Structural survey has destroyed my sale and my lovely house

[Rosser]

I live in a lovely mid terrace ex council house in a sought after area. I sold in jan to a FTB, I turned down higher bids as I thought a FTB would be quickest and we didn’t want to lose the house we were hoping to purchase. The FTB apparently lives on this road in rented and loves it and wants to stay here. It’s a long road 320 houses so I don’t know who it is. We were also FTB when we brought 12 years ago so it felt right.

We are only moving because my Mum is coming to live with us. It’s a lovely house but it has no room to extend.

FTB has had a full structural survey which brought back loads of issues but all are totally normal for one of these houses.

They boiler is 10 years old but has been serviced every year and is in good working order. But the engineer has suggested they might want to change it for longevity. Same with electrics, which we had partially rewired (to regs) and are totally fine.

Gaps in the loft party wall apparently make my roof liable to collapse. All of these terraces have the same gaps and it’s no job to brick them up if you wish.

We removed a wall to make a kitchen diner (with a structural engineer, a steel, building regs) and apparently that could potentially cause movement upstairs in the long term. Again, nearly every house on the road will have done it as we’ve got tiny galley kitchens otherwise.

They’ve pointed out every single hairline crack that have been here as long as we have. Again, every house has them or has been freshly plastered or is covered in textured wallpaper. We ran out of money when decorating so didn’t manage to plaster every room. They’ve said our one squeaky floorboard could possibly mean an issue with the joists. Again, it’s been squeaky as long as we’ve been here.

Long story short FTB are now running a mile, we’ve lost our onwards purchase and we have to declare issues with the previous survey although there is nothing actually wrong with the house. The FTB is making a big mistake and I do feel bad for them as I’d probably do the same but the whole situation is ridiculous.

Anyone empathise or offer any words of advice. I’m so worried we won’t be able to sell without a massive price reduction now and our onwards purchase is dependent on the sale price. The valuation was ok. Just the survey.

The same thing happened to me with a Victorian flat, due to the combination of a FTB and a young and new structural surveyor. I lost the sale, lost the next sale because the next buyer used the same structural survey and had to take it off the market. The "solution" was to wait 18 months, rent it out in the interim, and then re-market it once everyone had forgotten about it. In the meantime, the property upstairs sold with no issues whatsoever.

I would really rather not have to wait any period of time as we are moving a distance to help look after my Mum who needs care. I am hoping we can resell fairly easily, given there is nothing wrong with the house and it is priced fairly.

I’m also not replacing a really good quality boiler that’s been serviced annually and never caused us any problems. It could easily do 5, if not 10 years.

I don't blame you OP and if the market is strong, stick to your guns. In my case, I'd only bought the flat 3 years earlier and the survey then had picked up on no issues. The issue was that the entire building was built over a culvert, as are many properties and since the Victorian era when it was built, it had caused no issues.

But no! Along came a newly qualified structural surveyor who imagined that the mere presence of a culvert created subsidence. Not that there was any evidence of subsidence and certainly no wall cracks, they put in in their report, repeatedly, at multiple points. And every buyer afterwards ordered a copy of that structural survey.

18 months later, everyone had forgotten about it and I got the property sold with no such issues.

It was honestly so frustrating.

I was of the impression that they’d be the easiest to sell to due to no chain.

They’re not. My FTB had a survey and I then had a succession of visits from electricians, plumbers, damp specialists, etc, none of whom could find anything wrong with the house. Then he wanted all the curtains included. His final piece de resistance was trying to get 10% off the agreed price the day before exchange. I told the agent to tell him to fuck off.

@TabithaHazel

Sounds like they were maybe looking for an excuse to pull out, it’s well known that surveys read like a horror story as they have to point out every tiny fault that could possibly go wrong one day. Hopefully your next buyer will be a bit more experienced than the FTBs and read the survey with a more discerning eye.

I had exactly the same experience when I sold my first house to a couple who wanted another buy-to-let property. They were a complete nightmare. I don’t know if this should have been allowed but the surveyor we used for our onward purchase happened to be the same one that they used to survey the house we were selling. The survey he did on the house we purchased was extremely light touch to say the least and we’ve had endless problems with the plumbing, showers leaking into walls, we discovered a damp patch on one of the bathroom walls from where the shower had leaked into the wall cavity, leaking toilets (2 out of 5 work properly). He didn’t mention anything about this. And yet he nitpicked over so many minor things on the house we were selling. He tried to claim we had a damp problem. There wasn’t a damp problem - it was where we were showering and not having the window open/ the extractor fan on - I.e. it was condensation. This was later proved. He claimed a cap was missing from a pipe in the loft. My dad owns a building company and realised this guy was talking about a cap that came with the packaging of the pipe - sent me to the local plumbing merchants who gave me a spare one they had lying around.

Basically I knew from what I had been told that this couple owned multiple buy-to-let properties and they were obviously regular customers of this so-called surveyor who was doing his best to help his rich mates save a bit of money. We had the last laugh though because he didn’t spot the huge hole in the carpet that had a furniture unit placed over the top of it.

So it’s not always FTBs.

FTB are a nightmare because they believe these stupid reports. We had the same with ours.

You just have to withdraw from the sale and see if any of the other offers that came in are still viable. That or explain to them that surveyors cover their backs by suggesting worst case scenarios for hairline plaster cracks and creaky floorboards but you have lived with them for ten years and had no problems. They might calm down. Don't reduce the price though. Nothing they've flagged is a genuine issue.

I think you need to sell to people with more experience of home owning.
We once had a structural survey done on a listed property. It was horrendous and the surveyor actually advised me not to buy it (off the record). We got another survey done by someone who was used to older properties and although he still identified issues he gave a much clearer explanation about the urgency of putting them right and kept saying 'it's just one of those things with an older building, it's survived this long so try not to worry'.
We lived there ten years without a single issue, made a profit in it easily and had no problems selling it on.

Seems this is fairly common. It’s all the possibles and potentially in the survey that have annoyed me the most. It’s £1k worth of arse covering. I’ve not been given access to the whole thing but they sent it to the estate agent.

Our estate agent has been trying to reach them since Tuesday. All they’ve had is an email with the survey and saying it’s too much work. They said 30k but that includes a new boiler, new roof and new floor/joists upstairs. None of that is actually needed. The estate agent is horrified (losing £££ mainly!) but they sell loads of these houses and said the survey is actually pretty good! They would happily talk them through it but they are ignoring their calls.

They’re not going to take the estate agents word over the surveyor though are they?!

There’s no way back from this but honestly, it’s their loss. I’m just gutted we are back to square one with the sale as we thought we’d be moving Easter time.

I feel your pain

I have moved around a lot and so have had my share of buying/selling/surveyors/structural surveyors and ftb’s

In fact I have got to the point where I sold a house we had a few years ago and deliberately dismissed the FTB’s bid because I knew what would happen.
I wanted a smooth sale and I didn’t want to hold someone’s hand whilst they dithered and had panic attacks over every little line in the surveyors report and then run away screaming after finding out that the wiring was 15 years old and the boiler was so old it wasn’t under warranty.

At least the people who bought the place weren’t expecting a brand new boiler and wiring or hole free beams
There expectations of an older home were more realistic.

I have come across some surveyors (usually straight out of the exam halls who have no idea what an older house is like. I think they expect everything to adhere to the latest building regs but still be 100 years old.

I have lived in a couple of very old cottages (circa 17th century) I remember the very young surveyor running around one like a headless chicken. His mind I could tell was completely blown when he realised the property didn’t have foundations. His report stated that the house without foundations was in imminent danger of falling down. The fact that the walls were 7ft thick and had remained standing unaided for the past 300 years seemed to not matter.
Apparently we had signs of woodworm in the exposed beams (old wood worm holes) and needed to take down all the beams and replace them with steels.
He also found no record of planning permission so he suspected that the house might have to come down if planning permission wasn’t granted retrospectively
Fortunately our buyers knew that the surveyor didn’t know what he was talking about and for mortgage purposes agreed on getting a structural surveyor who fortunately was a bit older and knew about old cottages.

I could go on. My latest place I didn’t bother with a survey. I couldn’t be bothered with some fresh faced young surveyor trying to tell me what was wrong with the place and how it is only worth £0.

I know what is wrong with the place. Everything. But I know what caused the problems and how to put it right
Or if I can’t manage it I know someone who can.

I could go on.

It is really shit when someone who is supposed to be qualified to make an opinion and is being paid for opinion ends up covering their arses by saying Could or Maybe against everything they say and will not give an actual opinion based on fact.

“FTB are a nightmare”. Really? Are you an estate agent? I was of the impression that they’d be the easiest to sell to due to no chain.
I'm coming to the conclusion that a buyer being chain-free is not necessarily a good thing. If people have to coordinate a sale and purchase then they tend to do their best to hold everything together whereas a non-chain can just walk away and continue renting for a few more months. They have no skin in the game.

Doesn't sound like the kind of house you would need a full structural survey on. If the purchaser doesn't want to proceed or tries to knock the price down I would go back to one of the other offerors and try and do a deal with them. Also sounds like the surveyor is trying to justify the expense of the survey with stupid observations.

@SarahAndQuack

I was a first time buyer and found the structural survey really reassuring. We don't all run a mile.

I suspect all their response really says is that they didn't like the house enough.

If they didn’t like the house much why spend £1000 on a structural survey!

We had a survey done on our previous home, apparently there were signs of movement in the lounge as the floor was not level. We got a structural engineer who declared the asphalt flooring to be a "Friday afternoon job" We had the floor re-done so this did not cause any further issues. The house we purchased apparently had suspected insect infestation in the joists due to movement. As we knew the houses and had knowledge we knew that there are gaps under the floors and that tradesmen had cut pop holes to carry out wiring etc and just had not supported the joists adequately.

I don’t understand how they can just walk away with no negotiation after spending £1k on a survey. Why not come back to us and ask for a reduction at the least?

Either they’ve run away terrified, thinking the house will fall down and there’s no way back or are making us stew before requesting 30k off the purchase price.

Good luck op. You just need to find the right buyer. None of that stuff would put me off. I remember buying a house with my ex. All kinds of things came up on the survey (120 yr old mid terrace). My ex’s parents, who had always lived in modern houses, were horrified and thought we should pull out. My parents, who lived in a 300 year old house said “well that all sounds ok and nothing serious, doesn’t it”. It’s just what you’re used to..

I don't think it's the survey, I think it's the fact that it's a first time buyer and an old house. More experienced buyers particularly going to be like old houses wouldn't raise an eyebrow would any of the things on that survey. I hope it works out, I'm sure it will.

What a pain...sound like my first house - gaps in wall between lofts -check , creaky floorboards - check , Old boiler - check. When I bought it I was a FTB but didn't bother with a structural survey as I had done one on a previous prospective house and didn't see anything useful in getting one. And the house didn't fall down in the 10 years I owned it.
I wasn't aware that you had to declare anything about a previous prospective buyers survey as that is for that particular buyer and not usually made available to you or any subsequent potential buyers- but maybe that has changed in the 8 years since I sold my house...
I think you would be fine to stick to original price and remarket....good luck !

@Rosser

I don’t understand how they can just walk away with no negotiation after spending £1k on a survey. Why not come back to us and ask for a reduction at the least?

Either they’ve run away terrified, thinking the house will fall down and there’s no way back or are making us stew before requesting 30k off the purchase price.

They spent £1k for a very detailed survey. The premium option, which for a small terraces property is not the norm.

The survey results and follow up discussion with the surveyor obviously was sufficiently compelling to mean that to them - the deal was dead in the water

@Rosser

I don’t understand how they can just walk away with no negotiation after spending £1k on a survey. Why not come back to us and ask for a reduction at the least?

Either they’ve run away terrified, thinking the house will fall down and there’s no way back or are making us stew before requesting 30k off the purchase price.

They were already wavering and the survey was the tipping point, that’s the way it is in England, you have not got a sale until the cash is in your Bank. Scotland has a better system where buyers commit much earlier, you could of course put your place up for “auction” where the highest bidder pays a substantial deposit immediately. To be honest for older properties that need refurbishment you get the same price, because there are plenty of bidders willing to take the risk.

Watching with interest as we may purchase an ex council house

@red30505

we're FTB and nearly ran with the amount of work needed.

Vendors have done NOTHING in the 20 years they've been there, so predictably the things that need replacing... need replacing.
(windows, gutters, boiler, radiators imminently need replacing.
Porch (addition to property so not attached to main brickwork) needs some remidial work

Our vendors were a bit unreasonable IMHO and didn't budge an inch on price, but ultimately, we need the space this house offers- and the only house with space we can afford is this one. (others are £30-50k more and that's a mortgage payment we aren't comfortable with with current price increases)

I'm utterly bricking it.... but the house won't fall down (we hope). Surveyor was great and we've a friend who's an architect who helped explain bits and pieces to us.

For us it'll mean taking on a second job, and not having a holiday for a bit to get the house fixed up, but once we've done that our mortage payments are low enough that we should be able to build equity...

Then hoping we can sell it in 5 years and move to a slightly nicer area.
Or - if we love it, we can stay and have the space we need.

Unless you buy a new build (which are ££££££ round our way), stuff needs doing to the house.

We've found this out the hard way.

We may end up regretting it - but... if we pulled out there was no guarantee we'd find something better.

It is the scariest thing I've ever done however.

20 year old windows, radiators and even boilers and guttering don't need replacing unless they are faulty.

You might choose to change them to a more modern style but that is a choice, not a fault to be repaired. Radiators, windows and guttering are all clearly on view in a house so presumably you knew they were not the latest fashion when you viewed the house. Similarly if you view a house which has not been redecorated for 20 yrs you know you will want to spend money on it. You don't need a survey to tell you that.

It’s just a matter of sticking with it and with your price. Sold a house where the surveyor said the roof wanted doing. The whole roof and they reduced the offer by 12% to cover cost of sorting roof. Managed to sell it for for the right price but it did take a few more months. 20 years later the same roof is still in place with no repairs. The stress that surveyor caused was so unnecessary.

Tbf as third time buyers we just ran a mile from a house that had an unsafe chimney stack, some minor roof issues and drainage issues (but circa 5k to fix) plus a shedload of invasive bamboo in the garden and neighbouring gardens.
I guess it's about attitude to risk and in our case whether the 'job lot' was worth it to us given other known issues with property (refurb needed etc) vs cost and 'value'.

That's so unfortunate OP. Surveyors have to flag absolutely everything because it's their job, and if they didn't something could come back on them and they can be sued. They also have to do it with just a visual inspection, so assumptions about worst case scenario have to happen. But I completely sympathise though and it's awful that you've lost your new house because of it.

When I was a FTB the full survey on my old house terrified the hell out of me, but someone more experienced explained why they had flagged everything and that a lot of those jobs were actually normal and minor, so maybe your FTBs didn't have this. I moved in with a long list of stuff I wanted to fix ASAP based on that report...and most of it still like it today!

They might be genuinely worried about it or equally if you say these are easy things to fix they might be wondering why you didn't in all the time you've lived there, especially when they have nothing to compare it to.

If you can, try to do the jobs you have the budget for. The cracks will hopefully be quite straightforward to fill, sand and paint. The loft seems to be a common theme that would worry a lot of people here (no idea what this means myself but if it's straightforward try to do it). The electrical certificate is a good idea as well - mine two years ago cost £150 plus labour and they test absolutely everything. Keep all your certificates, boiler service docs etc. together and make sure the agent knows about them so if they are asked about them they can tell the viewers when things were last certified etc.

It might even be worth obtaining quotes for the work that you don't do, eg potential re-wiring etc. Unless you have experience of trades a lot of people tend to over-estimate how much work costs and just assume it will be very expensive, which isn't always the case. I lived with stuff for years because I didn't think I could afford to fix it and turns out it was significantly doable. If you have quotes and someone queries it you can quickly put that into context for them.

Good luck!

@Kennykenkencat are you me? :-)
We said pretty much the same!