Private garden

[kirinm]

We are aiming to sell our flat. We own half of a very large garden with the other half being owned by the basement flat. Since we've been here the garden has been 'open' with no fencing. I'm wondering if we should put a fence in. With a fence in, we are looking at a 4m x 8m fully private garden so it's a decent size for a London flat.

Do you think it'll be worth the cost? Fencing isn't cheap and it's time consuming as well. Or do you think those that are buying flats won't care about it being fenced off?

We've not done it before simply because the garden has been the last on our to-do list but after 5 years we've finally finished the inside and now wondering how much effort / expense we should make with the garden.

4m x 25m even!

I'd want a private garden with fence - open looks like shared and I wouldn't buy a shared garden..

Will the freeholder let you?

Oh people will definitely want a private garden with a fence!

Do you actually own a discrete half? Definitely fence it if so.

I wouldn't. Say the neighbor is so lovely you personally don't need a fence but if they wanted to they could.don't waste you money.

Ask the agent, tbh what matters most is the deeds.

Will a fence annoy the other flat owners? That is what I would worry about if viewing.

So I would probably rather see a flat already fenced off.

@VeniVidiWeeWee

Will the freeholder let you?

We own share of freehold with the other owner.

@GreyhoundG1rl

Do you actually own a discrete half? Definitely fence it if so.

I'm not sure what you mean re discrete? Title plans show how the garden is split (straight down the middle length ways).

'Discrete' means separate.

Some shared gardens are everyone shares the whole thing, some are actually split and sold.

@beginningoftheend

'Discrete' means separate.

Some shared gardens are everyone shares the whole thing, some are actually split and sold.

Ah thanks. Title plans show it as separate.

Yes I would fence it. Good fences make good neighbours and all that.

How reliable are title plans? I know that is an odd question but I would rather leave the garden open than risk any sort of dispute with our neighbour. Arguably his side of the garden is less appealing than ours but that is because he lets his property out and doesn't maintain his side and the garden is too big for us to do it all. In fact, the lack of maintenance by anyone other than us is one of major bugbears with the flat in general.

This is the title plan

You should be able to rely on your deeds, your solicitor should have checked that when you bought.

I have a friend who had deed issues when they bought - but their house last changed hands over 100 years ago.

There have been recent issues where people use the in-house solicitor on new builds and their deeds are for a different house than the one they live in!

But most deeds are right.

@beginningoftheend

You should be able to rely on your deeds, your solicitor should have checked that when you bought.

I have a friend who had deed issues when they bought - but their house last changed hands over 100 years ago.

There have been recent issues where people use the in-house solicitor on new builds and their deeds are for a different house than the one they live in!

But most deeds are right.

Thanks. They seem pretty clear to me but I'm not a conveyancer! We certainly bought the place assuming the title plan was accurate.

You can get next door's deeds if you are concerned and check it aligns.

@beginningoftheend

You can get next door's deeds if you are concerned and check it aligns.

Thanks. We are pretty sure we've seen it - I think I obtained it from the land registry when we bought but we can't locate it so we will get it again.

I am pretty confident of what we own but I also don't want any form of dispute as we are desperate to sell soon.

Can you both access the garden through your own flats? Part of me loves the idea of a communal sociable space, but think it might be more attractive to have it fenced so people feel a bit more freedom to have friends round, play music etc. I think it might be more attractive to be fenced off .

Definitely fence off the space and deal with any and all protests from the neighbours before you put it up for sale. There are very few people who would actively want their garden to be merged with a neighbour. A small number would tolerate it but a much bigger number would be put off by it. You could put a low fence to still allow light etc and would likely be cheaper. If there is a boundary on the deeds of what I’m buying, I would definitely insist on an established boundary on the ground that matches it. Anything else could be a potentially expensive and litigious nightmare for your purchaser.

How has the garden actually been used to date? If both the owner of your flat and the neighbour use and maintain the entire thing and have done for several years, you are risking potential legal complications.

Even a cheap nasty fence is far more appealing than a potentially complex legal morass. Think of it this way - if there was already a fence there, you wouldn’t dream of removing it to help your sale, would you?

@hooplahoop

Can you both access the garden through your own flats? Part of me loves the idea of a communal sociable space, but think it might be more attractive to have it fenced so people feel a bit more freedom to have friends round, play music etc. I think it might be more attractive to be fenced off .

Yes. They "own" the alleyway which leads from the front of the building and their entrance around to the garden and we have a balcony, the steps of which take you into the garden. You can see our steps on the title plan.

@sycamore54321

Definitely fence off the space and deal with any and all protests from the neighbours before you put it up for sale. There are very few people who would actively want their garden to be merged with a neighbour. A small number would tolerate it but a much bigger number would be put off by it. You could put a low fence to still allow light etc and would likely be cheaper. If there is a boundary on the deeds of what I’m buying, I would definitely insist on an established boundary on the ground that matches it. Anything else could be a potentially expensive and litigious nightmare for your purchaser.

How has the garden actually been used to date? If both the owner of your flat and the neighbour use and maintain the entire thing and have done for several years, you are risking potential legal complications.

Even a cheap nasty fence is far more appealing than a potentially complex legal morass. Think of it this way - if there was already a fence there, you wouldn’t dream of removing it to help your sale, would you?

As far as I know, there has never been a boundary fence. BUT there is also no boundary fence between our building and next door. That is primarily due to the fact that we are the only owner / occupier in our building and next door and frankly, none of the other owners (landlords) are interested in spending any money.

We are the only people that do any form of maintenance. We've only been here 5 years though so I can't comment on how it has been in the past. There have always been a steady flow of tenants downstairs too. Some of the tenants use the garden, others don't. We are going to raise it with the owner of downstairs and see what his thoughts are. We were thinking of a small fence that doesn't block any light. We don't want to be dicks!

But realistically, it isn't comfortable using the garden when others are in it and his current tenants are using the garden a lot (which they are entitled to do)!

Definitely do it. It would be a deal breaker for me. For all the same reasons you say - I wouldn't want to have to deal with possible disputes and I'd be wondering why the seller hadn't done it themselves. It would be a red flag.

Definitely speak with the owner of the basement flat but don't ask their opinion, tell then that this is what you are doing. You'll know pretty quickly if they are likely to object or raise any issues.

Personally I would put a 3ft fence up. It's the cheapest option for you but lays the way for the buyer to upgrade to a higher fence if they wish.

I don’t know why you lived there without a fence. I would hate a shared garden.

@MyDcAreMarvel

I don’t know why you lived there without a fence. I would hate a shared garden.

Shared gardens are pretty common in this part of London. We are fortunate in this is only "shared" by two of the four flats in the building. But we've spent the last 4 years renovating the inside (and having a baby) so have only just started paying any real attention to the outside!