Please help me understand the 2020 new permitted development rules!

[samosamo]

Hi All, I really hope you can help me because I am confused about what we can do under PD rights now. I will be asking a architect, but it seems early stages for that yet as we are just in the process of buying. I really want to do as much as possible via PD because we are in London in a four bed house and renting with three kids under 5. It's SOOOO expensive. The mortgage on new place is cheaper, and we don't want to rent for any longer than we need to while the building is going on so we'd love to start asap upon completion rather than wait for planning permission back and forth.....

It is an edwardian terraced house, I believe, so long and thin (around 4.8m wide). It already has an extension to the rear off the kitchen at the back which is 3x3m. Typical with these houses it has that space at the side.

Development 1) I would like a side infill all the way up to the end of this extension (the side is about 1.5m wide) to create a wrap around. My rough calculations are that this would create an area of around 23m squared (including the existing 3x3 extension) with the original area of the house being around 52m squared (the latter a conservative estimate looking at the plans). Practically i am wondering whether I need planning permission for this wrap around given it is less than half the original area? Or s it ok under PD?

2. Next, I wondered about putting an extension above the rear extension. This would be about 9 sq m as the extension downstairs is 3.3m. However, I'm not sure the space it would create would be worth the extra expense and inconvenience to build. The bedroom it would back into on the first floor is already 3 metres wide by 4 metres long, adding another 3 metres to make it 3m wide by 7m long seems pointless. I wondered whether it could be made separate to the bedroom but with access to this new room from that bedroom (via a glass door for light?) And with access from the extension downstairs too. But I don't know what function this room would have - a library/sitting room/study? It could have another large window to look out on the garden, but it's not a large garden and I would want this potential room to add value. I can't see how that is possible at this time, but I am not a creative person at all, no imagination, sad really ;p. There is already a studio in the garden which could be an office etc. So this is a big question mark leaning towards a no because my mind can't come up with a good function for the space.

3. Lastly, we will be converting the loft to include two rooms and a family bathroom. That whole 40 cubic metres thing, does that mean 40 additional cubic metres or the entire loft itself has to be less than that for pd to apply?

4. My dad is a builder but semi-retired. I don't want him in a team doing hard wearing things like the new foundations, or the roof for the new loft, but he'd hate to be left out of it, so I am hoping to do the extension downstairs and loft extension to first fit. He is a real perfectionist so the plumbing and wiring etc and then fitting it out would be great for him, and we'd pay him fairly of course, though he'll complain and just give it back to us via kids in the next few years anyway! But I'm wondering whether doing it to first fit saves money or is more expensive?

What are your thoughts?!

Two storey rear extension is 3m under permitted development, so you are going outside permitted development.

However most London boroughs are pro development so just apply for full planning permission.

assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/830643/190910_Tech_Guide_for_publishing.pdf

This has diagrams that might help.

Wraparounds often not pd.

@Rollercoaster1920

Two storey rear extension is 3m under permitted development, so you are going outside permitted development.

However most London boroughs are pro development so just apply for full planning permission.

Sorry, that was a typo. Should have said 3x3 so 9 msg, I a guessing then that you would say this in within PD.

But still, maybe a moot point because no idea whatsoever what to do with that space!

Thanks for responding on a day like this! dDidn't expect anything today at all.

@Janleverton

Thank you!

I had read in only one place that the wrap around would be under PD if it were less than half the width of the original house, which this one would be. But I read that in only one place ad everywhere else is vague. Gosh I hope it is.

As it's a terraced house you can't do a two storey extension under pd. You need to find out first if you're in a conservation area as that will restrict single storey rear extensions. Would also mean roof additions need planning permission.

@Janleverton

Just realised that his guidance is dated 2019, so possibly not inclusive of the August 2020 changes. I'll look further.

@Trampauline
I had read that you can do a double storey extension under the new Augusy 2020 rules. I'll find a links somewhere. Hold on!

"For extensions of more than one storey
Extensions of more than one storey must not extend beyond the rear wall of the original house by more than three metres or be within seven metres of any boundary opposite the rear wall of the house.
Roof pitch must match existing house as far as practicable (note that this also applies to any upper storey built on an existing extension).
Any upper-floor window located in a ‘side elevation’ must be obscure-glazed; and non-opening (unless the openable part is more than 1.7 metres above the floor).
All side extensions of more than one storey will require householder planning permission.

On Article 2(3) designated land* all rear extensions of more than one storey will require householder planning permission." from www.planningportal.co.uk/info/200130/common_projects/17/extensions

Regarding the wrap around, it says only this about 'all extensions': "For all extensions
Only half the area of land around the "original house"* can be covered by extensions or other buildings.
Extensions cannot be higher than the highest part of the existing roof; or higher at the eaves than the existing eaves.
Where the extension comes within two metres of the boundary* the height at the eaves cannot exceed three metres.
Extension cannot be built forward of the ‘principal elevation’ or, where it fronts a highway, the ‘side elevation’.
The work cannot include:
verandas, balconies or raised platforms.
a microwave antenna (e.g. TV aerial or satellite dish).
a chimney, flue or soil and vent pipe.
any alteration to the roof of the existing house.
On Article 2(3) designated land* the work cannot include cladding of the exterior.
The materials used in any exterior work must be of a similar appearance to those on the exterior of the existing house."

I'm thinking the wrap around comes under 'all extensions'? Like I say I hope so. Not because I fear I'll fall foul of planning or do a terrible job (I'll likely copy one of the neighbours' It's because the time is takes to get through planning will literally cost me several thousands in rent and I'll be paying the mortgage on top.

If you think you'll get planning, why not just submit and use the 8 weeks (maybe it's just 8 weeks here?) it takes to get a decision to get quotes from builders, structural engineer calculations, source all the materials/fittings you want so that when it comes through you're good to go? Builders around here (East England) are booking 6-9 months in advance so that may be the biggest delay you have? Maybe you have that all sorted out though, in which case I apologise for the simple questions.

Wrap around extensions don't come under PD, rear and side do, but that new bit between the rear and side extensions doesn't. The planning portal is the place to go. And read the technical guidance document.