Any planning experts on here? Help!

[MillyMolly123]

Hello,

If anyone knows anything about planning applications, in particular replacing a first floor window with patio doors, please read on and offer advice if you are able.

Back story: we live in a semi, the house attached to ours submitted a planning application to build a ground floor, flat roofed extension which spans the entire width of the house and is around 6 metres in depth. This plan was approved and the build has been going on for the last 12 months, still nowhere near finished.

The approved plans showed no changes to the size or location of any first floor windows.

However, first floor patio doors which lead out on to the large flat roof have been installed instead of a window - the approved plans clearly show a window.

The doors perhaps suggest the owner intends on using the flat roof as a sort of terrace/large balcony area (they lost quite a big chunk of garden due to the extension, so this makes sense). If used in this way, the little area of our garden which was private would no longer be, and whoever was on the terrace would be able to see directly into one of our children’s bedrooms.

I contacted the council planning dept who advised a planning application would have to be submitted if the roof was intended to be used as a terrace, but as of yet no application had been made.

However, the council stated that there was nothing in place to stop first floor patio doors being installed instead of the agreed window.

To cut a long story short, we can’t really approach the owner about this. Not once has he spoken to us about any of his plans (the first we knew of them was the notification letter from the council), and there was no bad history between us, the first time we met him was after the plans had been submitted, so it would have been nice of him to have spoken to us before the letter hit our doormat! Whenever we, or other concerned neighbours have attempted to speak to him about issues (an asbestos garage being demolished with no warning whilst our children were playing in the garden, pavements and grass verges being churned up, smoke inhalation due to him burning most of the waste instead of hiring a skip etc.) he has become very aggressive and threatening. So, we now just avoid him, as does everyone else on the street. It’s a shame as everyone is so friendly, this has all caused unnecessary upset.

Anyway, does anyone know if the council are correct in saying there’s nothing they can do about his unofficial roof terrace? I get the impression they’re trying to fob me off. It seems so unfair for our privacy and house value to be so negatively affected (if we were to ever sell, zero privacy in one bedroom and back garden would seriously put buyers off), and for it to all be approved by the council!

Is there usually a process in place where we can appeal?

Thank you

I think there's a difference between him installing the doors and using the flat roof as a terrace. That surely causes over looking issues. You may have to wait until he actually does start using it as a terrace.

What @Midlifelady said. Until he actually uses the roof as a terrace no rules are broken. You’ll have to watch and wait on this one, although I appreciate how frustrating that is.
I doubt the planners will allow use if his roof in this way, given the invasion of your privacy. Building control would want to reassess the plans too as the roof may not be properly designed to be used as a terrace.

@sandieshaw @Midlifelady Thanks both, that’s disappointing and frustrating. It feels like we have zero protection or comeback. If he can’t use the doors, he shouldn’t be allowed to install them as they have potential to invade our privacy and will definitely make our house unattractive to buyers. How crazy that nothing can be done.

I really don’t want to make assumptions, but he’s been pretty unreasonable throughout the whole process, and I’d put money on him having missed the doors from the original plans intentionally. Use of the roof as a terrace has been in his head from the beginning.

Can’t wait for the fun and games to start once he moves in

I swear I've read this on here before. Or something very similar.

The neighbour out a fence around it and started using it. Then the OP contacted building control and the neighbour was made to take the fence down, I think.

@SmellsLikeAHamsterCage It’s perhaps fairly common!

It must be quite attractive to see that big expanse of flat roof and just think, ooh it’d be lovely to sit out here on a summer’s day, but not really thinking (or caring) about the impact upon neighbouring properties.

It still seems ridiculous that doors are allowed to be installed but not used. It would save a lot of bother by just saying doors cannot be installed. Urgh!

The council said we could email them if he started to use it. However, all he will receive is a letter saying he shouldn’t use it. Not really much of a deterrent for someone like him, and the damage will have already been done.

So yeah, feeling pretty vulnerable and let down

Yes I've read something very similar before , it was long running. I think the issue is using the roof rather than the door.

@Raxer26A Yeah, from the comms I’ve had with the council, he can install a door but not use the roof. Would make more sense to just say he can’t install the door, and save a lot of agro down the line. Also concerned about negative impact upon our house value.

But it seems our hands are tied by silly council rulings that make no sense.

To be fair to councils they work to planning rules that are set by government. They can't enforce something if its not possible.

Fair enough, the rules as set by the Government make no sense in incidents such as this then.

It just seems any likely future confrontation could be avoided by the rules actually being properly thought through in the first place.

So, he can install doors but never use them. Why not just say he can’t install the doors, or at least stipulate a Juliette style balcony must be affixed to them?

As it stands everybody loses... he must not use his doors and our property value is likely to be affected. If he does use the doors (which I’d put money on him doing so), we have to contact the council. He’ll be told to stop (which he may, or may not do) and we’ll have to inform future buyers of the dispute (I think).

Just tell him from the start that a window/Juliette balcony is all that is permitted, and avoid all of the inevitable upset.

It’s a bit backwards

I think he might have an issue with getting his completions certificate if the door opens onto an unsecured area (i.e. no barrier). You certainly can't install windows that open a certain way on 1st floors etc. So perhaps try to contact Building Control rather than planning. Then he would either have to put up a barrier round the entire roof, which by the sounds of things would require planning at which point you might be able to object and either get it canned completely or have something put up that retains your privacy. Or he'll have to put up some sort of juliette balcony in front of the door.

This is of course assuming he gives a monkeys about his completion certificate which he might now.

@Muststopeating thanks for this, definitely worth a shot.

I know the house at the back of ours has been in comms with planning also, and others plan on doing so too, so I’ll tell them all to try building control. Hopefully the more of us who raise the issue, the more impetus the council will have to help (or at least visit and make it clear to him that it must not be used as a terrace, instead of leaving that task up to us)

extensionarchitecture.co.uk/planning-permission/ideas/balcony-planning-permission/

Speak to your local councillor

@LockdownNotOut Thank you