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Original poster

Getting rid of builders

25 replies

Dumdidums · 16/04/2022 12:14

Hello i have asked some builders/landscapers to put a new patio/paving and some turf/grass in my back garden. I found the people on the checkatrade website and he texted me an estimate. The issue is that he has been twice this week and asked for a deposit on each time despite the fact that the estimate said payment was on completion. He also put a damp proof course around the back which i guess is nice but im not 100% sure this was needed and it wasnt part of the original work i requested. Theres definitely no damp in the house.
It seems that i will eventually end up paying him twice what was in the estimate which will not help my personal finances. He is due to come back next week but im having second thoughts about having him continue as i feel he is taking advantage of me and this is proving to be too expensive.

How can i break this to him, im worried that he may become violent or damage the property. I think legally there is no issue as what he is doing is not in line with the estimate he texted me so if he wants to take me to court this is fine. Im just worried about physical violence or him damaging the property. I just don't feel comfortable . Im assuming he has bought the new paving with the deposit i paid him

Any tips or advice please ?

OP posts:

Notmyyearthisyear · 16/04/2022 13:56

Payment and deposit are two different things really, it’s reasonable to ask for a deposit.
How detailed is the estimate he provided?
Next time you see him speak to him openly and tell him to confirm this is still the price, and make it clear that you cannot go above it so if there are any extra costs he needs to run them by you first.

VeniVidiWeeWee · 16/04/2022 21:47

Is it an estimate or a quotation? Two different things.

Original poster

Dumdidums · 17/04/2022 11:00

@Notmyyearthisyear

Payment and deposit are two different things really, it’s reasonable to ask for a deposit. How detailed is the estimate he provided? Next time you see him speak to him openly and tell him to confirm this is still the price, and make it clear that you cannot go above it so if there are any extra costs he needs to run them by you first.

Why is it reasonable to ask for a deposit when he specifically said that i wouldnt be required to pay anything until completion. The worry is him asking for more money everytime he comes as i just cant afford this.

The main issue is that the work is going to end up costing twice the estimate which i don't simply have the money for. If i had known the estimate was going to be so wrong then i wouldn't have agreed to continue with this .

OP posts:

PonyPatter44 · 17/04/2022 11:51

Has he actually done any work? Are you by any chance a woman living on your own, and he has guessed this? Unfortunately some builders are known to take advantage of older / vulnerable people, and keep stringing out the work and jacking up the prices. Do you have any other contact details beyond a mobile number for him?

Text him, tell him you just need the original work doing and no more. Do you have any large or stroppy friends who could be with you when he comes back?

Qwill · 17/04/2022 12:16

It’s common to pay a deposit/some money up front for materials. You need to ask for a quote and for them to detail what they are actually doing and the price against it, I.e. materials labour etc. I don’t think any of this seems out of order, they would use some sort of plastic membrane before the patio if they were doing it properly.

GeneLovesJezebel · 17/04/2022 12:17

If you don’t want him to finish the job say so, and come to an agreement on how much you’ll pay for what he’s done.

Qwill · 17/04/2022 12:17

Why do you think it’s going to cost more? Once you have the quote broken down, tell them anything extra needs to be agreed with you first. It ifs not in your quote you can’t be expected to pay.

Original poster

Dumdidums · 17/04/2022 16:09

He sent me a text message with the estimate , the amount i have paid him already is the equivalent of the estimate and he says that the work that needs doing will require the payment of the same amount in the estimate again. My issue is that i had budgeted based on the estimate and dont have the ability to magic up twice the amount in the estimate at such short notice.

I guess he should really send a written quote before anything further is done.

All they have done is to remove the old paving stones from the back garden but when i say remove they have basically put them in a hole in the part of the garden that will eventually have the grass/turf. So they are using the old paving stones as a foundation before they put top soil down . Im told by others that this isnt really optimal for growing plants and if they were contracted to remove the stones that means removing it from the property. They also put a damp course around the property which they only identified needed doing on the first day they came round to do the work. Again people are saying that they should have identified this on the day which they came round to do the quote not on word day 1
The other complication about cancelling this is that some of their tools are in the back garden eg spades wheelbarrow otherwise i would tell them not to come back via phone. If i do this then i guess they are going to insist on coming back to pick up their tools and this may cause a confrontation

OP posts:

Original poster

Dumdidums · 17/04/2022 16:28

@Qwill

again my point is that they didnt tell me this. All they said was that no payment is needed until i was happy with the work done. This was what the estimate said in writing therefore this is what i was working based on. I didnt expect to have to send them money on the day they actually arrived to do the work and then to be told that this isnt counting towards the work . There is definitely no plastic membrane anywhere yet

OP posts:

Original poster

Dumdidums · 17/04/2022 16:29

@Qwill

Why do you think it’s going to cost more? Once you have the quote broken down, tell them anything extra needs to be agreed with you first. It ifs not in your quote you can’t be expected to pay.

He verbally told me this and i dont have anything which says "quote" all i have is a text which says "estimate" but this is obviously not worth anything

OP posts:

Original poster

Dumdidums · 17/04/2022 16:31

@Notmyyearthisyear

Payment and deposit are two different things really, it’s reasonable to ask for a deposit. How detailed is the estimate he provided? Next time you see him speak to him openly and tell him to confirm this is still the price, and make it clear that you cannot go above it so if there are any extra costs he needs to run them by you first.

he was quite clear that what i paid him is not counting towards the final cost ie its not a deposit to be deducted from the final amount

OP posts:

drpet49 · 17/04/2022 16:31

Just pay him for work already done and get rid of him.

SierpinskiSquare · 17/04/2022 16:37

How much is this costing you? How much have you paid? Are we talking hundreds or thousands?
Have you got anyone who could help you? A helpful friend or neighbour?
Did you agree to a damp proof course? It sounds odd but it's not clear what you mean? If it was something needed and something you agreed to then it might not be that he is scamming you?
How are you paying him? Cash is the worst option.

Original poster

Dumdidums · 17/04/2022 18:19

Its cost thousands already, i have attached what they have done but im not sure this is a damp proof membrane as there are already holes in the wall which is where i assume damp proofing had previously been injected. I also need to say that my home is not damp internally. All they did was put new airbricks and the brown stuff which i assume is cement. I think they were saying that there was damp in the brickwork so they needed to coat it but as i say this was only pointed out when they came on day 1 of the work not on the day they came round to quote. They have also lifted all the old pavings stones .
Nobody i know lives locally but nobody i have spoken to is very supportive about the work that has been done to date. Payment has been by direct bank transfer

OP posts:

Undecicive · 17/04/2022 18:42

This sounds like scam to me. We had quotes foe small works like this before by (fairly) reliable tradesmen and never had to pay a deposit. I'd only pay a deposit for someone highly recommended, not a random I found on checkatrade where you can get neg reviews removed.

earsup · 17/04/2022 21:58

checkatrade....rubbish....get rid of him....if bricks need sealing....thomsons water seal...£25 for 5 litres....but not usually needed....sounds like he is making up jobs...pay him for bits done and be firm...get someone else in from others that have used good people.

decentchap · 17/04/2022 22:19

The answer for me would be ask a surveyor whether the extra DPC was necessary and call the builder round with him there.
There is simply no excuse for 2 X estimate but estimate is not a quotation. Quotation is contractually binding on him - estimate isnt. Nevertheless twice the estimate is trying it on. I would say you are having a surveyor round, you will pay what the surveyor agrees is appropriate for the necessary work up to this point but you want him to leave site immediately as your joint trust has evaporated.
Find a proper builder.
If you need cheap advice talk to someone at your local council building control - they can be very helpful especially for someone in your situation they would also confirm in writing if the job is too expensive.

Original poster

Dumdidums · 18/04/2022 11:59

I think i will have to phone them up tomorrow and tell them not to come back as its not a good sign that im worrying about it. Ive been told to just leave any of their equipment in the front garden so they can come pick it up. Im very nervous about doing this but i just feel like they are taking advantage of me. In addition as people are saying i still dont have a document that says "quote "

OP posts:

Original poster

Dumdidums · 19/04/2022 14:10

I called them up today and they said they will come round and finish the dpc on Thursday. I agreed so i just need to be firm and not allow them to do anything else or take any more money

OP posts:

WhereWasThatFrom · 19/04/2022 14:50

Take lots of photos just in case!

WhereWasThatFrom · 19/04/2022 14:51

Take lots of photos just in case!

JudgeRindersMinder · 19/04/2022 14:53

Oh jeez it’s a bit late now but never ever give the go ahead on an estimate! Get a quote and if they won’t give a quote get another builder

Original poster

Dumdidums · 19/04/2022 15:05

@JudgeRindersMinder

Oh jeez it’s a bit late now but never ever give the go ahead on an estimate! Get a quote and if they won’t give a quote get another builder

I think this i the major learning point. Im just hoping i dont get attacked on Thursday. The back garden will now be unusable so it needs fixing . I will insist on a quote

OP posts:

Original poster

Dumdidums · 24/04/2022 15:28

I asked them to stop doing work on Thursday and he wanted an extra £500 on top of the £3000 i gave him for the work already done as he said what i had paid didnt cover all his expenses. I paid this to his account and he gave me a bit of paper which said what he had done , what i had paid and the amount i need to pay later as i said that id get in touch with him in a few months when i have saved up more money. This is effectively the written quote and i dont understand why he didnt issue this before he started if he had this template pad for quotes
Anyway my back garden is basically now left in a horrendous mess. He also took away the steps so its a one foot drop from the house to the garden if you actually want to step into the garden
I will be insisting on a written quote next time 😔

OP posts:

BlueMongoose · 24/04/2022 20:56

Cost us a fair whack to get some old concrete wall foundations dug out and disposed of (which we found when we started digging for flower/friut beds). Slabs, bricks, rubble- none of that should be under a lawn or anywhere you want to grow things. We ask for quotes not estimates, and would always want disposal to be part of the price unless we had a use for the waste. One job we did we did have have a use for the tarmac we dug up, we broke it up small and used it to consolidate ground under foundations for a shed before we put a concrete raft down, for example. But growing areas, no.

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