I'm still b***dy leaking!

[Methwell]

So water is STILL coming in over my back door, a year later. We've had a new extension roof, new flashing, the chimney re-pointed and new bellcast. No slipped tiles, no damage to existing tiles. Solid granite walls, no cavity wall. Bathroom windowsill and gaps around window filled. Gaps around where the TV aerial goes in filled. I've had three builders look at it, they've all twiddled a bit with it, it's still coming in. (Also two roofers have had a look!)

This is the patch on the wall where you can HEAR it coming in, when it's raining very hard and the wind's in a certain quarter - the render is damaged. I have actually stood listening in my dining room underneath here and LISTENED to it running in over my head, down the battens, out over the door. Builders are not having it.

I can't get the plasterboard over the door replaced until it's watertight. I'm at my wits' end now, everything that the builders have suggested, has been done or replaced.

Probably not helpful but at this point I would get the sledgehammer out and investigate myself, find out exactly where it is coming from and just rebuild that section.

It's tempting, the only thing is I can't reach that bit of wall - it's over the extension roof so it's a scaffold job!

Depends on the positioning, but as you mentioned it was over the back door, I wonder whether something like this would help in the interim...

timber door canopy

Sadly not, it's coming in on the inside :-(

this is all about detective work to find out where the leak comes from.

can you do tests with a hose? on a dry day, person 1 has a hose on 'jet' mode and sprays water at different bits of roof. person 2 stands inside to listen for when it comes in.

If you can reproduce the issue with a hose, then you can get a builder to really investigate.

So.
Nothing came in overnight (southerly wind) but changed to a westerly direction and a bit came in.
This is a slightly odd angle as there isn't enough room in my back garden to get the right angle - it looks as if the flashing is missing at the bottom of the right hand side, but it isn't - it's just taken from the left.
It looks from here as if something's coming in around the base of the chimney and thus down the back of the chimney breast area, but no damage to the render or flashing that I can see.

The REALLY weird thing is that the roofspace is as dry as a bone. (Because of the missing plasterboard I can get my hand up inside!) There's a sheet of cardboard that I've tucked into the hole to mitigate draughts and that's dry, and a puppy pad wrapped around that to catch any drips which is damp. Battens are dry, insulation is dry. Plasterboard is slightly damp but not soaked, and only at the edge.

How can it be dry in there????

We had our chimney removed in the end to fix a similar problem. We did eventually find where it was coming in and have the chimney flashing repaired but basically the repair was coming undone every summer heatwave (adhesive just melted) and we were then discovering it leaking again each winter.

I'd prefer not to do that @deplorabelle as there's a working wood burner at the bottom of it!
Just to add - since I can't edit - the photo was taken after a heavy shower and the discolouration at the top of the wall isn't usually visible. That's why I wondered if it was getting in there.

For the amount that's getting in, I would be more inclined to get the plasterboard replaced and just never look up there again....

Is the chimney directly above the door? Could rain be coming down the actual chimney?

The render doesn't look in very good condition on the photo? Have you had anyone to look at that in case water is getting in there?

Yes - which would make sense - but then how the mary ellen is it getting into the roofspace?!
It's not getting into the chimney liner, or it would be /in/ the woodburner (if that makes sense) and we'd see it when we lit the fire.

Could it getting in around the chimney liner?

And @bilbodog I've said to every single one of the builders (four of them) who've been out, could it be getting through the damaged render?
And to the last man they have said nope, definitely not that.
That's what I think it is, but none of them are having it, so none of them will do the work.

We had an issue like this while we were building and tried so many things to try to stop it.

We had our roof on but hadnt had the house plastered yet. Without the plaster it still should have been watertight.

I cant remember the technical term but we found that the water was coming in the wall, going down, hitting the DPC within the wall, then instead of going back out, it was rising, travelling to the other side of the wall and dripping inside.
We did take out some of the blockwork and could then see this happening.

In the end we put DPC across the whole external wall. This stopped that strong wind driving in the rain. The issue was then resolved.

I know you said above that numberous builders have told you it cant be coming through the render but I had a quick look on google and it says it can come through damaged render, so I dont think its impossible.

You have my sympathies because I know it feels like torture trying to figure out the cause.

@pigletjohn

piglet john needs to come on and have a look.

Part of me thinks that if I was a big butch hairy MAN they might pay me some heed mind!
With my detective head on, I'm wondering if I've got it arse-about-face, and the issue isn't the water coming through the render but rather the wall being damaged by a leaking chimney, and so the patchy render is a symptom rather than a cause.
You can actually hear water running in, in the chimney space behind you, under the right (wrong) conditions. What I /don't/ know is whether damaged render would give access to the sort of amount of water ingress that you could hear like that.
Pretty sure it's not the brickwork/structure of the chimney that's compromised as we've had that refurbished about a year ago. Am also very sure nothing is coming in on the right hand side of the chimney in the pic, as it would be audible from our bedroom (ie literally over my head, so even if running out elsewhere I'd hear it)

Leadwork on the left hand side is possible, as I can't see it easily from the garden.

I think I see the problem. We had the chimney refurbished just over 18 months ago - am I right in thinking this is going to be an insurance job?

Plan a) approach the firm that did the work on the chimney and ask them to put it right at their own cost/using their insurance

Plan b) if plan a is unsuccessful, investigate using your home insurance

The render on the chimneystack does look particularly poor, as if the builder didn't have a trowel and put it on with a teaspoon. It also seems to be cracked already.

If a chimney is bad enough that pointing and flaunching will not put it right, it is better to demolish the top until you get to sound brickwork, then rebuild in durable brick. A good, experienced builder can do this with a small scaffold platform ( not off a ladder). Look at some samples of their work. They should be capable of fancy and beautiful detailing. A nicer job jn summer.

Leadwork flashing is now a specialised job. Older builders may still do it but don't be alarmed if they get a skilled person in for an hour or two.

I don't think your insurance will pay as it is (overdue) building maintenance.

P.s.

You have seen a sample of the work by the previous builder.

I see no evidence that they are capable of doing a competent job.

If a surgeon cut off my wrong leg, I wouldn't let him try his hand at heart surgery.

Thanks all.
This is the chap who did our roof, he told me the chimney needed doing while he was up there (this being last April - I have it all in writing) and gave me a list of what he was quoting to do. He came recommended by our next door neighbour as well, he'd worked on her roof!
I had to ask him to come back a couple of times and he's now stopped replying to my messages - I wasn't rude, I was just persistent: he's never given us a proper invoice and he had to come back twice to check why water was still getting in - so to be honest I don't think he would come back and put it right. I think I'd get excuse after excuse on why he couldn't, and promise after promise that he'd be there on Tuesday etc etc.

I am now thinking it's worth putting in an insurance claim though @PigletJohn because we were quoted for, and paid for, that maintenance work to be done!