never know who might move in there.

Vendors are now obliged to declare any neighbour disputes, but I would not rely on that.

My parents lived in a setting where several houses had been built round a lake and there were complicated rights of way, especially as all residents had to have access to the lakeside. One neighbour (who happened to be called John Thomas!) was a total pain, moving bollards etc. and it truly made my mother ill - they lived on top of one another and it was a blight on all their lives. They sold at a loss and moved.

It does say “at all times and for all purposes” - I’d be interested to look at those cases if you know of any specifically?

It's less about the wording and much more about the potential nuisance factor if you find yourself with inconsiderate neighbours.

What remedy would you really have if you could not agree with them on what is reasonable behaviour? The awkwardness of first noticing they were doing something which you did not think was reasonable. Debating whether to ask them to stop it and risking an escalation.

Imagine having to go to court in order to enforce the terms. How would you gather evidence? How would you enforce a ruling against them? How much might you rack up in court and legal fees?

Once there was evidence of such a thing, they would certainly find it very difficult to sell, incase it was their neighbours who were the difficult party.

All situations to be avoided at all costs.

My friend is currently in a house like that. She hates it so much. The neighbours are nice, but they have three children who are constantly passing through the garden with their bikes and scooters then leaving the gate open, or leaving their own gate open which enables the neighbour's dog to come in and poo in the garden. The neighbours are always apologetic, but it doesn't stop.

I would avoid a property like. It's too much of a risk and you'll have a hard time selling it if it becomes too much.

It’s something your solicitor needs to advise on to make sure you get advise from them
you can rely on. There are a couple of textbooks that they should have on the subject (provided you’ve instructed decent solicitors).

I am a bit surprised the RoW is so widely drafted and not, for example, just for the purposes of accessing a back garden or a driveway. Get proper advice in writing so you have a professional on the hook. This isn’t the time for DIY legal research (sorry if that sounds harsh). This is why solicitors study and train for so long.

This would be a deal breaker for me.

I have a RoW directly past my back door. I'm 99% certain the RoW hasn't taken 25% off the house value as nextdoor has the same issue and they have sold multiple times for broadly the same value as other properties locally.

Honestly, it's moderately irritating and I'd prefer my property didn't have it. But when I bought I could either afford a house with compromises (main road, RoW, garden needed a load of work) or I could have afforded a flat.

Now I can afford a much fancier house, it doesn't even register on the reasons I might like to move. Overall I don't want to move even though I could afford it.

No I wouldn't. It could be a right pain in the arse. The fact the sellers' solicitors aren't responding to questions about it is suspicious too.
I just wouldn't want people traipsing past my windows whenever they felt like - which they could do. Even if the current neighbours are ok you could get some right arseholes in, using it all the time (which is of course their right) and causing problems.

Thanks, I will ask them to give us some further guidance. The register refers to a Transfer which is where the ROW wording comes from, but the seller’s solicitors say that they don’t have a copy of the Transfer.

Why would you even consider this house when 99.9% of houses do not have a Right of Way?
Forget about it and buy somewhere else.
You are just buying a major problem.

Really? That’s interesting. How it normally works is that the transfer would be filed under the title so your solicitor could apply for a copy from the Land Registry. Some of the conveyancing factories might not bother but they should do. Don’t let them fob you off.

If the transfer is not available then the entry on the register is all they have to go on, and your solicitor should advise accordingly. Have you instructed a good firm of solicitors who come with a recommendation? If not, then you should do. It’s a real concern and presuming your house will cost at a minimum £200k (and probably a lot more) I wouldn’t consider proceeding without good legal advice. And you may still need to pull out.