Brother living in inherited house, banning sibling from visiting, probate

[GudrunM]

Hi...

My father died last year, left his house (no mortgage) equally between his 3 offspring , with my sister 53 and brother 42 as executors. My brother has never left the family home, and has I think only worked maybe 3 years in his life, when he was around 20...has never studied, volunteered or travelled. Not sure what he does with his life actually... nothing criminal, not an alcoholic, etc....just a bit of a loner. He also was not my Dad´s carer as my Dad was very healthy and able up until his death.

Thing is, my Dad left a little note, signed by himself ( not as part of his will) stating that my brother can ´stay in the house, rent free, only paying household bills, for as long as he wants´!!

My sister & I are pretty sure throughout his life, he barely contributed anything for rent to my Dad, or to cover bills...so of course he is taking full advantage of this continued rent free situation ( lovely, 3 bed semi, with a garage and garden) , and banned us from the home since 3 weeks after the funeral. He calls it ´his home!´

A solicitor has already said the note is not legally valid, but my sister and I decided to honour Dad´s wishes for a ´while´, ideally 1 year, to give our brother time to find his direction & find his own , 1st home, something not so difficult, as we are set to inherit around 100 thousand each from Dad´s house.

He also started a legal case against my sister, stating he cannot complete probate, as she lied about not owing Dad any money. (not true) The brother has spent almost 1 year now, searching around Dad´s rather muddled financial receipts, looking for any scrap of paper that may suggest any loans took place, even going back to 2004!.... He seems to hold some kind of vendetta against my sister, as she often tried to gently bring up when visiting, his lack of ambition, travel, work, even volunteering....and also not paying rent.

The younger brother states that attempting to visit him , in his home would be seen as ´harrassment & intimidation`!!

I can honestly say that Dad would be weeping, to see how things are, not even 1 year after his passing!

My sister has a husband , both working full time, and 2 children, just starting Uni.

I live in a small, rented place, have always worked too, often 2 jobs, and travel a lot.

For us both, this amount of money could make a massive difference in our lives, but we are equally frustrated and at a loss of what to do, without destroying what relationship we may have still, or being seen as vultures.

Plus, I don´t know how he handles real life, and stress, etc...but he seems to be happily prolonging everything for the sake of it, with the solicitor case against my sister, etc.

The main and deeply upsetting thing is what my brother has become....and that we can´t visit my late Dad´s home, for memories and to handle our grieving processes...
When I write sweetly to him, or send gifts, he mainly just ignores me.
Does anyone have any ideas how to progress? Thanks!!!!

You need to complete probate and you are legally bound to abide by the terms of the will. Your brother can throw a tantrum but that's the law and you father split the house between the three of you. If he wanted your brother to stay in it, he would have done a lifetime interest in the property. As it stands, that note he wrote as has no legal power and he could have been forced to write it by his son (no witnesses, after all).

Bottom line; arrange for the house to be sold. You may have to evict your brother if he won't co operate.

It is not really about you though is it, What about your sister and her family? As you have already said she could really do with the money. If I were you I would just consult a solicitor get probate and sell the house. Your brother is taking you both for fools. Just get on with it and let your brother sort himself out, he is a grown man, stop pussy footing round him.

Oh God yeah , I know.....I´m very close to my sister & her family, I´m not making it just about me, I hope it doesn´t look that that. Thanks so much for your advice cruisecrazy

As PP stated, gifting your share is against the rules. You do need it. Why would you think you don't? The government is currently paying towards your expenses and it needn't do that, because you have assets (this property). In benefit terms, property you don't live in is counted the same as cash in the bank. If you give away your assets, your benefit claim will be treated as if you still have those assets. So you'll lose your benefits and won't have your share of the house either. If you don't disclose inheriting the share of house, that's fraud.

I don't think you can gift your share like this, not so simply anyway.

Just as a matter of interest, if OP's dad had left the house to his three children, but granted lifetime use of it to her DB in his will, would that affect OP's entitlement to benefits etc differently?
(I do know that's not the case here, but just wondering...)

I think when people have kids with special needs or vulnerabilities they do need to be very careful about wills and what they will mean for the family. You often hear of sad stories where things worked out in a way the parent or family never wished, all because of legalities. Not saying at all that this is the case here - I've no idea if DB has any vulnerabilities - but just a general comment because there's some suggestion he might do. I have a DS who has autism (Aspergers) so have looked into this area and it is complex and parents need specialist advice when making wills. (I'm not rich or anything, this is relevant to ordinary families.)

Thank you...just to make things clear, I have no intention of claiming benefits, unless I absolutely have to....illness, etc. I have always, always worked. My main reason for ´gifting´ my share would be to keep me on the housing association waiting list for low income/ key workers.

I know what you mean too, about vulnerable family members....but don´t you think in this day and age, we should know...? Is there really such a shameful feeling around mental health , etc ? And as his siblings, shouldn´t our Dad have given reasons for allowing our brother to live in the house, probably forever?? And....sorry, last point....if it is so important, it really should´ve been first and foremost in Dad´s will, not a casually scribbled afterthought.
I´m totally not looking for ways round this, to twist Dad´s meaning....I´m gradually coming round to the fact that it´s what Dad wanted, so I won´t fight it. I do wish my brother hadn´t started this legal fight, I wish he hadn´t banned us from Dad´s house, including collecting the bits and bobs that we still have there probably from our long past student days when we had no storage! That´s what parents do, right!
We can´t sit in our Dad´s garden in the summer for the last time, I can´t see where he went to sleep, where he woke up each morning, and what he saw when he opened his curtains....I can´t take flowers and feed his beloved visiting birds in his lovely garden, and gotta admit...this makes me bloody angry, not just sad but angry!
I wish his youngest son, whatever disability he may or may not have, would be grateful for what his Dad has given him....above all, health, and his life!
I´m going to leave things....I have my memories and my own family to look after.
Thanks so much all of you, for your support, love and advice! xxxx

I'm not surprised that your brother is hostile towards you when you are trying to go against your father's wishes that your brother remain in the house rent free. That was seemingly acceptable to your father when he was alive and it was his wish after his death too.

Yes, you have a one-third share in the house but you need to look at it as something for the future, maybe to pass on to your DC, rather than an immediate entitlement. It may seem unfair to you but it was what your father wanted. End off...

You are NOT honouring your father's wishes by expecting your brother to leave his home after a year.

thanks for writing, but you may care to skim through my whole message, and not just assume I´m looking to throw him on the streets tomorrow. The main problem I have is that he has banned us from visiting our Dad´s home, and that he started a falsified legal case against my sister, and had fed numerous lies to his solicitor....that´s what I´m actually writing and asking for advice about....but hey, it´s Sunday! Nobody has time to read past the first line on the weekend, but thanks for your sweet advice.

You and your sister absolutely have a right to go the house that you co-own and grieve your DF. Go together and stand up against your bullying brother. Instruct decent solicitors and get a fair settlement as soon as possible. Do not let your brother dictate. It is two of you in the majority so you should be successful.

I did read the whole thread thanks. Your own words....

Thing is, my Dad left a little note, signed by himself ( not as part of his will) stating that my brother can ´stay in the house, rent free, only paying household bills, for as long as he wants´!!

...my sister and I decided to honour Dad´s wishes for a ´while´, ideally 1 year...

That's not honouring your father's wishes. He wanted your brother to stay as long as he likes.

Nor is:

If so, should I just take a lawyer myself....to take him off duty as executor, to pass probate, and to rule that the house is sold?

Thing is, he´s smacked himself in the face....before the legal case and denying us visits or keys to Dad´s house, we were happy to give him more time in the house, more time to sort himself out, even 3 or 4 years.....but now, obviously my sister wants to sell the house immediately. he brought it on himself right?

Also not honouring you father's wishes.

You seem to,want to teach your brother a lesson. Who are you to say he should "man up".

I didn´t say I SHOULD take a lawyer, I said I know I could, and that was part of explaining that it wasn´t the reason I was asking for advice....
Ok, got you. Thanks again for the advice.... as you may have read later in the discussions, after the kind advice of many on here, I wrote that I will just leave things, and get on with my life...no legal cases, no lawyers, just accept that there are things between my brother and our Dad that are none of our business, I guess, and there are reasons that he wanted my brother to stay in the house rent free, forever quite possibly. OK...that´s how it is.
You´re right.
Don´t judge me too harshly....I´m also grieving, whilst trying to look after my own family.
Stress coupled with grief affects people in different ways....that´s why we need advice. I don´t always play things right, I don´t know what to do sometimes....

I think you may also want to consider that what your Dad wrote in the note was not the best long-term plan for your brother. You’ll probably be able to figure out over time if him living there alone is really sustainable or he would be better off in a smaller place.

Thank you.....I think it´s pretty clear now that it´s not the best long term....I think he would be much better off, with a fresh start, a smaller place, finding his own feet, finding his direction, starting this new, maybe scary, but exciting chapter of his independent life.
In the past few months, my sister and I, well before all this legal trouble was started by him...we offered all amount of help, not condescending, but real help....now my sister doesn´t want to contact him at all, she fears he will report her , she has constant headaches and stomach pains and is trying to distant herself and her family from the whole stressful, upsetting situation as much as possible.
So, I guess this is how it ends....I don´t have the strength or time to baby him. I care deeply about him and wish him nothing but health and happiness.
I myself am waiting on results of a recent biopsy, I don´t need the extra stress in my life.
I hope he´s happy in his hoarded shrine....yes, he´s a dreadful hoarder, doesn´t open the windows, and is messy as f*.
I´ve told him repeatedly to phone me anytime day or night, he can just turn up to my door day or night....apart from that, I´m stepping away.
I can remember my Dad in my own way....I will go to my Dad´s graveside alone, or just with my husband, go out for dinner, buy flowers, stay in a hotel, then fly back home the next day.
Sadly how it will be now.
I have 2 kids, I can´t take on another....they always want more pocket money....but not quite as greedy as their Uncle!!!!

I’m so sorry you have so much going on right now. I think you are making the right decision for today and if needed you can switch course at any time.

Take care of yourself

Hi, Any updates on what happened? I have similar issues and will post for some advice soon. Thanks.

Haven’t read all the posts but we had a similar experience with a brother who refused to leave after a 6 month period stated in the will. It cost us over £30k
in solicitor fees and was settled by mediation in the end. I would say come to an arrangement between yourselves. Our brother bought us out in the end at a considerable discount after getting a mortgage and he hadn’t worked in over 10 years but our house was considerably cheaper. There are no winners apart from the solicitors!!

Best to get solicitor involved looks like your brother thinks he is entitled. Probably got your father to write that note at a weak moment. If he wants to stay at the house then he should buy it. Otherwise get the court to evict him and proced with the sale. You don't have a relationship with him now so nothing to salvage. My sisters have not spoken to me or my brother for3 years because we would not sell the house to my nephew for £43k less than market value. Basically asking us to finance our nephew to the tune of £8750.0 each (£35k)! My brother and I have children of our own who we would rather finance. You have to get tough. This is about what your father put on his will and you should obey his wishes.

Edit: THIS IS AN OLD THREAD

Unfortunately whenever there is money involved the vultures come out 💰, and the Monster raise their ugly heads.

Remember, we own NOTHING! Absolutely NOTHING! All us us are merely custodians of the homes, car, money, clothes, jewelry, etc., that we have - because we can NEVER EVER take it with us when our time comes.

We came into the world without a suitcase - and we leave without one. So why argue over material things?

Finally, your father made his wishes know, so stop being resentful and thinking of lining your own pockets - instead, RESPECT your late Father's final wishes. 🙏

If your father wanted your brother to have another home he would have instructed so in his will. He wants your brother to keep his home.

I feel for you, we are expecting similar when DFIL passes as he has told DH that: DH is the only executor, and the house is to be split equally between DH and DSIL, who has lived there rent-free with her husband and kids for twenty years now (DFIL lives with his second wife, who is getting the rest of the estate). SIL has made it clear already that she is going to be an absolute nightmare to deal with unless we just hand over the house to her - she is a difficult person now.

No advice for you, but I don’t think there is any way of proceeding which doesn’t torpedo your relationship with your DBro. Even if you hand him the house you aren’t going to have a lovely close relationship with him because you’ll be so resentful.

I know this is an old thread but for the people who have since messaged with similar issues, the problem is that usually in these situations if it is legally written into the will that a relative has the right to live in a property as long as they wish then it is usual to add in said will that they are responsible for all bills and maintenance. (I've been in this situation with my dad's will) if not done legally then in theory the people named in the will as beneficiaries to own the property are responsible for maintenance issues, so anything major goes wrong with the property they could be held responsible to pay for it. Could be a mightmare in the ops situation 😬

@Mossstitch surely then the leech family member would be equally responsible?