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Original poster

So fed up of the planning system in this country .

40 replies

hattie43 · 23/02/2023 17:08

We are supposed to be getting this economy off its knees and yet even
sound proposals are declined just because they aren't in ' planning policy ',
Permission granted for a mahoosive mobile home / log cabin but not allowed to convert existing unused single story barn not in use . The end result would still be a wood clad residential unit and a tidier plot .
Makes no sense . Sorry rant over .

OP posts:
SirChenjins · 23/02/2023 17:11

What was the reason for the refusal? There are usually grounds for something not being in 'planning policy'.

WhenisitmyturntobePM · 23/02/2023 17:20

Our architect and planning authority got in a tussle because the architect said we needed an upstairs window as a fire escape and the planners said we weren’t allowed one. It was literally building regs!

The planners eventually got over their huff enough to approve a small window, plonked randomly in the middle of a massive wall, with privacy glass installed. It was going to look so shit we didn’t bother and sold the house, completely uprooting our lives. You have my sympathies OP, some planners are jobsworth twats.

HeddaGarbled · 23/02/2023 17:24

some planners are jobsworth twats

Translation = they wouldn’t let me do whatever I wanted.

WhenisitmyturntobePM · 23/02/2023 17:28

@HeddaGarbled All we wanted was a window so we didn’t die in a fire. House wasn’t listed, no objections from anyone in the community over the planning application. Having the window was literally to comply with the law.

Original poster
hattie43 · 23/02/2023 17:44

SirChenjins · 23/02/2023 17:11

What was the reason for the refusal? There are usually grounds for something not being in 'planning policy'.

The barn was equestrian not agricultural and something to do with it being on a concrete pad giving an element of permanency whereas a cabin / mobile is 'moveable' . Just how moveable do they think a 60 x 23 actually is fgs.
Well sorry builders , consultants, architects I can't put money into your business because council , they say no.

OP posts:
Eatyourfoodtina · 23/02/2023 17:51

I work in architecture and frequently come across this.

In some areas if the land has been in use as agricultural (including just a grazing horse) then it can't be built on.

Their justification is that if they allow one person to build a permanent structure on agricultural land (that's currently in use) then all the other fields will get built on too. They want to protect the countryside.

And also bats and birds and biodiversity net gains / losses.

If you own the land and want to build on it in the future - the land has to be unused (no horses) for a good few years.

(Obviously area dependent!)

Rollercoaster1920 · 23/02/2023 17:53

Whilst on the other hand some awful buildings are approved, and permitted development can lead to really ugly and privacy-invading extensions.

Plus the planning approval system doesn't take into account building regs, or consideration as to whether the thing can be actually built (covenants, build over agreements, party wall agreements, dropped curb approval etc) so is not an integrated system.

Eatyourfoodtina · 23/02/2023 17:54

I'm slept deprived with a newborn and I feel like I just went on a tangent there. I'm so sorry!

Anyway, point is - yarp planners can be fussy gits.

I once witnessed a fight between a planner and an architect!!

Seeline · 23/02/2023 18:05

In theory any disused building in the countryside should be able to be converted into a dwelling - I assume it was a residential use you were after? As long as the building is of a permanent and sound construction.

Mobile homes usually come under the definition of a caravan and are treated differently.

GoodChat · 23/02/2023 18:15

Presumably the plans for the cabin and the barn are entirely different and completely incomparable?

JellyMouse · 23/02/2023 18:39

I always think that the houses that were built before planning permission was a thing are generally much better than what they allow now. Because people, when left to their own devices want the best possible look and layout. I’m in the process of buying and cannot believe that permission was granted for some of the newer builds, tiny rooms, massive overlooking issues, extremely unattractive. There are so many rules and regulations but it is producing low quality stock. My favourite houses are early 1900s.

tangerinedays · 23/02/2023 18:44

Oh my god, ours is such a shitshow. We're six months into an application, they've just slapped a completely inappropriate s.106 on it, and now they're saying they have "capacity issues" in their legal team, so no one can actually sign it off. There's meant to be three people on one of the teams I'm dealing with, there's one part-timer who's clearly on the verge of a breakdown. They stopped giving any pre app advice at all months ago, which is causing its own chaos (not with us thank god). It's totally and absolutely dysfunctional. They've completely misunderstood their own policies on several occasions. It's INSANE. I can't believe anything gets built around here at all.

Runningoutofnameideasagain · 23/02/2023 18:58

I could have written this myself! Exactly the same issue - ugly mobile home in the beautiful garden is preferred by planning to the conversion of an existing steel frame and asbestos ugly barn!

Eatyourfoodtina · 23/02/2023 19:46

Did it get refused because of access? Usually Class Qs are quite easy to get approved! Access, drainage, bats and birds are usually the issues.

Class Rs are more complex x

Original poster
hattie43 · 23/02/2023 20:19

Eatyourfoodtina · 23/02/2023 19:46

Did it get refused because of access? Usually Class Qs are quite easy to get approved! Access, drainage, bats and birds are usually the issues.

Class Rs are more complex x

No problems re access . Absolutely nothing is changing except the wish to move a god ugly mobile home off the land and instead of bringing a replacement humongous cabin onto the land to join a barn and stables which will dilapidate through not being used I can't get rid of it all and just do a smart conversion of the barn . Makes no bloody sense at all .

OP posts:
Seeline · 23/02/2023 20:27

Eatyourfoodtina · 23/02/2023 19:46

Did it get refused because of access? Usually Class Qs are quite easy to get approved! Access, drainage, bats and birds are usually the issues.

Class Rs are more complex x

Class Q is for agricultural buildings. OP said her barn was equestrian so no permitted development. Full PP required.
OP - did you make a full planning application?

Original poster
hattie43 · 23/02/2023 20:34

@Seeline

No a pre planning advice thing .

OP posts:
Seeline · 23/02/2023 22:18

Oh - so you haven't actually submitted an application?!

Original poster
hattie43 · 24/02/2023 05:56

My planning consultant said to do the pre planning advice to guage if it's worth going to a full application ( spending thousands to do do ).
If the council were positive to the proposal all good but they weren't .

OP posts:
Calling · 24/02/2023 06:56

JellyMouse · 23/02/2023 18:39

I always think that the houses that were built before planning permission was a thing are generally much better than what they allow now. Because people, when left to their own devices want the best possible look and layout. I’m in the process of buying and cannot believe that permission was granted for some of the newer builds, tiny rooms, massive overlooking issues, extremely unattractive. There are so many rules and regulations but it is producing low quality stock. My favourite houses are early 1900s.

Agreed. The builders and architects of the past were taught thiroughly and given the tools for good design and studied the designs of the past. Today, this is far less so.

Calling · 24/02/2023 06:57

*thoroughly

PersonaNonGarter · 24/02/2023 07:01

We’re watching Clarksons Farm and the planning is awful. Really selfish. NIMBYs have truly strangled things. i have no faith that planners and councils are genuinely motivated to improve things. They want people to pay them money to keep everything the same.

DazzlePaintedBattlePants · 24/02/2023 07:09

I have sympathy for planners who have to work in the system they are given.

I would happily throw all NIMBYs under a bus who are a pox on this land. A village in our county is losing its primary school as there are insufficient numbers of children, because they’ve refused to build any kind of housing there for years. Bus services are being cut because of no demand. And yet the NIMBYs keep on ranting….Most of them are now at an age where they need buses and carers and the penny still hasn’t dropped…

JesusMaryAndJosephAndTheWeeDon · 24/02/2023 07:50

Meanwhile big developers are allowed to do whatever the fuck they like.

They get planning on the basis of all manner of promises and guarantees then totally fail to deliver on them and the council just roll over and let them.

Literally every week I get notification of yet another modification to the arboricultural plans and tree preservation orders. They are waved through despite objections.

IsAGirlMumma · 24/02/2023 11:55

Totally agree.

Example..Can convert loft and add dormer to existing roof of house. Under permitted development.

Needed new roof structure to supply dormer.

As the roof is now not the original roof. Now we need planning permission to add a dormer and convert loft.

Madness.