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Original poster

Bad survey returned on Xmas Eve. All red no building regs now what?!

37 replies

Teacups27 · 26/12/2021 23:09

After months of searching I had an offer accepting in September. I was told it’s tired and in need of modernisation but the attic room had all essential permissions. There’s not many/ any houses coming up in the area so I was feeling pleased with my choice, a slightly better house than I thought I could get.

Fast forward to Xmas eve and I get a survey that says basically it has everything but subsidence. And the loft conversion has not been signed off with building regs.

We have a chain of five behind us who’ve all spent a load of money now and are ready to move. And we’ve just wasted over £1000. I’d never have gone for a house that’s not signed off.

Do I hope they get signed off with building regulations?

Negotiate on price?

Run?

**Will it be hard to get a mortgage again after getting accepted for this and it falling through? Confused

OP posts:
SaveWaterDrinkGin · 26/12/2021 23:15

If it’s being called an ‘attic room’ that tells me immediately it’s not been signed off. If it had been then it’d be called a bedroom. Anyway, why hasn’t it been signed off? Could be something really simple.

Depends how much you want the house. At least you’re aware of the issues now. So it’s really not been a waste of money as you say. Also it wouldn’t be ‘falling through’, you’d be waking away from the purchase. How long was your mortgage offer for?

Musicalmaestro · 26/12/2021 23:19

It's only an issue when you come to sell. Is it a usable room as it is?
You could drop your offer obviously.

bilbodog · 26/12/2021 23:31

If the attic room was done many years ago then it wouldnt have been signed off. If the house hasnt been modernised or decorated for 20 years or more then it will need a lot doing, including re-wiring, new boiler, bathrooms and kitchen updating.

Speak to the surveyor before panicking as they should be able to go through the report with you and explain more clearly. It may not be as bad as it sounds.

Full surveys always sound really bad as they have to cover themselves.

Original poster
Teacups27 · 27/12/2021 00:07

The room looks fine to me and I’m happy with house but I’m putting my kids up there to sleep so it needs to be safe

OP posts:
rrhuth · 27/12/2021 00:11

Don't worry about the chain, these things happen. What matters is not buying a dud! You can get more info from the surveyor hopefully, and maybe negotiate a reduced price.

If you're not happy with the answers, walk away.

sheroku · 27/12/2021 00:17

Will it be hard to get a mortgage again after getting accepted for this and it falling through?

No it makes no difference. The bank is only looking at affordability, sales fall through all the time.

If it were me I'd chat to the surveyor and work out how much it would cost to fix everything and then negotiate the price. If you've got a chain of people ready to move then you've got an even stronger negotiating hand.

And don't worry about the £1000, it's really nothing in the grand scheme of things. Cost of doing business.

Theunamedcat · 27/12/2021 00:18

When you say everything but subsidance do you mean everything wrong with the house?

TweenWrangler · 27/12/2021 00:31

We've just bought a house with an outbuilding that hadn't been signed off with building regs. We called the building regs people who were very helpful, so I'd recommend that as a starting point. They said no way would they bother with it after so long (10'years or so). Our conveyancer said she was happy with that (they put it in writing) but also insisted on an indemnity to protect the lender, which cost a few hundred £. Whether it's safe or not is a different question of course but I agree with PP that your surveyors may be happy to give you a view on that in conversation even if not in their report.

Therealrealitystar · 27/12/2021 00:35

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This has been deleted by MNHQ for breaking our Talk Guidelines.

BasiliskStare · 27/12/2021 00:40

@Teacups27 - I would count essential permissions as building regs but as a PP said it may have been prior to current permissions. Which for a loft etc room I would guess is are the stairs properly built / right height / not too steep / fireproof exit etc. To change the stairs could be very expensive. If it not "illegal' then making sure fire exits / doors etc are in place , less so.

I would phone the surveyor and talk about what you are worried about. Surveys often come back quite worrying but when you break it down - all doable,

Best of luck

Hairyfriend · 27/12/2021 00:45

What other things does the house have, other than subsidence? If it was just building regs for the attic room, you could try negotiating that the sellers sort this out before selling. It might be a fairly quick sign off. If there are major structure repairs needed, I'd get costs to repair those and either try getting a reduction on the sale price, or walk.

Luzina · 27/12/2021 00:48

Talk to your solicitor/conveyancer before you make any decisions. And ring your surveyor to ask if attic room is safe or not

NewHouseNewMe · 27/12/2021 00:51

@BasiliskStare is right - start by talking to the surveyor about the attic. Issues can range from simply not doing the paperwork to taking out wooden beams without putting in RSJs..
Indemnities are hopeless in cases like this. They cover legal costs only if you were pursued by the council but not the cost of putting it all right.

BasiliskStare · 27/12/2021 01:17

@NewHouseNewMe - good point re RSJs

Takemine · 27/12/2021 01:34

The building regs is potentially a deal breaker or a simple piece of paper. Or something minor you could get a retention for.

What else is wrong with the house. Did the surveyor give an opinion on the cost of repairs or the value of the house in his/her humble opinion?

Takemine · 27/12/2021 01:36

Also, surveys are meant to make you aware of everything that could possibly go wrong. They're not necessarily things you'd notice if you were actually living in it.

Does it make getting a mortgage problematic.

Butterfly44 · 27/12/2021 01:42

Is it an attic room or a bedroom. If advertised as attic room that's what it is...and what is would be marketed as if you sell on. It's up to you if you want to use it as sleeping quarters. On that aspect you can't ask for reduced price if it wasn't advertised as a bedroom. "In need of modernism" generally means whole redecoration, electrics etc

catfunk · 27/12/2021 11:10

I bought a house with the loft bedroom not signed off (it's our main bedroom) and it's absolutely fine, in fact most properties where we live are the same. It was converted so long ago it's not an issue and there is indemnity insurance so we will never need to bring it up to regs.

When was the loft converted op? Are you planning on doing lots of work to it anyway?

SonicStars · 27/12/2021 17:29

We asked for indemnity insurance for building work done without planning permission. Seller thought it was within permitted development, I'm not so sure. Solicitor sorted it out for us and we didn't worry further.

I'd be more concerned about all the other red. Are they things that will cost a lot to put right? Can you get money off to do so? Is the reduced price because they were taken into account?

user1487194234 · 27/12/2021 18:04

Indemnity insurance is not a magic wand
It is important to understand what it covers and what it doesn't

sleepyhoglet · 27/12/2021 18:07

@TweenWrangler I'd be really interested to hear about your outbuilding. We are buying something with an annex that doesn't have planning permission or building regs. It's detached from the main house and the vendors have been living in it. We were worried it would be an issue.

BernadetteRostankowskiWolowitz · 27/12/2021 18:08

When was the attic converted?

Original poster
Teacups27 · 27/12/2021 20:24

The attic was converted 20 years ago but I should add that it’s a grade 2 listed.

The other problems include damp, guttering, the roof needs partly replacing, a couple of windows need fixing, the kitchen ceiling boards need replacing because they are flammable.

That’s without the kitchen and bathroom.

The house is the right size for us with a big garden within school catchment. Everything else seems to be small or miles away from school.

OP posts:
ChateauMargaux · 27/12/2021 20:52

Do you have funds to carry out the required works... roof repairs are often recommended if over 50 years old. Windows on old houses.. pretty standard, guttering, needs regular maintenance..

Completion certificates for building regulations were introduced in the 1980's...

The big question would be ... what about the grade 2 listing... would you be able to get retrospective approval? Would it cause problems if you were to seek permission to make other changes? Are there any major changes that you want to make?

Regarding the safety, unless there has been evidence of movement in the last 20 years, it is unlikely that the attic will collapse. Is there a fire safety risk.. maybe, as with lots of older properties.. but a 3 storey property of a similar age would present the same risks..

Indemnity policy is unlikely to provide sufficient coverage.. after 20 years ... no council is going to enforce the building regulations (there is a time limit on enforcement which usually runs out before the validity of the indemnity policy begins).

But.. compared to other policies that I have read... a very quick google gave me this.. www.lawsureinsurance.co.uk/our-products/title-protection/listed-building-consent/.

'Risks Covered: The cost of defending enforcement action, the expense of complying with enforcement action, including the cost of demolishing, altering or reinstating any part of the property, loss in market value following enforcement action. ' So that would be worth looking into..

Kshhuxnxk · 27/12/2021 20:59

There is a possibility that the bank won't actually lend without the paperwork (I know, I've just sold a house I was executor for and lost the first buyers due to no pp for porch and garage). Grade 2 listed - wouldn't touch a listed with a bargepole tbh.