Can neighbour object to permitted development extension?

[SenoraSurf]

We own a semi detached house and want to build an extension on the back, under permitted development. We have submitted building regs already.

Our neighbour in adjoining semi has written a snotty letter asking what we're doing (and strongly advising us to inform her), after she has noticed my husband doing some digging in our garden to check out ground type. She insists this 'excavation' could undermine her property's foundations- even though the area my husband dug is only 50cm deep and 3m away from the rear of our houses. Once we get the go ahead from building control, we would do the digging for the footings.

We have had issues with this neighbour before. History: The boundary between our homes belongs to us yet when we tried to repair the boundary, after speaking to her and explained our plans when we moved in, she went absolutely mad and said the boundary was hers... it's wonky as hell and zig zags massively over her land and ours but to save hassle, we just covered it over on our side.

Can this neighbour object/do anything about our proposed rear extension? We plan to build up to but not on the boundary (the fence will stay there). That obviously means the footings will be dug parallel to the boundary.

Advice and experiences welcomed.

She cannot stop you extending your house via permitted development. Why are you so scared of her? Get professional plans drawn up and get the party wall agreement in place. It’s making a mountain out of a molehill. What do you think she could actually do?

What the vendor says about a fence isn’t gospel. If it’s not marked as yours on the deeds it might well be a shared boundary. Just forget about it. What have you lost? 6 inches?

The info about foundations above is wrong too. It’s older houses that tend to have shallow foundations. Since building regs came in, modern houses have foundations designed to take ground conditions into account. Our extension has 2m deep foundations. The depth of foundations on your land for your extension won’t make any difference to her house. Her house is supported by her foundations, not your garden that is some distance away. However make sure you dig from your land/side only and make sure you understand how extensions join to existing properties and what depth of foundations are needed. Don't cut corners.

Don’t do a garden room if you can afford an extension. You have every right to do an extension, but I would get it designed professionally so there’s no argument about foundations etc. Make sure it’s all on your land and set it back a bit from the boundary for an easier life.

She can object all she likes, but you are entitled to build (within the rules). She can dissent the PWA but it won’t stop you.

Our neighbour tried everything, but despite her year long tantrum, we are building.

I don’t need think you need a PWA. If you are building entirely on your land, so gutters etc don’t overhang the boundary and the foundations of your extension won’t be deeper than the house foundations (so if your house is newish) then PWA aren’t necessary.

You can build without serving a PWA anyway. Your neighbour would have to employ a solicitor and pay costly legal fees to challenge you. However, this could lead to being costly to you if it turned out you did need one and she has any damage to her house because you won’t be able to prove you didn’t cause it. But again, she would have to pay upfront all the legal costs to take you to court.

However, I know all this because I have been on the other side of it. Talk to your neighbour and LISTEN to her concerns. Explain what you are building and why. Ask her concerns and listen. Try and make it the least bad experience for her.

Don’t just ignore her and build without even having the courtesy of speaking to her first. This is going to impact on her for no benefit. The least you can do is to talk to her.

I agree with Hmmph about talking to your neighbour. (You may have already done this, of course).

My neighbours had a loft extension built a few years ago. They came round to see me with the plans, discussed it with me, explained about the party wall etc. I didn't have an issue with it at all, but I think that's partly because they dealt with it so well. If they'd sprung it on me, or the first I'd known was when the builders turned up, I might well have reacted quite differently.

You have to serve the Party Wall Notice at least 2 months before you start work if you need one.

If you want to try to avoid a PWA, you could get your builder to dig a small hole/ trench to see how deep your foundations are. If they're deep enough so your extension won't go deeper, you can crack on with the work. The difficulty comes if you find out you do need a PWA. The builder has to down tools for at least 2 months and you have to live with a big hole in your garden for a while.

I really wouldn't recommend starting work without a PWA if you need one although @Hmmph says it's possible. Yes, your neighbour would have to instruct solicitors to try to stop you but you could potentially be responsible for significant legal costs.

Thank you so much for all your responses.

Ive drafted up a notice of PWA for her and will be going ahead with appointing a surveyor when she inevitably objects. This post has clarified it all nicely and made me realise that getting a surveyor involved is nothing to be scared of, albeit more costly.

We definitely need a pwa as are building lower than her foundations within 3m, which is crystal clear to me now thankfully.

Luckily because it's excavations for extension foundations, we only have to serve 1 month notice.

We tried talking to her, she was lovely and polite and accepted our ideas to our face and then sent snotty letters behind our backs.

As much as I want her to sign the agreement straight away, I feel like a surveyor involved would give us more security in the long run anyway.

You are completely right to get the PWA. It’s protection for you. It will also include “before” photos and you can agree to working hours to make it easier for her to live with the work. I would consider positioning of the extension so you can maintain it on that side. Guttering, etc. Don’t make life more difficult by needing to use her garden for access for maintenance.

Read this - hoa.org.uk/advice/guides-for-homeowners/i-am-improving/party-wall-agreement/#:~:text=Serving%20a%20party%20wall%20notice&text=A%20homeowner%20has%20to%20give,a%20year%20to%20start%20work.

Just use the standard form, and give it to your neighbour. Have someone film you posting through the letterbox so the date can't be argued, if you like. She'll presumably ignore it and be presumed to have dissented. You'll know exactly where you stand then and can complete the process.

Do you have a Lawful Development Certificate? If not I would obtain one as this prevents her trying to seek any planning enforcement action from the local council. Not necessary could save you a headache in the long run.

You could always build without getting the party wall agreement, however you are taking a gamble. If you’re neighbour is unlikely to know or find out what a party wall agreement is, then you may get away with it. If she is smart, and on the ball she may get an injunction out on you, which will stop the works until you’ve sorted the agreement. However no extra cost incurred at this point, just a delay.
However, if she claimed you’ve damaged something retrospectively and has the means to take you to court, she has a better chance of winning, you may well then find out your insurance is invalid and then your at risk of losing your home if you can’t afford the damages.
So depends if you fancy taking that gamble.

On a separate note, it might pay to tell your insurer prior to starting, to check you have adequate cover.

Her house insurance could cover her suing you too. Yours will not pay for a defence

No one should be advising the OP to take a gamble! It is simply not the best advice. It is best to get the PWA and if the neighbour dissents you can still have an agreement. Just take a bit longer. It is protection though.

The way people are talking about the neighbour suing, and rubbish like that, is really what could happen if you take the stupid gamble. You just get the PWA, design the extension properly and build! Like everyone else does. Most house insurance will not cover you dueing a neighbour for what they can legally do. Just do it legally. No issues then.

You can use the money for the extension to buy a bigger house to avoid all these headaches. That's we did

Served the PWA notice today and have rung round local surveyors to get some quotes and time scales
I must admit, I felt very smug posting the envelope through her door, as I saw her spying on me through her blinds!
Fingers crossed everything goes relatively smoothly

It's official! We're in a dispute and she's opting for her own surveyor.

Beluga. Hope it's done quick!

If you want to save cash it is possible to use the same surveyor. So you don't have to choose one and let her choose another, you can just jointly instruct one she has chosen. That would save a bit of cash and hopefully keep her happy.
The other thing is regarding the working hours. If they decree any we hours they would only apply for any work on the party structures. So even if it's 10am until 4pm on Mondays only, that won't matter for most of the work. It would be most relevant if you agree to have people working on her side or scaffolding on her land etc. Any work on your own structures would not be affected.

ah well, good luck to her. She is most probably labouring under the false impression that she can stop this by being awkward and disruptive. Try not to get worked up. Good tip from Johnd2

Dispute just means she has her own surveyor and they negotiate with yours. There will be a reasonable agreement because the surveyors ensure this happens. It’s no big deal and frankly the neighbour should dispute. Anyone accepting what one person says is not looking out for themselves. That doesn’t mean they can be unreasonable and professional surveyors will readily agree. Don’t worry.

Naturally I'm stressed as she is being very hostile about it all. She's taking it all very personally and being overly petty.

We tried suggesting an agreed surveyor but she said no and that she doesn't want him to be biased by our fakery 🙄 but hey ho.

I'm hoping it's not going to be an overly long and drawn out process

Best of luck, OP. I’ll be in your shoes in a few months’ time...

@SenoraSurf
Have you resolved the party wall agreement yet?

Make sure she here’s you pop a bottle of bubbly when you do.

Just to say, our neighbours who we get on very well with planned an extension and we still insisted on a PWA and our own surveyor. It cost them more but they completely understood that it was very sensible to protect our interests in our most valuable asset, and in fact our chap spotted their architect was doing something he shouldn’t have been doing so it was well worth it. So technically we were in dispute but it’s just a phrase to describe the legal process...what I am trying to say is it’s perfectly normal, nothing to stress about, and won’t stop you building your extension. Hope all goes well x

No it's still ongoing. Surveyor reckons we should have the award in place by the middle of feb but by the time we include the 2 weeks she has to appeal the award, we're looking at the start of March. It's dragging as we're literally on pause now until we get the award finalised

To top it off, we also have a planning permission application in for a front extension (which was planned meticulously to ensure it wouldn't impact her at all), yet she has payed a chartered surveyor to write a 9 page objection which annoyingly was submitted 10 days after the neighbour consultation period expired. It's all waffle but obviously it says the right buzzwords for the planning officer to have to pay attention to it!

The cherry on the cake was the objection said the applicant (me) should pursue alternative extension options including a rear or side extension even though she is fighting tooth and nail to stop us doing the rear extension. She also doesn't know that we have a major sewer under the side area of our house and they won't let us build over it anyway

Can't wait till all this is resolved and we can crack on!

Still. Waiting. 10 weeks later