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Original poster

School distances

33 replies

bellamountain · 16/04/2023 22:58

Looking ahead to secondary school places in the next few years and the secondary closest to us is currently Ofsted 'requires improvement'. For as long as I've known it, it's never been a 'good' school and was inadequate for a long time. However, it is under a new SLT team, is due an updated Ofsted any time now and is quite a small school where the teachers know all the pupils. A bit further on, is the 'good' school which has always been either outstanding or good. It's recently been redeveloped and the facilities are excellent. Most of the children from my DDs primary go onto this school. The reviews are always very good and it would be my first choice for sure.

Where we live, however, we are just on the outskirts of town and in most years would have got into the good school on distance. However, due to new housing developments in the area, that distance is closing up. This year, on allocation day, we were just 100m in and they are still building new houses closer to the good school.

So, do we stay in a house we love with a decent garden, garage and driveway (overlooking a lake and woodland). It's ex council but non estate and a real mix of homes along our road from Victorian cottages to newer 1960s homes. Or, move closer to the good school to ensure our children have the best school opportunity? Although, we could make that move, end up with a bigger mortgage on a house we don't love and find we could have actually got in at our old address. We'd definitely sacrifice something by moving closer to the good school. Our view definitely being one but likely also potentially decent parking and garden. We are currently not overlooked.

Has anyone else been in a similar situation? What did you do?

OP posts:
Original poster
bellamountain · 16/04/2023 23:01

Just to add we are looking at an extra 150k + to move closer on a very sideways and potentially downwards move.

OP posts:
MoHunter · 16/04/2023 23:19

This may not be feasible but could you temporarily rent out your house, rent a smaller home close to good school, then once child gets a place move back into your house after a year or so?

gkd1234 · 16/04/2023 23:23

MoHunter · 16/04/2023 23:19

This may not be feasible but could you temporarily rent out your house, rent a smaller home close to good school, then once child gets a place move back into your house after a year or so?

This has a name; it's called "fraud".

If the council find out what you're up to they may well take the place away and give it to someone on the waiting list.

MoHunter · 16/04/2023 23:25

Is it though? I know of people who've done this. Not something I've done or looked into myself.

gkd1234 · 16/04/2023 23:49

MoHunter · 16/04/2023 23:25

Is it though? I know of people who've done this. Not something I've done or looked into myself.

Yes! Most councils will take a very dim view.

As a parent, if my child or a friend's got "cheated" out of a school place by someone playing this game, I wouldn't hesitate to report either!

NicLondon1 · 17/04/2023 00:08

How old is your child? If they are close to Secondary age I think it is unlikely that a lot of similar-aged children will suddenly move into the new housing. But if they are a decade away it could happen…

Pundrop · 17/04/2023 00:09

I'd move. But would wait until Year 5 and see how the nearest secondary is doing, how the other school is doing, and keep an eye on last distance offered. It might be worth considering moving back, once the youngest is in? Although it will cost a lot in moving costs etc but worth it in my view.

CellophaneFlower · 17/04/2023 06:52

It does sound like your favoured school is lovely, with good facilities so might not be applicable to you, but I'd never base my choice on ofsted alone. It's a pile of poo imo, it doesn't give a fair, balanced view of the school at all.

I use the gov.uk website to compare schools. Due to covid, there hasn't been full results since 2019, but there are partial ones from last year and I assume it will be back to normal going forward. You can compare schools based on GCSE results and progress etc. It gives a much clearer idea of how the students are doing than a snapshot of how well the school performs during a pre-arranged visit does.

Bear2014 · 17/04/2023 09:37

We are listing our house this week with a view to moving into a better secondary catchment. I guess there is a reason the houses are more expensive - because people prioritise good schools.

Re renting your house out and renting near the school. It's obviously an unethical thing to do, but it's also being prevented in our area now. The admissions criteria say if you own a house further from the school that you have lived in less than 3 years ago, they count this as your address for admissions. So if you're going to play the renting game, you need to do it for 3 years!

fUNNYfACE36 · 17/04/2023 09:49

MoHunter · 16/04/2023 23:25

Is it though? I know of people who've done this. Not something I've done or looked into myself.

We did this but with the intention of , and did eventually mo v e into catchment. You do need to properly move in though, not just rent it and pretend you are living there

fUNNYfACE36 · 17/04/2023 09:52

Bear2014 · 17/04/2023 09:37

We are listing our house this week with a view to moving into a better secondary catchment. I guess there is a reason the houses are more expensive - because people prioritise good schools.

Re renting your house out and renting near the school. It's obviously an unethical thing to do, but it's also being prevented in our area now. The admissions criteria say if you own a house further from the school that you have lived in less than 3 years ago, they count this as your address for admissions. So if you're going to play the renting game, you need to do it for 3 years!

I think this has been challenged though and not held up in court.Parents split up, have to move quickly for jobs and other valid reasons.

Lcb123 · 17/04/2023 09:53

I’d stay, If you have money available you can pay for tutors etc. the school should hopefully improve, I personally think Ofsted is mostly a load of rubbish. Your childs outcome in life is so much more than their school.

Grimbelina · 17/04/2023 09:55

If Labour get in (highly likely) and bring in the changes with private schools, be prepared for catchment areas to shrink again (and in some places dramatically). To rent closer to the school you really need a legitimate reason, like building work which makes your house uninhabitable for a period or, as a PP says, it is fraud. I know of a couple of families who suddenly had a loft conversion/extension around the time they applied for secondary....

StillWantingADog · 17/04/2023 10:03

Our secondary was failing miserably, then got taken over by an academy, got a new slt and 4 years on has a massively improved reputation and everyone wants to go there. This could happen to your closest school and it could also end up attracting kids from the other school making it easier for you to get into that one if it’s your preference. Schools round here seems to be either improving or worsening- it goes in cycles

it’s a tricky one though with no clear answer. I think it’s appalling that people have to consider spending hundreds of thousands to move house not because they want to but just to get their kids into the better school.

RidingMyBike · 17/04/2023 10:06

How many years to go until secondary? Is that enough time for enough houses to be built housing kids of the right age to make a difference?

Also, how much do you know about the two schools? We found reputations last for years and may not reflect the current situation, especially if changes are being made within the school. When were the OFSTED inspections? Can you go to open days at both just to see? This happened with a local primary which had a terrible reputation when we moved to the area and people were actively looking elsewhere. We'd have got a place there no problem when we moved. Ten years later it had been rated good by OFSTED and the local private school was struggling to recruit as the families who would have sent kids there to avoid Terrible Primary were now raving about Now Great Primary! This meant the catchment area had shrunk dramatically and we couldn't get a place.

Also worth talking in-depth to locals about why they think such and such about the school. I found other mums thought a different local school was fantastic which I'd thought was awful when we looked round it - turned out they thought different things were important.

Allicando · 17/04/2023 10:41

Just keep in mind that Ofsted reports change. Mine went to an oversubscribed secondary that was 'outstanding' and dropped to 'requires improvement' whilst they were there. It did not alter their path one bit and both did well at the school.

Piscesmumma1978 · 17/04/2023 10:53

Our school has just had an awful Ofsted and is under a special team to sort it out. It's definitely changed the school in a short space of time.

Schools change all the time. You only need a bad head and the school will suffer.

I wouldn't move for a school. Especially if you love your house. They're only there for 5 years but you'll be stuck in a house you might not love x

justanotherdrama · 17/04/2023 11:10

MoHunter · 16/04/2023 23:19

This may not be feasible but could you temporarily rent out your house, rent a smaller home close to good school, then once child gets a place move back into your house after a year or so?

They're hot on that round here and ask for supporting evidence of tenancy agreements and mortgage statements and council tax bill history!!!

It's risky!!!

PuttingDownRoots · 17/04/2023 11:13

Remember birth rates have decreased... 2010/2011 was extremely high. So even with more houses, there may be less pressure.

Reugny · 17/04/2023 12:53

MoHunter · 16/04/2023 23:19

This may not be feasible but could you temporarily rent out your house, rent a smaller home close to good school, then once child gets a place move back into your house after a year or so?

If the OP wants to go down that route "temporarily" would be around two years minimum to not get done for fraud.

steppemum · 17/04/2023 13:03

NicLondon1 · 17/04/2023 00:08

How old is your child? If they are close to Secondary age I think it is unlikely that a lot of similar-aged children will suddenly move into the new housing. But if they are a decade away it could happen…

this is a good point.
I know that new estates are a headache for primary schools, but it takes longer for the wave of new families to get to secondary.

You also may find that if you just miss out on a place, that you would get in on appeal or waiting list.

steppemum · 17/04/2023 13:06

as others have said, don't base it all on Ofsted.

If the SLT have been changed then they have probably helicoptered in a shit hot head. You may find that that school ends up being better for your child than the other one.

Africa2go · 17/04/2023 14:22

I think the biggest factor in school performance is generally the demographic of the children attending it. If the school has always been good then thats unliikley to change in a couple of years. I would go off reputation rather than Ofsted. I would move for a good secondary school - I don't see it as just 5 years as a pp says - its 7 years for a start and the results they get at secondary school will make a massive difference to the choices they have at 18. I wouldn't risk staying in your current house with shrinking allocation distance just on the off chance you'll get in.

steppemum · 17/04/2023 14:58

Africa2go · 17/04/2023 14:22

I think the biggest factor in school performance is generally the demographic of the children attending it. If the school has always been good then thats unliikley to change in a couple of years. I would go off reputation rather than Ofsted. I would move for a good secondary school - I don't see it as just 5 years as a pp says - its 7 years for a start and the results they get at secondary school will make a massive difference to the choices they have at 18. I wouldn't risk staying in your current house with shrinking allocation distance just on the off chance you'll get in.

I think there is a lot of truth in this.

We bypassed all our closest schools for this reason, because of the demographics.
A mix of behaviour problems and also lack of parental support and aspiration.

In basic terms, if your child is the only one who is made to do their homework, and who wants to go to uni, it is going to be much harder for them.
And that is really hard for teachers/head to change.

SpringBunnies · 17/04/2023 15:08

I wouldn't move because someone already pointed out about the birth rate decline. The current year 6 will be the last big cohort. I'll sit tight and wait. Also, google for your local education authority's school place plan for 2023-2027. I believe they need to have a 5 year plan and you can see the trends they have predicted for each area for up to 2027.

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