AIBU to want to renegotiate purchase price?

[Ftb2021]

I'm a ftb purchasing a 1930s house. When I viewed i saw it needed a new kitchen (about 20-30 years old) and decoration throughout. It was advertised as having a recent rewire. Given this i put an offer in at asking which was around market value for the area.

I've since had a survey and discovered that the roof needs some urgent repairs and will need replacing in a few years, they've don't some repointing but its "messy" and cracks are starting to reappear, the surveyor noticed something was off with the consumer unit so got a EICR which was unsatisfactory but the repair works will only be about £600. The total costs of urgent works excluding kitchen are now £8k. I sucked it up as part and parcel of buying an older property.

Now I've found out no building regs for removal of wall and chimney breast. They've offered indemnity but that would put me in a potentially awkward position if I decided to do an extension which I was hoping to do in a few years. There's no drawings relating to the work so I could pay for it to be redone and get the work done.

I've explained the above and asked the EA if the vendor would accept a small reduction (half the costs of the above work). Shes refusing to pass it on until she sees the mortgage valuation. Am I being unreasonable to expect her to pass this along? I don't want to pull out but the lack of regs would make it difficult for me to see it as a home I could have for longer than a few years.

i dont think youre unreasonable at all - she should pass it on - i think what you have said is totally fair, and if i was a seller in their position, i would accept it - 4k off is nothing (if i have understood right!)

Have you thought about requesting full amount off then theirs room for negotiation?
Your definitely not unreasonable for asking.
Just be aware if they haven't gone down the correct channels then you may uncover other issues.
I discovered all sorts of issues with our 1930s house after moving in (including extension roof not attached to house, sand under laminate instead of a concrete floor, no insulation in an extention the list goes on.) I don't regret buying it but it has cost more than expected and is taking longer to complete the house because of this.

@TrustTheGeneGenie thanks thats what I had thought too but her response just threw me

You are not being at all unreasonable in asking for a price reduction in respect of the £8K and the EA knows this, it's common for such reductions to be requested after a survey shows up major (ish) probs like this. My main concern would be the structural work (chimney breast/wall removal). The reason you need bldg regs is so that bldg control can be satisfied that the work has been done correctly and the structural integrity of the house has not been compromised. This is major structural work and I would be concerned about a vendor who has done work like this without getting it certified. All the indemnity policy will do is cover you in the event that bldg control find out and fine you, it won't cover the cost of any remedial work thatmay turn out to be necessary. And you have no way of knowing if the house is structurally safe. Sorry but this would be ringing very loud alarm bells for me. If you still want to go ahead I would strongly advise you to get a structural engineer to have a look at the house.

@Whatdoesitsayaboutyou Exactly. My concerns are a lot about what hasn't been uncovered. I had thought about doing that and now regretting i went in so low especially given the response from the EA as I felt i was being quite fair. I find this whole thing a bit of a minefield to be honest.

Sorry to hear about the stuff you uncovered but it will be so worth it once its all done and distant memory im sure!

I wouldn't be going ahead with the sale with that list of problems. a £4k reduction will not compensate you for all the grief you will get as you try to sort that lot out. Also - check the affordability maths for what happens if you get this reduction. A £4k reduction does not put £4k more in your pocket to put towards all the work needed on the house, unless you also arrange to borrow the difference on your mortgage which might put you in a less advantageous LTV category with your lender, which then changes the interest rate charged on the whole amount you borrow. Successfully renegotiating the price and finding yourself with a massive bill for repairs and rectifications and all you have to show for it is £2.50 per month less on your monthly mortgage payment is not a great outcome.

Always amazed at how much people can take on without blinking. Great if you are a seller I guess. In any other transactions, hidden defects would be central, discussed and most likely accounted for in a revised price, else the buyer would pull out (not even business, thinking second hand car for instance). But when it’s a house, buyer may fork out several thousands if not tens of thousands so to not “lose” a house. Scary stuff

Remember whatever issues are flagging for you now could be potential issues when you come to sell in the future.

If it were me and I really wanted the house I'd insist on

1. 8k reduction in response to surveys works
2. the seller gets retrospective building regs for the chimney works

If 1 and 2 aren't met I'd pull out.

What’s the overall purchase price?

Of course you can ask, but as you said, most of what your survey has flagged up is part and parcel of an old house so I wouldn’t be surprised if they say no.

Without wanting to sound patronising, yours is a very first-time-buyers attitude to buying
Partly because the surveyors cover their arses by pointing out every last fault and put fear into you that it all needs to be done.

When did the chimney breast get removed? Was it before building regs were required? If so, an indemnity will be fine. It’s only ftbs that worry about these, so just make sure you don’t sell on to one

Incidentally, the last time I sold to a FTB, they wanted to drop the price because I was unable to provide FENSA certificates for the windows.
They were Victorian sashes. Needless to say, they paid the original price in the end but it did flag up how clueless them and their solicitor were...

Absolutely no way would I buy a house without the necessary building regs. I'd cut your losses if I were you.

Why won’t you show the vendor the mortgage valuation? Shes refusing to pass it on until she sees the mortgage valuation
Does it say the house is worth what you offered, despite the flaws?

If the work was done more than 20 years ago, it’s too late for the council to start any enforcement action, and it’s long enough to demonstrate the work was fine.

If that’s the sort of timescale since the work was done, you would be mad to pull out of the purchase of a house you otherwise like.
If it was done a few years ago as a DIY project, it’s a bit dodgier but still under a grand to resolve unless it’s been done badly.

Unless your lender is making a fuss about it, an indemnity policy is more than fine. Chimney breasts badly removed will show up problems very quickly so this isn’t a potential ticking time bomb, it’s just an admin job

I would definitely negotiate on this - and I am not a FTB.
In fact I just re-negotiated an asking price offer on our purchase due to issues very similar to the ones you have.
We did this after getting quotes on the actual cost of the repair work.We split it 60/40 with the buyer accepting the majority of the costs I also got them to get the retrospective building certs.
It is totally possible and the EA should be used to this happening - especially as you offered asking price to start.

Of course it's reasonable to renegotiate for expensive, urgent works. The lack of building regs would make me wonder if they were generally slapdash/ into DIY jobs. You need more information on this.
Put it in an email with your reasons and, if appropriate, the relevant sections from the survey attached.

Thanks for everyone's responses. What a mixed bunch of opinions!

The purchase price is £140k and thats what's on the mortgage valuation so the ask is about 3%. I would be left with the cash as I have quite a big deposit and it wouldn't affect the LTV.

The previous owners did the work. Theyve been there for about 10 years and whenever I ask anything about the work it didn't come up for them and they don't know how long ago it was done.

Thanks for the advice re structural engineer. I'm going to look into that.

Are the quotes from actual tradesmen? Because our full building survey listed out the issues and estimated repair costs. The reality once we moved in and got quotes was that the surveyor had significantly underestimated the costs!! Very irritating and we have no recourse to complain to the surveyor as his were estimates that he caveated. For our next house move, I’ll get my own roofer and electrician in to quote before I buy!!

@AmazoniaBun thanks for the heads up. I've managed to get a few quotes which so far have been pretty much in line with the surveyors estimates. But a lot of trades have been reluctant to quote as I don't own the house! One roofer wanted to charge £150 to give me a quote

You can’t really reduce price to put in a new kitchen as that’s visible upon valuation and viewing but the other stuff you deffo should

I've never had a surveyor value s House for less than the agreed price (and I have bought about a dozen properties in the last ten years). The mortgage valuation is not the same as a surveyor valuation, so not sure why the agent is asking for it unless she thinks it is actual proof of the buildings worth.
Either go through your solicitor about renegotiation or tell the agent that you are not proceeding unless she informs her clients.

If the house is valued at £140k in its current state, and that's the price you agreed, then YABU in asking for a deduction. That's the point the EA is making.

As a pp said, a surveyor will be covering. if the roof needs doing "in a few years" that's not something that warrants a reduction. The lack of building regs needs investigating tho. Don't think it's a deal breaker.

At the end of the day how much have you already committed to the purchase? If the seller puts it back on the market, how much would you lose? You can ask, but be prepared for all scenarios, negative as well as hopefully positive.