Full survey on a flat?

[UneAstuce]

Hello - I am buying a 2 bedroom 2nd floor (also top floor) flat and have been told I only need a homebuyers report, but as it's at the top I need to have the roof checked, at least on my bit of the roof.

Is it normal to have a full buildings survey on a flat, and will they check the whole outside structure, or just outside of my flat? As it's on the second floor I can't see them checking exterior walls just around that individual flat!

I could ask the surveyors which type of report to get, but clearly they will advise the more expensive (full) survey.

I am veering towards the full survey anyway but thought I would ask here if anyone had a full survey on an upper floor flat and whether they felt it was worth it.

Thank you!

We didn't when we bought our upper floor flat. The repairing responsibility for the roof (and quite possibly external walls - I can't quite remember) rested with the freeholder, so we would've been jointly liable with the tenants of the other flats in case of repairs anyway. Check the lease.

My buyer just had a survey done on my flat. The guy poked all around everything and everywhere.

It did highlight and issue with some brickwork, which tbf the maintenance company have now sorted.

The EA when they informed me he was having a survey done were like

But equally it is an investment...

why wouldn't you have a survey done should be the question? Even if the repair responsibility for the roof is with the freeholder or covered within service fees or would be your flat that was damaged and your belongings if there was an issue. It would be you out most at inconvenience of the roof needed to be replaced or repaired? Anyone buying a property should have nore than a homebuyers report.

Yes I would think that if they for example discovered the roof needed urgent work, then I would have to ask the solicitor to check that there is already enough to cover that in the previously accrued management pool of money. I would not want to move in and be hit for a big bill immediately.

I'm surprised at the responses so far suggesting minimal if any survey required for flat?

A full structural will be a waste of money. Even with that they do not remove anything - he/she won't be able to see inside drains etc. A homebuyers should be thorough enough to check the roof (check if you are solely responsible for repairs, which would be unusual).
A conversion would be more likely to have a more comprehensive survey but if it's purpose built and is well maintained save your money.
Surveyors also cover themselves by using language like 'it appears to be' and 'could be'.
When I bought a flat in a large complex I didn't have any survey. When I bought a basement conversion I did. But unless you have xray vision any survey is limited, even more so in a flat (but yes I believe they will look at the whole building, not just your flat, as far as they can).

To add, any surveyor who pushes you to get a more comprehensive survey as a matter of course does not deserve your business.

@stuckinarutatwork

We didn't when we bought our upper floor flat. The repairing responsibility for the roof (and quite possibly external walls - I can't quite remember) rested with the freeholder, so we would've been jointly liable with the tenants of the other flats in case of repairs anyway. Check the lease.

You’d want to know about any near future major repair work even if you’re only paying a proportion of that cost?

I choose not to have a survey when I bought my flat, for all the reasons you mentioned. I'm not top floor though, and it's a leasehold flat in a managed block so any repairs would be split.

I'm now selling and my buyer paid for a homebuyers survey. Chap turned up early so we were still here working when he arrived, he was in here for all of 5 mins. He opened all the window S, jumped up and down, flushed the loo and ran the taps, and glanced at the boiler. I'm glad I didn't pay for that!

I'm now of the mind that I personally would either go for a full structural survey, or none, because what I saw of a homebuyers was a complete waste of money.

I don't mean they are likely to "push" me but I can't see they would actively dissuade me. The posters here don't honestly care whether I get any survey at all because I'm not paying them, which is why I'm asking the question here as well as seeking surveyors' advice.

I suspect the type of person saying don't bother with a survey also don't bother with travel insurance and then complain when that goes wrong too. It is one of the biggest purchases you will make and a small price to pay if after you move in you discover you need to fork out £7k upward for a new roof.

Yes I had a full survey on my flat. Yes our buyer has also had a full survey. But I'd clarify that its a converted victorian terrace and all repairs shared (not managed).

Pointless to get a full building survey - they won't have access to the other flats so it won't be comprehensive. Structural issues are for the freeholder to deal with.

We would never let someone pay for a building survey on a flat, we always told them to go for homebuyers

@UneAstuce

Yes I would think that if they for example discovered the roof needed urgent work, then I would have to ask the solicitor to check that there is already enough to cover that in the previously accrued management pool of money. I would not want to move in and be hit for a big bill immediately.

I'm surprised at the responses so far suggesting minimal if any survey required for flat?

Your solicitor should request an LPE1 form from the vendor.

This will outline the management fees / upcoming works / reserve fund etc.

You can think what you like @SeasonFinale
What actually happened was I spoke to surveyors about what exactly they would be able to survey in a flat such as mine. They wouldn't have checked the roof etc as they were not a part of my flat. They'd have just had to have a look from the outside at ground level. I'm perfectly comfortable in my abilities to look for damp etc, and as I was planning a full refurb regardless, would rectify any previous work. So yes, a full survey would have been a waste of money. And as I explained, having seen a homebuyers I am now even more convinced that I did the right thing.

@SeasonFinale

I suspect the type of person saying don't bother with a survey also don't bother with travel insurance and then complain when that goes wrong too. It is one of the biggest purchases you will make and a small price to pay if after you move in you discover you need to fork out £7k upward for a new roof.

As @cliffdiver says, any pending work will be discovered by the solicitor and the reserve fund should (emphasise should) cover it. If there's not enough in the reserve fund then that's pause for thought.

I'm now leaning towards just having a Homebuyers. The issues I'm concerned about would be revealed from the LE form. If it turns out a new roof is planning in the near future and there's not enough in the reserve fund then I would ask my solicitor to tell the vendor they need to fork out for that before they sell to me.

NB I clarified management fee, ground rent and length of lease before offering on the flat.

I was a property manager (block rather than individual properties) for a few years.

I would say it was 50/50 on buildings that did / did not have sufficient reserve funds.

I would be very, very wary of buying a property in a building that does not have a reserve fund.

The timeframe for demanding money for major works (in accordance with the terms of the Lease) can be very short, one property I took over was demanding c.£14k per Leaseholder for external work.

Initial notice to payment demand was a matter of months.

If you can, I would recommend becoming a director of the resident management company for the building.

Also, I'm happy to be collected, but it's my understanding that the vendor cannot just 'fork out' for major works.

Monies need to be legally requested, following the Section 21 process.

If monies collected were not part of this process (even if willingly given at the time), then they are being illegally held, and the contributors could in the future request them back by taking legal proceedings against the management company.

I've had a full survey on an upstairs flat. Can't recall if they managed to access the downstairs flat but the survey highlighted major damp downstairs, plus other issues a homebuyer's report would never have discovered. I'm having a full survey on a duplex next week, they are using telescopic cameras (it's a three floor building so ladders are tricky) for the roof and have requested access to the downstairs garden flat to inspect the outside.

I'd ask the surveyor what/how they intend to carry out the survey.

Sorry meant to say, the damp downstairs was creeping upstairs so it helped me with price negotiations.

@cliffdiver thank you for your very helpful posts as a former property manager of a block (which this is as well). I will look into becoming a director although I understand this isn't always possible? I think most of my concerns could be addressed through my solicitor concerning the reserve fund, and I'm tending towards a homebuyers report now. However @Kai1981 has benefited from a full survey on an upstairs flat -
I'm going to speak to the surveyors and take it from there.

I should say, the properties I'm talking about are all Victorian. If it's newer, it might now be as necessary.

I suspected they were, @Kai1981 - not sure why - perhaps mention of garden flat although newer places have these too.
My flat looks like it was built in the 80s or 90s. Something the survey will confirm if nothing else! Can't find anything online about when it was built and I'm curious to know. Definitely newer though.

Update - I've booked a homebuyers report as the surveyor themselves recommended this. They actually said there's no point in a full survey.