Tradespeople - we're having a mare

[WobbleHead]

Maybe it's us.

Maybe we have 'nightmare clients avoid at all costs' written on our foreheads in ink that only tradespeople's eyes can see.

Is anyone else finding that it’s almost impossible to get tradespeople to quote at the moment, or actually turn up to do jobs? I know they’re all much busier than normal right now because everyone’s at home and wanting projects done, but it’s getting beyond comprehension for us and it’s really getting me down that we have all these things that need sorting!

I just need a rant really.

Recently, altogether, we've tried to get in:

• A decorator to strip and repaint our stairs
• A fencing contractor to replace some broken fence panels
• A hard landscaper to do a driveway and some raised beds ALL of these jobs are just a step 1 so there would be even more work to come in the future for the person who took them on. All of these projects are worth £1-5k each so they’re not too tiny to bother with.

So far:

To get two decorators to come out and quote we had to contact 15 different companies

The first decorator that quoted asked for a deposit up front, failed to turn up 3 days in a row after the original start date then admitted they actually didn’t have time to do the job and sent our deposit back

The second decorator that quoted said they could only do it nearly two months later - and that date has come and gone and they’re not responding to any messages now despite us making a firm booking

We didn’t manage to get any of the 10 fencing companies we originally contacted to come and quote – three said they would come and quote and just never turned up at the agreed time

One fencing guy asked us to send photos, we did, he asked for a deposit and then just didn’t turn up and husband is unsure about reporting it to the police because this person knows our address

Finally, we got lucky and a fencing contractor turned up to quote and agreed to take it on – quote was higher than expected but we were desperate because the garden had now been unsecure for weeks

Didn’t tell us in advance that he expected full cash payment on the day rather than via invoice and got pretty narky about it, but we managed to pay him as he wanted

I reckon we must have contacted pretty much every driveway and landscaping company within a 3-mile radius of us. Out of them all, we’ve had three actually visit

One visited and we took him through all the plans and then he sent an email back after a couple of weeks of chasing to say he was too busy to even write out a quotation

The second spent ages measuring the garden, driveway, planned patio area, etc., seemed really keen… vanished and never responded to any messages again

The third company visited in a group and were quite intimidating and said that the works would add up to nearly £25k but only if we agreed to a contract on the spot, which is beyond ridiculous

Please tell us that we’re just having a really bad run of luck. Or are we likely to be missing something?? Any insights on what could be going on here?

Interesting. We're trying to get a plumber out atm, much smaller job though, and getting no response or in one case an outright no. We've had no hot water for a few days now, which is annoying but the timing could have been a lot worse with this heatwave!

How are you getting these people recommended to you?

I don't know what's going on or maybe they are all at our house

We've had trees cut down, two rooms new flooring fitted, bathroom done, chimney rebuilt, scaffholding x 2 and just having roof rethatched now. We haven't had any issues other than getting planning approval through from council and tudor brick and mortar company closing for 3 months. The thatcher had a period of 20% workforce so maybe there's a backlog. We had all work provisionally booked pre lockdown.

I'm a tradesperson, and it has been ridiculously busy recently. Not helped by a very limited amount of time to actually do the work, including the admin side, with the kids at home (although I suspect my male counterparts don't have this issue to quite the same degree...). It's a mixture of people who postponed bookings at the start of lockdown, people who would have contacted me if lockdown hadn't happened but waited, and those who are only now making the decision to have work done. I have been out to look at 5 jobs this week, and am having a small panic about when the fuck I am going to get the time to put the quotes together as I'm working over the wkend (the only time I can ATM with DH working Mon-Fri) and am out measuring up more most evenings next week. The more complicated ones will likely not be out in a timely fashion. In terms of then doing the jobs once confirmed, everything is hinged on the schools returning in Sept.

You may well be scaring them off some how, it is definitely a thing! I have been to look at many jobs where my spidey senses tell me that either the job or clients will be a nightmare and I need to avoid avoid avoid. It is more likely everyone is just crazy-busy though and may well have 'bread and butter' clients they need to prioritise.

Payment upon completion is very normal both for myself and other sole traders I know. I know a decorator who will literally stand over you whilst you transfer the money, then check his account before he leaves. That's extreme in my book (and I've told him so), but he's obviously had his fingers burned before and is adamant. I put 'payment due upon completion' on my quotes to new clients but know many don't and assume you'll realise that once you've got your product, you need to pay as you would in a shop or restaurant.

The company you paid and didn't show should definitely be followed up!

Sorry, that impenetrable block of text definitely had paragraphs when I typed it 🙈

I'm in London and use Rated People app for everything and I've been very lucky- they've all turned up on time - they bid for the job, tell you upfront how much, you leave reviews

I put a job up to fit ten extra plug sockets all over the house at 6pm Friday - it was done and paid for by Saturday 6pm

We used Rated People for flooring and bathroom and were fine - was nervous but it worked. Do pay in cash on day for smaller jobs at least. Bathroom was bank transfer.

My OH is a self employed Howdens kitchen fitter and carpenter. He is beyond busy. I have had to now take over most quotes, and all scheduling of work. This won't apply in all cases, but just some things to think about .... (yes, they sound blunt, but you want the honest answers I guess?

1. Decent tradespeople maybe excellent plasterers, kitchen fitters, whatever, but they aren't necessarily good with people skills. Many can't say "no" (maybe they don't like the thought of turning work down, or, more that they don't like to offend anyone). My OH constantly (well, he did) overbooked work as he doesn't like upsetting people with a no, I'm too busy.

2. Can you come and have a look and give us a quote" is a very fair question - however it eats into "time" that the tradesperson simply doesn't get paid for - fine for lean times, but when you've got 2months worth of work stacked in front of you, you simply don't have the time to give up half a day for a home visit.

3. Anyone who says "it's will only take half a day / only wants a cheap job / keep your prices keen etc " Automatically gets put to the bottom of the pile. There could be something your saying to put people off? ... a truly lovely friend of mine asked this week if I knew a plasterer for a small job. "It should take about 4 hours" she said. As these words left her mouth I knew that no plasterer in the land would want the job. Simply because anyone who starts an initial conversation by telling the trade how long the job is going to take is also a bottom of the pile customer.
   "If they are that skilled that they know that much about how long a job should take maybe they should do it themselves" is a standard tradesman reply. (But they only say it to themselves, in their heads, not actually out loud). Bottom of pile once again.

But paying a deposit and not getting any work is wrong, you need to get that sorted.

Good luck.

Have you tried handy man services?
They could do the first two jobs easily.

I think the garden will need more progressional people with the right tools.

I went round our estate and put a not through a door is someone had similar work recently. Worth a try.

Thanks guys - we’ve been working through local fb recommendations, checkatrade and yell.

Definitely haven’t been telling them what we think it should cost/ how long it should take! I do work based off quotes in a different capacity and I know how much of a pain that is.

@WobbleHead I feel your pain. I am responsible for 4 properties , my own, two rentals and my brother’s as he has mental health issues and relies on me. Over the years I’ve been let down more often than I can remember. I have started to build up a portfolio of reliable and competent tradesmen but it’s taken years. I’ve had people lie to me ( saying they’d completed jobs when they hadn’t and relying on the fact it was in a different city and I wouldn’t notice), overcharge when they had me over a barrel because tenants were waiting to move in, not turn up, take one look at my brothers home then say they were off to buy supplies and never come back ( I can’t entirely blame them for that one, he’s a hoarder).
@skankingpiglet your post was very interesting. What tends to get your “spidey senses” going when you meet a prospective client? I’d be curious to know what would ring alarm bells for you- so I never trigger them off ?

@WobbleHead if I can’t get a personal recommendation I use Which? Trusted traders. I’d try and avoid checkatrade as anyone eg a tradesman’s mate/ mum can post reviews, without ever having commissioned a service.

Don’t take it personally OP, we are having similar issues the plumbers, very frustrating.

I lived in the same place for 20 years and honestly I could count on the fingers of one hand the people I'd invite back to do another job. The guys who tiled my bathroom - brilliant. The gas engineer who installed my new boiler - not cheap but efficient and reliable and nobody else has ever been allowed to lay a finger on the boiler. One electrician - who got a job with a local authority and stopped doing private work - also brilliant. The guys who did my flooring - ok but need supervising, and the guy who painted my flat, similar.

Then the rest . . . take one look at a woman living on her own and double the price. Got that. Run two jobs at the same time so that the customer has to stay in for five days? yep. Agree a price, come round and bump it up 'if I have to saw through that plank too, it's an extra £10'. It happened. The prize goes to the gas engineer for whom I waited in for a week between Christmas and new year and who finally turned up at lunchtime on new year's eve to tighten a loose connection to my washing machine, which took him 30 seconds. Yes, really. Rated traders etc are ok but IME the good people don't want the small jobs and you pay over the odds.

I think that some trades people can become a bit complacent.
An electrician ( recommended) came to give dh and I a quote. Dh asked him when he would be available to start the work . The electrician said two weeks. He gave a start date . After two weeks we hadn’t heard from the electrician, so dh sent him a text asking when he was able to start. There was no response. We tried to phone him, he didn’t answer his phone.
Now it could be that something untoward happened to him, but I doubt it. I just think that he was too busy , but didn’t want to tell us.
I just wish he had been honest about his availability, as if we had known that he couldn’t do the job, we would have spent time looking for someone else.

Yup I'm finding the same problem - contacted a plumber about installing a new radiator - he initially replied really quickly then never heard from him again

Same with some some smaller maintenance type jobs but In fairness to me I contacted companies which said they were specifically maintenance ones "no job to small" and all that and never heard back

Thing is I work in the industry and as soon as people find out what my job is they always try and schmooze me to give them work but I shouldn't feel like I have to dangle that carrot infront of them and to be honest how reliable are they really if they can't respond to an email

We’re trying to get quotes for a new porch at the moment. It’s a nightmare. We’ve had one successful quote... from a national company who it turns out have a really bad reputation for customer service (we wanted a price as a baseline, if that makes sense and didn’t see their reputation until we’d asked).

I’ve kind of given up on getting it done any time soon, tbh

It is frustrating because in many walks of life you simply could not get away with being that unprofessional, I certainly wouldn’t get away with saying I’d do stuff then not turning up, or not doing what I said I’d do, etc etc.

@Spudlet

We’re trying to get quotes for a new porch at the moment. It’s a nightmare. We’ve had one successful quote... from a national company who it turns out have a really bad reputation for customer service (we wanted a price as a baseline, if that makes sense and didn’t see their reputation until we’d asked).

I’ve kind of given up on getting it done any time soon, tbh

Have you tried Anglian Home Improvements- they did my all glass porch and can't fault the customer service

Ooh interesting about Which? Thanks!

YES!!! I realise they are ALL apparently run off their feet, but I'd appreciate them either say that their timeline would likely be X to start our project or X to actually give a quote.

I've had a trademan go to Greece for a week, 1 off to France for the month and another currently in Romania! Not to mention the rest that might turn up then don't provide a quote, I'll be conversing with then silence or the quote is £10,000 more than anyone else!!!

@ivfdreaming Really?! It was Anglian that quoted, but their reviews were awful! Some of that could be attributed to Covid (unreasonable moaning about unavoidable things) but there was plenty of awful feedback that dated back well before then. No one seemed to have a good word to say about them

@Spudlet

I'm surprised as I've found them great! The salesman wasn't pushy and was knowledgeable and had some ideas of his own which actually improved the look of what we were going for. Their product is superior to the likes of safetyle and compared to what other people on the street have had done and I got a couple of other quotes from local companies and they were on a par with them (not expensive like some of the reviews I've just gone online to look at out of interest/being nosy 🤣)

Most of the poor reviews for my local branch other than one dated a week ago are months/years old so I'd take that the majority of their customers are happy and it's the odd one that hasn't had a good service and so posted about it

Anglian have done our porch which basically covered the front of the House and most of the windows so far (our windows are huge and go the full width of the rooms so due to cost we have to do them bit by bit 🤣) and I wouldn't hesitate to use them again - when I had some snagging on the front door I did a live chat on their website and someone rang me back with 24 hours and the repairs were done within the week so can't fault them

whataboutbob it can be any number of things and often it is difficult to put your finger on.

More obvious examples are people who are trying to knock down my price: I know what the going rate is, know I'm not taking the piss, and have given my best price (unless I really really don't want it because something has already set off alarm bells). This group are also the most likely to not pay up on time IME.

Another are people who are clearly going to be overly picky or unrealistic (I have a high standard of work, which is backed up by my reviews, but even that won't be enough for this group). This is most often shown by complaining about the work of multiple previous tradespeople whose work I can see for myself to be of very good or an excellent standard. These people will either have you coming back again and again over something only they can see, or will find very very minor faults to try and knock money off once you've done. It is the client equivalent of the bloke who claims all of his Exs are crazy.
Obviously there are customers who complain about previous tradespeople with good reason, but this is usually very clear to see when you are there quoting.

There are also those who will need a constant hand hold, although I don't mind this type if they are otherwise lovely (I have a few regulars who fall into this camp). For the others I figure I already have 2 young DCs and a DH that need that level of care, and don't want to have to do it at work too if I don't have to!

My senses must be pretty good now, as I don't often get my fingers burnt any more, but have had my share of nightmare customers. I should also add that the majority of people who contact me are perfectly nice and normal!

I've had the same problem with trying to get some fencing. I even had 1 chap come round and spend over an hour looking at what needed doing whilst telling me and my neighbour his life story, and saying how poor some companies are at responding to clients etc. Never heard any more from him. No quote received. 🤷‍♀️

I think it's always been bad, tradespeople are often good at doing the work but poor at admin and customer service, but worse at the moment as they are so busy.