Critique my floorplan, please

[HouseyHouse21]

We're in the process of buying a 1920s semi and would like to do a rear extension of the ground floor fairly soon after we move in. I've done a quick sketch on floorplanner of what I'd like to end up with - trying to squeeze in a utility, WC, walk-in pantry, kitchen / diner / living room at the back, with a separate living room in the front.

Hopefully the pic loads - can you clever people let me know if the flow works, or if you can spot any potential pitfalls with this layout?

Can you do an extra bit to the side for toilet and utility?
That's how friends have done it on a standard 3 bedroom semi rear extension.

Has anyone mentioned ventilation for the toilet?

Your second layout is almost identical to friends of mine, but they don't have a formal dining space - they eat around the island or in the garden. They can easily fit six around the island and there's only two of them so didn't feel the need to have a formal table. There's another sofa at the end of the island and a big L shaped sofa where your dining table currently is. (I think their space is narrower than yours).

One thing I would say is that they never use their living room! Their kitchen diner is so warm and welcoming, I've only ever seen the DH use it to watch telly when the girls are over, sort of thing. So you could have the front room as a more formal dining/living space and not have formal dining in the back, unless you have a huge family.

Something like this, with the dining/kitchen all being a big family room.

Photo attached

We have our downstairs loo in a very similar place, with the utility behind it. We have an extractor vented into the ceiling, over the utility, to the outside. It works just fine. Many downstairs toilets don't have an external window.

Slanted door to rejigged toilet will need a small sink. Which looks out of balance with normal sized toilet and just results in water and soap splashes all over the floor.
You said in OP this was about kids coming in the back door muddy, but the second option doesn't allow for this at all. Are you going to want them to trail the big doors open and March right in, mud and all? You need to design what works for your family for the next lot of years.

@ReviewingTheSituation

We have our downstairs loo in a very similar place, with the utility behind it. We have an extractor vented into the ceiling, over the utility, to the outside. It works just fine. Many downstairs toilets don't have an external window.

That only works if the utility is on an outside wall and not the party wall.

I think you're updated plan is much better, but you have quite a bit of space to play with, and even if you can't have a back door into a utility, I think you'll regret not having a larger utility/dumping ground/ space you can close off with the rest being so open plan.

Personally, I'd put your loo where you are proposing the utility, accessed through an ante hall/ coats/ storage cupboards where you have the loo. I'd then have a nice big utility/ pantry along the back wall of the kitchen and rotate your island 90 degrees. This would eat more floor space front to back, but not really any more than you were originally proposing overall.

I'd run the kitchen toward the lighter end, put living towards the back and dining where your living is right now.

Then in the summer having BBQs eating outdoors etc all becomes a much better flow, in the winter your living space is darker and cozy with lamps and TV light and you won't get light glaring in on your TV.

Also with kids coming in you could always runs a bench seat with some storage under for school bags, homework etc

You'll also use the kitchen, dining more than the living space as you'll spend more time at the table and island then you do in the sofas.

Is the loo already there? So sewers in place? I would doubt it in a 1920 build? There has to be a fall for the poo to use gravity to get to the main sewer.

OK, thanks all - looks like another round of changes is needed. Will get my head round the comments and have another go.

I wish we had space for that layout, @Baxdream, but sadly it's a relatively narrow plot - there's only about 1.4m to play with so it would mean blocking off the side access.

Hi OP, we added a downstairs loo to our house while extending this year. Have you spoken to a surveyor/architect/good builder about how and where to site the WC? In most houses downstairs loos are usually situated directly underneath the upstairs bathroom so that the soil waste pipe from the new loo can join to the existing one for sewer access.

We were doing a big back-to-bricks refurb and extension like you, but we were still surprised at the costs of digging into our concrete sub-floor to create sewer access for the soil waste. It cost several 000s in equipment and man-power to get it dug. We were told there was only one possible way to configure it really - luckily it was what we'd wanted to do, but going into it we weren't really aware that there were logistical sewer-related factors that limited our choices.

If you can, try to work out where the existing soil waste pipe is upstairs, and where your sewer is, and then chat to someone who knows buildings to advise you what's possible. Best of luck!

Where's the kitchen now? I'm assuming after the stairs on the left? Is there a fireplace in the rear reception room at the moment? What's happening with that? It looks like you'll be moving all your water appliances to the side of the house that doesn't have them atm.

I'd think about getting rid of that toilet in the middle of the house to be where the pantry/cleaning cupboard is on 2nd version.

I'm sitting in a house with that layout atm so am visualising where your stuff would go.

Would just add, can you live with the layout as it is for a while? I know in my area the best tradespeople are booked up for a year and not evening doing quotes.

I have similar layout to your first. Definitely keep sitting area near garden. Dining area has light from hall, kitchen windows and good lighting. We extended kitchen units whole length of wall.

Is the island your top priority? Personally (and we had something similar in a Victorian terrace which we extended), I'd have a reverse L-shape instead as you'll have far more circulation space and that can still be used either as clear work surface for prep etc or for the sink.

I'd also lay out the kitchen part, utility and dining area so that those work exactly how you want them and only then worry if you can fit in a seating area. I ended up doing my DC's babysitting shift at a house with a really similar layout to your rejig : everything felt on top of each other and messy.

@GU24Mum I know some people aren't fans of an island, but this would work really hard for us as it has the bins, dishwasher and microwave in it, as well as lots of extra storage. It also avoids having corners, which I always find to be a compromise.

Do you remember what the main pinch points were in that house? Or was it just that it was cluttered?

I agree with poster who said put the living further into the house and dining and kitchen next to garden. Much better in terms of lighting,- next to window too bright for tvs. Plus better for drinks and food in garden

Based on comments about waste & ventilation, I've now put the WC directly beneath the upstairs bathroom.

The utility is now smaller and on the side wall, so muddy boots & kit can still be shed before coming. And instead of a walk-in pantry, there's a big cupboard next to the fridge.

The kitchen extractor should also be more straightforward where it is now.

The downside is that I've now lost the sightlines from the front door through to the garden, but I don't know how much that really matters day to day. It may make the hallway feel quite dark though.

How does this look? Any other feedback would be very welcome!

@PettsWoodParadise It's definitely liveable for a bit, but I'd like to have everything laid out so we can at least start the planning application process. The builder we'd like to work with has some availability in early summer so it'll be tight but not the end of the world if it's a 2022 project!

Frankly I don’t want to see from the front of my house to the back. I know someone who has that and they can’t sit in their kitchen and be private, they’ve ended up putting in those trendy wooden blinds that block out lots of light and she hates them and is thinking of putting up a wall.

I love this latest layout and if the pipe work is below the existing waste then it sounds hugely do-able compared to previous options.

Looks much better, i would have the wc open off the utility though. Then muddy boys can pop in for a quick wee without tracking through the house. If you have guests, the downstairs loo wouldnt be quite as posh but it depends if you are at more of a family focussed stage of life or an entertaining and naice dinners stage

Hi OP, looks good! One thought - personally I'd make the door to WC accessible from the hallway, small sink facing front door, for extra privacy and noise-reduction in use. (Realise it's a judgement call!)

Is there currently a window onto the stairs from outside? If not you could consider knocking one through, would likely not be a significant cost if you feel the hallway risks being dark.

Best of luck!

3rd looks great, definitely put the WC from the hall or utility however.

Ah yes, point taken about moving the loo door. I could have more of a 'lootility' space - that way there's a handy sink nearby for stain removal etc. I'll just try and squeeze as much storage in there as possible so it's kept tidy.

Can't thank you all enough, this has been incredibly helpful! I hope to be able to share some after pictures in about 18 months from now, fingers crossed!