Agonising over rear extension in Kingston area

[VL2020]

Dear ladies,

We are in the process of buying a smaller detached period house in Kingston. The house has been with the current owners forever and they've done loft extension in the 80s that needs re-doing. The loft is relatively easy to do with some minimum disruption so we are happy to start right after moving in.

The worrying bit is the rear and side extension... we have a pre-schooler and a baby under way in summer. Despite having the budget for extension we probably have to live in the property during the whole renovation period as Kingston is a relatively expensive area to rent. I'm concerned that extending the ground and the first floor over garage is a highly disruptive job, however, I've never experienced it unlike the loft. My husband's argument is to go for the full extension while we got the funds to do it...

Sorry for the rambling of a pg brain :) the question is who has has been in a similar situation and what sort of advise would you give yourself if you'd do it all over again? Would you go for the extension or leave it as it is? Did the extension take forever? I'm very grateful If you read thus far :D I wanted to attach a floor plan but failed on the app

I haven’t extended but tried to and then had to change our plans so I would say, make sure you have the money in place and it’s enough to do what you want. If it were me and I had the money, wouldn’t over stretch etc etc then I’d do it in one go and get it over with. You can always try and find an air bnb for any weeks that are completely unbearable (which is what my neighbour did for a month).

We were hoping to live out for our extension but planning has taken forever and eight months in to renting we've given up and are moving back in just as work is about to start as it was eating in to our budget.

But our extension is two storey and basically just an add on to the back, no steels required. So it'll be built and then once almost complete the knock through will happen for just two doorways. The builders are really nice and they'll have side access so won't be in the house at all. Can you organise your extension so they can build it without needing access through the house?

We have just completed a 2 storey extension (although still odd bits of finishing and landscaping ongoing). We started last february. The build dragged on and on and we lived in the house throughout. It was pretty stressful and to be honest I would not do another building project although the timing with covid certainly didn't help.

Could you do it in 2 halves, so get the loft sorted out first and then move into the upper floors when the downstairs gets done. You can get temporary kitchens etc from Ikea. We did it, albeit without kids, and we set up a temporary kitchen/ lounge in the front bedroom which was fine. I think with kids it would be ok over the summer, as you could be out and about for most of it and then give yourself some nice holidays/ stay with family from time to time.

If you haven't started planning yet then you are likely months away from starting. Whether or not you need planning permission you will almost certainly need a building warrant. Some go through super easy! Ours was a nightmare... with building control making us specify down to the exact manufacturer for windows and UFH.

Also, don't underestimate how long it takes to get proper quotes. Our main contractor took months and many of our individual ones weeks.

I would thoroughly recommend using that time to make as many decisions as possible.

Kitchen units, doors, worktops?
Appliances?
Floor?
Windows?
Doors (internal and external)?
Sockets (where and what style)?
Lights (style, type, where and where do you want switches)
Paint (colour and brand)?

I have been at this for a year now and we still haven't started digging (was supposed to start first week in Feb but we were a foot under snow and now builders are playing catch up). I still have key decisions to make but I'm confident that by the time the extension is underway I'll have made them all in advance, hopefully reducing some of the stress and minimising mistakes. It also reduces costs if you don't make chnages to the plan part way through. And it'll help you start an accurate estimate now (builder quotes often assume lowest spec so costs quickly escalate when you up spec).

As for living in it... this extension is unbelievably expensive (nearly double the budget we gave the architect and thats not with high spec anything) so we have not got anything left to rent. Luckily my mum lives 45 minutes down the road and has space for us but we can only make that work in school holidays (eldest in school nursery). I have a 2 year old, 3 year old and a baby due in July.

Unfortunately absolutely everything in our build is interdependent so trying to isolate bits wr can do in advance etc has not worked. We are reconfiguring the ground floor and having new boiler, hot and cold water tanks, system pump and water treatment (private water). We could almost have done the entire extension without knocking into the existing house except that i want the UFH manifold in a cupboard in the existing house and that kills it!

In short (cos this is now mammoth)... you need a plan of how the work will happen and where the services etc are and then you can plan whether you can majority of extension without impacting existing house.

If you do decide to live in it, aside from lack of kitchen etc the biggest impact will be the dust. Do not underestimate it, it will be epic! Inches of rhe stuff and absolutely everywhere. No matter how many times you clean it up. It will keep reappearing til weeks after the builders leave.

You get zip up protector things for doors on Amazon. Buy them and use them so at least you can keep some of it out of bedrooms etc.

Good luck!

I think it would be doable - we did it with a young child but quotes from builders might be slightly higher. Are they going to be able to block off a current kitchen area for you to use until they knock through? You want to have as little time as possible using temporary cooking facilities.
I also think that unfortunately now you won’t be able to get it done before baby comes so you need to wait to start til they’re a bit older. For me that would be when they’re 3 months old but might be different for you. Remember you’ll have noise that might disturb naps and you might have to let people in in the morning

You can't really plan to live in it unless you can create a safe space and at least a kitchenette that is closed off from the build. If this is possible go for it and then just move out for the last bit when they have to knock down the last walls (if that makes sense). I did a few renovations and lived in them whilst work was underway... then tried to do one with a 1 year old... I moved in with my mother after one day and stayed there for months!

@Asgoodasarest

I haven’t extended but tried to and then had to change our plans so I would say, make sure you have the money in place and it’s enough to do what you want. If it were me and I had the money, wouldn’t over stretch etc etc then I’d do it in one go and get it over with. You can always try and find an air bnb for any weeks that are completely unbearable (which is what my neighbour did for a month).

Thank you for sharing your experience, yes, budgeting is another problem if we have to airbnb as it is quite expensive in Kingston even for the tiniest of flats :(

@LittleOverwhelmed

We are currently doing a small extension and that involved knocking down some walls and inserting quite a bit of steel (to open the space up). I really wanted to stay (to avoid the added cost - about £8.5k in rent 😳), but we couldn’t have. 4.5 weeks on the noise has been horrendous, no kitchen or utility, the back corner of the house open to the elements, they actually turned off the electricity too. Ok, the night have done things different if we had stayed, but... Husband is WFH and DS is home schooling. If we had all been at work / school, it might have worked....

Depends what you are doing really. Walls coming down, structural work? Major electrical works? Have you already got planning permission (sounds like not)? So you wouldn’t be starting until at least the Summer? With a new baby?

I think it is good to do it all in one hot, if you cam, but not whilst you are there.

I also note that it is pretty stressful. We have an “all in one” company doing ours, but it is still taking a lot of brain power: the PM doesn’t seem to listen very well... Unless your husband is dealing with all of it (and can juggle that with work AND helping you with the new baby and toddler...).

Thank you for sharing your experience, the lockdown certainly hasnt made it easier for your and your family..... In our case some walls are coming down and some steel might be needed! The loft doesnt need a PP per se and we have applied for the rear extension already. Realistically yes, we wont be starting earlier than May and the baby is due in July... I got to admit that brainpower is on a low at the moment and I wont be able to take adequate decisions... My husband seems to be overly optimistic and I am a bit of a pessimist hehe

@beggingforsleep

We were hoping to live out for our extension but planning has taken forever and eight months in to renting we've given up and are moving back in just as work is about to start as it was eating in to our budget.

But our extension is two storey and basically just an add on to the back, no steels required. So it'll be built and then once almost complete the knock through will happen for just two doorways. The builders are really nice and they'll have side access so won't be in the house at all. Can you organise your extension so they can build it without needing access through the house?

Oh no! What a nightmare! You poor thing. We have not received out approval yet and should there be any delays won't move out. How's your extension going so far? To answer your question we have tried to communicate our desire for the minimum disturbance/dust for the rear extension but it seems nearly impossible (from the builder's point of view and we have no experience)

@Weepingwillow22

We have just completed a 2 storey extension (although still odd bits of finishing and landscaping ongoing). We started last february. The build dragged on and on and we lived in the house throughout. It was pretty stressful and to be honest I would not do another building project although the timing with covid certainly didn't help.

Congratulation on the completion of your project!!! Must be so exciting! The lockdown certainly didnt help you... what a nightmare... Was it worth it at the end?

I would not even countenance this with a very young baby.
I've done it and lived through it. It wasn't bad to be honest but with a near newborn? Nope. Sorry.

@Muststopeating

If you haven't started planning yet then you are likely months away from starting. Whether or not you need planning permission you will almost certainly need a building warrant. Some go through super easy! Ours was a nightmare... with building control making us specify down to the exact manufacturer for windows and UFH.

Also, don't underestimate how long it takes to get proper quotes. Our main contractor took months and many of our individual ones weeks.

I would thoroughly recommend using that time to make as many decisions as possible.

Kitchen units, doors, worktops?
Appliances?
Floor?
Windows?
Doors (internal and external)?
Sockets (where and what style)?
Lights (style, type, where and where do you want switches)
Paint (colour and brand)?

I have been at this for a year now and we still haven't started digging (was supposed to start first week in Feb but we were a foot under snow and now builders are playing catch up). I still have key decisions to make but I'm confident that by the time the extension is underway I'll have made them all in advance, hopefully reducing some of the stress and minimising mistakes. It also reduces costs if you don't make chnages to the plan part way through. And it'll help you start an accurate estimate now (builder quotes often assume lowest spec so costs quickly escalate when you up spec).

As for living in it... this extension is unbelievably expensive (nearly double the budget we gave the architect and thats not with high spec anything) so we have not got anything left to rent. Luckily my mum lives 45 minutes down the road and has space for us but we can only make that work in school holidays (eldest in school nursery). I have a 2 year old, 3 year old and a baby due in July.

Unfortunately absolutely everything in our build is interdependent so trying to isolate bits wr can do in advance etc has not worked. We are reconfiguring the ground floor and having new boiler, hot and cold water tanks, system pump and water treatment (private water). We could almost have done the entire extension without knocking into the existing house except that i want the UFH manifold in a cupboard in the existing house and that kills it!

In short (cos this is now mammoth)... you need a plan of how the work will happen and where the services etc are and then you can plan whether you can majority of extension without impacting existing house.

If you do decide to live in it, aside from lack of kitchen etc the biggest impact will be the dust. Do not underestimate it, it will be epic! Inches of rhe stuff and absolutely everywhere. No matter how many times you clean it up. It will keep reappearing til weeks after the builders leave.

You get zip up protector things for doors on Amazon. Buy them and use them so at least you can keep some of it out of bedrooms etc.

Good luck!

Thank you so much for your thorough reply and experience. You sound like a pro! We have submitted our plans already (for the rear extension) and the loft is a permitted development according to our architect. The building regs are of course important and I don't really know how smooth is the process in our borough. We have spoken to one of the neighbours who did their rear extension in 2019 and our construction company did it in three months.... I still cannot believe their luck and am a bit of a pessimist if I'm honest... As to the dust yes, we are worried about it and don't think we can avoid it. How's your extension going so far? Have you started the foundation? I really feel for you, it must have been a nightmare with the lockdown slowing things down and all...

@RuggeryBuggery

I think it would be doable - we did it with a young child but quotes from builders might be slightly higher. Are they going to be able to block off a current kitchen area for you to use until they knock through? You want to have as little time as possible using temporary cooking facilities. I also think that unfortunately now you won’t be able to get it done before baby comes so you need to wait to start til they’re a bit older. For me that would be when they’re 3 months old but might be different for you. Remember you’ll have noise that might disturb naps and you might have to let people in in the morning

Wow how did you find it with a child? How old was yours at the time of the renovation? Our builder is really optimistic and says we can definitely stay in the house during the rear extension. I just cant comprehend how its done but yes, a temporary kitchen has been mentioned. The builder even asked me whether I'm planning to breastfeed or not in case I need a kitchen unit in the loft ha ha! I actually agree with you and feel that starting later this year, around autumn, might work for us

@Aalvarino

I would not even countenance this with a very young baby. I've done it and lived through it. It wasn't bad to be honest but with a near newborn? Nope. Sorry.

Thank you for your opinion, I am inclined to agree with you :)

@Grimbelina

You can't really plan to live in it unless you can create a safe space and at least a kitchenette that is closed off from the build. If this is possible go for it and then just move out for the last bit when they have to knock down the last walls (if that makes sense). I did a few renovations and lived in them whilst work was underway... then tried to do one with a 1 year old... I moved in with my mother after one day and stayed there for months!

Thank you very much for sharing your experience, hehe moving in with my mother might be a solution but it can also be hard with a toddler and a newborn

I think autumn is much more sensible. It might be fine if your newborn is a champion sleeper but if you get a pukey screamy version it will be very stressful indeed. Imagine being up all night with a fussy baby only to be woken by an angle grinder when you finally nod off at 8am. By October you should know which model of baby you have :)

@Heronwatcher

Could you do it in 2 halves, so get the loft sorted out first and then move into the upper floors when the downstairs gets done. You can get temporary kitchens etc from Ikea. We did it, albeit without kids, and we set up a temporary kitchen/ lounge in the front bedroom which was fine. I think with kids it would be ok over the summer, as you could be out and about for most of it and then give yourself some nice holidays/ stay with family from time to time.

We are going to do the loft right away, it's a fairly easy project and we've done that before. Our builder also advises to do the work throughout the summer but I'm not too keen on having a child in the middle of a full blown rear extension hehe

I did similar but smaller while living in the house. We lived on microwave meals and the kindness of friends for a month. It was messy and noisy. We had no privacy, builders were everywhere. It was difficult to use the garden because there was building equipment there.
I hate to be the voice of doom but there's no way at all I would do this with a small baby if I had a choice. If you don't have a choice then you'll survive if you can set up a temporary kitchen and the builders are only in one area of your house. But if they're downstairs and upstairs at the same time that would be a complete nightmare.