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Original poster

right of way across property- problem?

29 replies

IamwhoIsayIam · 02/01/2021 20:51

I've looked at an end terrace house with a lovely garden which neighbours have been habitually using as a cut through to get from the front of their house to the back of their house.
There is a footpath to all the front doors and a footpath to all the back doors but cutting through the end house garden saves time.
It looks like it has been like that a long time as the garden is hedged all round but there is a gap and the remains of a path.
The right of way is not in the deeds.

I'm happy with neighbours having access when needed but I would want to put gates in to create a better boundary for the kids and our dogs when they are in the garden. I'd also not want the neighbours dogs able to just bound in. With a gate at least someone has to stop and open it. This would also make it less appealing as a short cut.

Anyone got any experience of right of way? Can I just stick a gate in?

OP posts:
DeeplyMovingExperience · 02/01/2021 21:21

My parents had a nightmare with a right of way across the back of their house. The ROW was in the deeds and there was nothing they could do about it, and the neighbour acted like a dick.

You need to find out if this is an actual right of way, or just a neighbourly arrangement. And you then need to let the neighbour know that you won't be continuing with it when the current house-owner moves out.

Personally I would recommend that you let the neighbour know this BEFORE you buy the house, in case he/she turns out to be a dick as well. The last thing you want is to move into a house with a neighbour problem.

Floralnomad · 02/01/2021 21:24

If it was a legal ROW I personally wouldn’t touch it with a very long barge pole , if it’s just a long-standing arrangement I’d make it clear from the start that it is over and put a locked gate in .

Original poster
IamwhoIsayIam · 02/01/2021 21:32

It's not in the deeds but as I understand it if its been used as a ROW for 20 years it becomes a ROW through use. The houses are 100+ years so quite likely it could fall under this without being in the deeds.

I'm tempted to door knock now and discuss with neighbours to get a feel for it.

OP posts:
DeeplyMovingExperience · 02/01/2021 21:35

Definitely have that conversation with the neighbour. I would never buy a house with any kind of ROW.

gottakeeponmovin · 02/01/2021 21:38

Everyone I know with a ROW has ended up getting pissed off with it. I would never buy a property with a ROW and after 20 years it's legal

Reedwarbler · 02/01/2021 22:48

No, don't buy it. It could be a major bone of contention with your neighbours, and will also affect resale. Walk away.

RainingBatsAndFrogs · 03/01/2021 11:46

If it isn’t a ROW it isn’t a ROW.

They have their own paths to their back gardens. Surely that makes it hard for them to argue that they have any right to use your garden as a short cut.

Ask your solicitor’s opinion as to whether they could claim any rights.

Then I would just put a fence round your property and communicate politely with the neighbours and explain you have fenced your garden in to make it secure for your kids and dogs.

Pinotpleasure · 03/01/2021 11:51

Maybe the current owner is fed up with it and that’s why they are selling up!

LIZS · 03/01/2021 11:54

It might have become a permissive path over time. Do you really want to fall out with new neighbours by reestablishing the original row only ?

Rulesdontapplytome · 03/01/2021 14:57

Speak to your conveyancer first to find out whether or not you are entitled to stop people using it as a cut through. If they have right of way, you may wish to pull out.
Then talk to your potential new neighbours that will be affected and gauge their response. There’s no point buying, if you’re going to end up with a sour start. If they seem they’ll live with it, then erect a fence, or install a gate with a lock on it.
It might be an idea to make good the other path that they will use, if it is in a poor state.

VinylDetective · 03/01/2021 16:19

My son lived in an end terrace which had access across his garden for the house next door to put out their bins. They blocked off the front door and used the access all the time. It nearly drove him demented. They were absolute bastards which didn’t help.

Chumleymouse · 03/01/2021 17:12

We have a ROW at the side of our garden , it’s not really a problem for us and it’s behind the garage and it’s walled from the drive, it has access for 3 neighbours ( one hardly ever uses it ) , after 2 viewings I didn’t even know we owned it, I just thought it was a path , it came up when the solicitor did the searches. It’s worked out ok for us as we own the bit of land we can work on the garage side with having to be on the boundary and asking neighbours for permission.

In your case I would just tell them you are putting gates on for safety because of children and pets .

Bargebill19 · 03/01/2021 17:19

If it is a right of way, however well you get on with your neighbours and how easy a gate you install, there is always one person who sees zero need for shutting the gate properly. You have animals and children - be very wary. Our ‘lovely’ neighbour couldn’t be bothered to shut our gate more than once - we were very lucky our dog didn’t get killed on the main road. Even with a padlock gate installed people didn’t see the point in locking it to protect others. (Gated community )

RainingBatsAndFrogs · 03/01/2021 17:53

Most of these replies ignore the fact that the OP Said
A) It is not shown as a Right of Way in the deeds
And
B) The other houses have a proper foot path which is the access to their houses.

Ask your solicitor about the legality
Ask the vendors for their story as to why the neighbours cut across the garden

A house owner fencing off their own private land where there is no legal ROW is less unneighbourly than neighbours being CFs and cutting through someone else’s garden.

There may be unpleasant neighbours, well worth checking out, but most people would be reasonable in the face of new owners discussing in a friendly but clear way that the short cut is now closed.

My parents live in a picturesque village where every other property has a flying freehold, a right of access of some kind, even if just for maintenance, shared alleys, paths and drives. The vast majority manage this without friction or stress.

PresentingPercy · 03/01/2021 18:49

There is no automatic assumption that a right of way is established after 20 years use. We own around 14 acres and the Open Spaces Society tried to claim a right of way through our wood. We could prove the former owner and also ourselves had sealed up the entrances to the “route” and at no time was it on the definitive map or on any deeds. Open Spaces Society vandals cut the fence wires and then tried to claim the path.
They didn’t succeed.

The important bit is that the owners have a hedge and haven’t actually agreed to the use. Therefore if you fence it and gate it, you are acting within your rights and they won’t establish use by the public. Any more than the Open Spaces Society could with us.

We did have a footpath in our garden and we got that extinguished. We did establish one to compensate - through the wood. However there is a difference between a right of way for householders and a right of way for the public! House owners have prescribed rights of way on the deeds and that’s the established position. However anyone owning land that’s abused by neighbours should fence it in. Stops any confusion.

notdaddycool · 03/01/2021 18:52

Require the vendor to put in the gate/ block it off before you purchase. They worked need to prove they’d been using it for 10+ years which may be hard.

zigzagbetty · 03/01/2021 18:59

Have you checked the neighbours deeds for any right of way easements as well?

Daphnise · 03/01/2021 20:07

I would not buy the house.

Who wants problems on a new purchase?

And it's no good relying on a chat with the people walking across the property before buying- you might not get the truth at that point.

PresentingPercy · 03/01/2021 20:27

It’s not a case of using it. It’s a case of using it and not being challenged. If there is a hedge, it’s been challenged. They have pushed the hedge apart. They would also need to submit the claim with evidence.

ballsdeep · 03/01/2021 20:29

Stay well clear op. You don't know what the neighbours are like. They may seem nice when you knock the door but may turn into arses.
And there's no way I'd be putting up fences in my own garden to give neighbours access to ampath they can reach from their own gardens

Original poster
IamwhoIsayIam · 03/01/2021 20:35

I've gone and had another look today. What appears to have happened in practice with previous owner is that they left a path between the end wall of the house but then gated and hedged the garden so the garden is 'divorced' from the house by the width of the footpath - about 30cm.
Hedges and fences were taken down for some work then not restored so hard to see exactly. Effectively we would also need to use the footpath to access the garden. On the plus side that garden is the biggest of the row!
Hopefully solicitor will be able to get to the bottom of the exact legality of it but it would work anyway if the fencing/gate was restored As @RainingBatsAndFrogs said we are in a rural community and the houses are 100+ years old so stuff like this is common.

OP posts:
Terminallysleepdeprived · 03/01/2021 20:44

There is a ROW in my deeds that gives me rear access across the 2 terraces to the left of mine (as you look at them from the front). The immediate neighbour has a gate which is only ever shut not locked, and the furthest one is used as a shop so has no boundary and they are lovely. They also let me park my car on their land at the back when I need to so a ROW is not always a bad thing. The deeds do state it is pedestrian access only so technically I can't drive my car across to my own garden. Not that there would be any point as it isn't wide enough for anything more than those little smart 2 seater things

Speak to your solicitor before you speak to the neighbours and if they have no issues I would ask the solicitor to issue a letter once contracts are exchanged to advise that the neighbourly agreement will not continue after completion.

mumwon · 03/01/2021 23:02

historic aerial photos available professional google earth can be downloaded free
with this you might be able to figure out how long this has been used

MarieG10 · 04/01/2021 08:22

Suggest you read this. There is also advice on the Gov site.

www.wrighthassall.co.uk/knowledge-base/claiming-a-right-of-way-by-prescription

However, I would be sure you are not entering into a dispute before you buy as they are grief. Conversely it is expensive legally for the other party to claim

nickymanchester · 04/01/2021 14:25

@RainingBatsAndFrogs

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