Tradespeople not providing quotes - so frustrating

[thebellagio]

I feel like I need to rant!

I'm really getting fed up of builders/decorators/other tradespeople coming to take a look at my house but then not bothering to give me a quote afterwards. It's such a friggin waste of my time and their time.

I've been trying to find a builder to knock a door through a wall - one gave me an extortionate quote, another took 3 weeks (fair enough) but the other one who we liked the most has now taken nearly 8 weeks and despite me chasing, still hasn't bothered to give me a ballpark figure. I told him at the time, I'm happy to wait for the work to be done, but I just want to get into people's diaries so I'm in the queue so to speak.

We asked a decorator to have a look - we need the entire house done, so we told him to price it up so it's a decent sized job for him. He told me in Mid Nov that he was booking in work for Feb onwards which is absolutely fine with me, yet he hasn't bothered to send over a quote either. Frankly I have no intention of using him now because if he can't be bothered to even give me a quote, then I don't want to work with him. But what really annoys me is why waste my time by coming to have a look if you have no intention of following it up?

I understand that for builders it's harder to quote because they need to consider cost of materials which is fluctuating, and they are booked up months in advance. But for decorators where they just need to get some paint and some drop cloths? WTF its just so annoying!

My DH is a decorator. I do all the typing for quotes and invoicing, and he always tells customers he's pricing up for that quotes get sent on the following Sunday evening as that's the time I sit down and type.

If he knows he can't do the job in their timeframe he tells them before going to look at the job, save wasting everyone's time. If they are happy to wait for the work, they'll still get a quote that weekend.

I type fairly detailed quotes but we've had some tradesmen just send us a WhatsApp with a price - which I don't find acceptable! I like everything in writing, so it's clear what the price includes.

I think like another poster has said, some of them just don't actually get the business side of it, and have little customer service skills!

We found the same as you with builders, had 3 come to quote up and only one bothered giving us an actual price! Heard nothing back from the other two, absolute time wasters.

@ANameChangeAgain

If tradesmen don't come with a quote then the work is either problematic, or they are getting a potential pita vibe from the customer, or they know that the price will be so high it isn't worth their time doing the costing calculations and designs. Sometimes they get the impression that its just a pricing exercise and the work will never be done. The cost of red fuel will be increasing in March, which will hike up prices on materials, and the costs of materials are so volatile that its impossible to cost a job more then 6 weeks ahead. What I will say is that a good tradesperson will have a long waiting list, even this time of year, so if someone is too available then beware. All I can suggest is that you chase up by phone, but make sure you do it during normal office hours.

Or they don't need the work because they are already so busy. I think that is why they don't get back to people in the first place.

no answers really but in my experience, it's because the tradesperson can't manage their customer service or workload. They may be excellent at their trade, but not great at dealing with customers.
I used to work for an electrician company who were always busy. I hated the way they treated customers (i was on reception so got the rough end of the stick from customers).
The boss who did the quotes/measuring up for jobs seemed to pick and choose which customers he called back. He didn't ever be honest and turn down work if we were too busy, but just kind of hoped the customers would go away.
Apart from the customers he picked and chose, the other customers who would get dealt with are the "squeaking cogs who got the oil". As in, the customers that made a "nuisance" of themselves by chasing the quote, were dealt with , just to stop them chasing!
So, I'd recommend chasing them again, by phone, and maybe follow up with an email saying you've chased and want a response by as you're keen to get in the diary. Be the squeaking cog that gets the oil.

@ANameChangeAgain

If tradesmen don't come with a quote then the work is either problematic, or they are getting a potential pita vibe from the customer, or they know that the price will be so high it isn't worth their time doing the costing calculations and designs. Sometimes they get the impression that its just a pricing exercise and the work will never be done. The cost of red fuel will be increasing in March, which will hike up prices on materials, and the costs of materials are so volatile that its impossible to cost a job more then 6 weeks ahead. What I will say is that a good tradesperson will have a long waiting list, even this time of year, so if someone is too available then beware. All I can suggest is that you chase up by phone, but make sure you do it during normal office hours.

Its not the lack of a quote I find infuriating, ive had two people come round and say they could do part of a job but not all and another who got back to me to say that they had a big job on and couldnt do mine

That’s absolutely fine…no problem at all

Its the fucking rudeness of not getting back to me…

I feel your pain OP. We've had similar here in our fixer upper with both big jobs like an extension and then smaller jobs. I'd so much rather if tradespeople decided that they didn't want to do the job that they just say- I wouldn't be offended at all but I do get pissed off with my time being wasted on chasing. One plumber came out to quote for a toilet removal and refit- he was here 30 minutes, I asked 3 times for a rough figure and all he'd answer was how we should just do it ourselves and proceeded to talk me through it and recommend YouTube videos my husband should watch. (Because having a vagina means I could not possibly attempt any DIY, incase you were wondering). 🤔

My dh is sitting in front of me quoting at the moment. He’s got 5 quotes to get away this afternoon having spent the morning going round looking at the jobs. I think maybe you’re just unlucky.

I'm having the same problem finding someone to quote for some work.
Waited months for the decorator to have some space, worth it as a fantastic job he did!
My ex is a plumber, self employed usually earns 60k a year, tells the taxman less. Apparently he is the only trade who can't find work so can't pay child maintenance as there 'has been a pandemic, don't you know'.

Not a Covid issue at all. I've seen similar ghosting for years now.
Tradesmen who make an appointment to provide a quote then don't turn up (at times even after confirming 2 hours prior), or don't bother to provide a quote. Happened with big jobs like complete bathroom renovation garden reno and even small jobs like getting a wardrobe built.
I also found that I was more likely to get reasonable quotes if my white bf spoke to the Tradesmen.

A family friend in the business who used to do a bit of everything says there is so much work he now only quotes or commits for jobs that will be full time for at least three months, and is booked up for two years.

When there is so much work that they can pick and choose, and can improve profitability by cutting out any time spent on customer service, the smaller jobs will either have to carry a massive price premium or be unable to compete.

I’ll try not to be too defensive with my reply but here are a few considerations.

Firstly building trades are notoriously difficult to schedule. A large construction company will only touch large projects so most domestic property is covered by sole traders or at least smaller companies. We have no idea when we quote if the quote is just a ‘check’ of another builders quote. That is we will never get the work but have to work for a few hours or even a few days to create the quote. If we quote for 3 jobs we have no idea if we will get 1 of them, or even worse all 3 jobs. Then we have to start recruiting temporary people to help with the work. Sometimes they aren’t available. So once we have fixed all the above and there isn't a plaster/timber/thermal blocks/ million other parts shortage or delay, we start the work and a foot of snow falls meaning we are delayed by a week and unpaid for that week ( and even worse we have to pay the guys to sit at home).

Once finished the customer then decides they would like some extra work carrying out. I once tried to explain to a lady that I could not complete the extra work for her because I had another customer’s job scheduled to start. Her reply was ‘I could not care about any of your other customers. I really need you to help with these other jobs’. Now bearing in mind said customer owes me money at the end of my work, I have to tread very carefully.

Oh, bye the way, we also like to have holidays, and sometimes we are ill which may not fit in with your plans. Despite all this I only had 20 or so customers, there was two way trust and I new they relied on me. I never worked more than 3 miles from home, but on occasions had a 6 month waiting list.

It’s going to get worse with the way education and the ‘desired’ skills sets are mapping out.

@BurgerOnTheOrientExpress

I’ll try not to be too defensive with my reply but here are a few considerations.

Firstly building trades are notoriously difficult to schedule. A large construction company will only touch large projects so most domestic property is covered by sole traders or at least smaller companies. We have no idea when we quote if the quote is just a ‘check’ of another builders quote. That is we will never get the work but have to work for a few hours or even a few days to create the quote. If we quote for 3 jobs we have no idea if we will get 1 of them, or even worse all 3 jobs. Then we have to start recruiting temporary people to help with the work. Sometimes they aren’t available. So once we have fixed all the above and there isn't a plaster/timber/thermal blocks/ million other parts shortage or delay, we start the work and a foot of snow falls meaning we are delayed by a week and unpaid for that week ( and even worse we have to pay the guys to sit at home).

Once finished the customer then decides they would like some extra work carrying out. I once tried to explain to a lady that I could not complete the extra work for her because I had another customer’s job scheduled to start. Her reply was ‘I could not care about any of your other customers. I really need you to help with these other jobs’. Now bearing in mind said customer owes me money at the end of my work, I have to tread very carefully.

Oh, bye the way, we also like to have holidays, and sometimes we are ill which may not fit in with your plans. Despite all this I only had 20 or so customers, there was two way trust and I new they relied on me. I never worked more than 3 miles from home, but on occasions had a 6 month waiting list.

It’s going to get worse with the way education and the ‘desired’ skills sets are mapping out.

With respect that's a bunch of excuses.

Ref your point about scheduling - that only becomes an issue once someone has confirmed they want to go ahead, not when you're asking for initial pricing considerations. I work in marketing, and I regularly write proposals for prospective clients without knowing if they will go ahead or not, so that's not unique to the building sector.

You mention that some people may just be collecting quotes for comparisons - that is absolutely true. But one particular tradesperson I've now chased up twice, saying that we really liked him and wanted to use him if the price was right - yet still no response?

Holidays/Covid etc is all completely understandable and no one on this board thinks otherwise. But when you're asking someone for a price to do some work, ready to be scheduled in WHEN AVAILABLE, and seven weeks later these tradespeople still can't be bothered to send a simple email to say "I haven't forgotten about you, I'm still working on the quote, but we're backlogged due to Covid/xmas/annual leave..." thats fine. But to simply ghost a potential customer is just rude.

But to simply ghost a potential customer is just rude

Yep

@thebellagio. ' A bunch of excuses' ? Did you read and comprehend any of what I listed ? Have you ever worked in construction ? Have you ever run your own small business ? In your business do you have full control over the weather ? Please be realistic.

Consider this one extra reason why the builder / tradesperson didn't respond. One of the few benefits of being self employed is that we get to work when we want to and work for who we want to. If we feel the business 'relationship' isn't going to work....and here's a list

1. New kitchen required but 3 children in the house that want to use the kitchen up to 10 o'clock in a morning.
2. We have never worked for you before and unsure whether we will get paid.
3. You live in a congested area where we can only park at certain hours making it difficult to access the job.
4. We (from experience) know you are going to 'freak out' at the thin layer of dust we are going to create.
5. You won't give us a written schedule of works . Eg. Builder ' What type of patio doors would you like?. Customer ' Just normal ones' . How can we quote for something that can vary in cost from £400 - £3000 ?
6. You require specific t's+c's that are unrealistic. Eg. 'Would you be able to stop work between 1 and 3 in the afternoon so my youngest can sleep'.
7. We are asked to finish someone els's job. I wont explain the red flags around this.
8. You question the requirement for scaffolding that will add £500 to the bill and suggest the work can be carried out from ladders.

Quite simply, it is well documented that most customers will have had a builder / tradesperson to quote and not offered them the job because they 'didn't like him' or ' didn't trust him'.

Ever consider that there are customers that the self employed person with the capacity to decide who and when they work may decide they don't think it will work. You would fall into that category.

There's plenty more from the self employed builders perspective. If you have ever worked for a few days or even weeks and not been paid for either your time and materials you just might have some understanding of why there is a scarcity. And next time you see an old guy in his 50's hobbling down the street with his back bent double coughing and spluttering you might just reflect that he didn't spend his working life in 'marketing'.

I used to do some work for myself years ago , I get the impression that the op would be a customer to maybe avoid 🤔.

My DP is an electrician and that doesn't help us get trades out. It's massively infuriating but it's basically they're so busy that they can pick and choose their customers.

Had two plumbers come out two days ago, both spent a fair amount of time here discussing the job (not too big or complicated, just rerouting one set of pipes by a short distance, both said it was an easy job and that they had availability to do it). So it's been two days and not heard a thing from either of them. Currently wondering how long I leave it before asking another plumber round to quote as we'd happily go with either of the plumbers we've had out already. Feels frustrating as we're really desperate to have the work done ASAP.

Yes similar situation here, often hard to find someone to quote,they are all really busy.
I found local fb groups a good source for recommendations

@Runnerduck34

Yes similar situation here, often hard to find someone to quote,they are all really busy. I found local fb groups a good source for recommendations

Local area FB group has been the place I've found the best recommendations as well. I usually do a search, such as "landscaper", look through previous posts and pick the companies who are mentioned the most times. That way you avoid those tradesmen whose wives/brothers/children are the people saying they're amazing, and get people who are actually reliable and will do a decent job!

Agree with the local Facebook group recommendations. We had an electrician who came highly recommended on fb round yesterday to quote for some work. Had a quote by midday today and he has pencilled us in to start the job in just over two weeks. Plenty of others who didn't come recommended never even replied to initial emails/texts!

It's not just small jobs - trying to get quotes for a side return extension and some other internal work (removing a chimney breast, putting in a stud wall etc).
We've got architects plans and structural engineers calculations for steels etc, planning permission granted, and funds in place. Ready to go ASAP but also happy to wait for the right person, although ideally would like to do it this year.
We've been trying to get quotes since early December. Out of 5 recommendations, we've so far managed to get two people to look at it and received one quote. The others have had plans via email, said they want to visit, but I can't seem to pin them down (we agree a date and they cancel).

Good grief op, I hope you don't speak to the trades you meet the way you did to @BurgerOnTheOrientExpress!

Trades are busier than they have ever been - we lost skilled people due to Brexit and the stamp duty reduction meant a lot of people moved house and wanted work done.

Some trades play fast and loose with quotes-they may take a look at the job and decide the profit margin isn't competitive or fully intend to quote, but then get snowed under by work.

Most work alone which means they can't just draft in extra help that easily.

I am about to project manage my third renovation. I am lucky because my BiL is a builder and I have trades who know me. Plus I am a good customer - I don't get in their way, I don't critique everything they do, I stick to the brief and I make a good cup of coffee with a couple of biscuits on the side.

They all have a two/three month waiting list because of the crazy amount of work everyone needs and the Brexit exodus.