What does this mean? Q from buyer re.1957 deed

[sleepychunky]

Hi, we're in the process of moving and just doing searches etc. Our buyers' solicitors have asked a question about something in the 1957 deed (year the house was built) and I don't know what they mean! Have attached the relevant part of the deed and their question is:

Please can you forward a copy of the consent in reference to the following restriction listed under point (1) Part Two of the Transfer dated the 2nd April 1957 which affects the property

We had a loft conversion done 4 years ago - would this be it?
Our conveyancer doesn't really know either, talked to him this morning so if anybody is good at interpreting 70-year old deeds I'd be very grateful

Yes, I’d say it’s about the loft conversion.

How does the conveyancer not know?

Looks to me like it is a covenant stating that if you change the exterior of the home you need the consent of the original land owner.

Ok my daughter is a trainee lawyer and she says

It’s a restrictive covenant that prohibits you from changing or elevating the external part of the dwelling without consent from whomever was on the deed in 1957.

She says you can either apply to have the restriction removed but need to speak to your solicitor and it’s time consuming but you could maybe prove it’s obsolete. Or your solicitor can find who owns the covenant and seek permission retrospectively or the buyers can get restrictive covenant insurance and you pay for it. It’s not expensive but it protects against whomever owns the convenant suing down the line.

She says the fact permission was not sought, passes on down the chain, so the new buyer would be liable.

She also says if you’ve breached the covenant for more than twelve months you/the buyer can get insurance to protect against action in the future. As it’s been four years. Once it’s obtained the insurance lasts for ever and can be passed to the buyers. Cost is not High but is dependant on the the risk the insurer deems.

As above. There are very similar covenants on my semi detached from the same era. I can't even have a shed (I bought it with 3 ). Just pay for indemnity insurance. Don't go seeking and drawing attention to the covenants with whoever 'owns' them.

Our conveyancer doesn't really know either

You REALLY need to change your conveyancer. It's their job to know about deeds and interpret them etc. But as recent posters have said, it's a restrictive covenant which requires permission to change the building, i.e. relating to the loft conversion. A good solicitor/conveyancer would know how to deal with this, i.e. obtain permission from the prior owner, or obtain an insurance/indemnity policy in case of future challenge, or, examine whether it's so old that it no longer applies.

We had some restrictive covenants on our house (and rest of the estate), imposed by the builders back in the 1970s, such as not painting the exteriors anything other than white, window frames to be kept white, not to remove cherry trees from front gardens, etc etc. 50 years on and no-one cares anymore. The builders went bankrupt, so in theory, there was no one to enforce the covenant anyway, and so many houses now have different exterior/window frame colourings, and have removed the cherry trees, without challenge, it's basically long forgotten.

I think you'll find (and a good conveyancer/solicitor will endorse this), that these kinds of restrictive covenants were just for the builders to keep the entire site "tidy" and standardised to make the other houses on the estate easier to sell once they're built.

Agree on the conveyancer, my daughter said the same thing, this is basic and it’s their job.

Your conveyancer should know about such matters as it's his job to know and it's really not uncommon to have a restrictive convenance crop up on an old set of deeds .
An indemnity policy usually only costs a small amount and will cover the problem
The original owner and his surveyor are probably no longer and will make this obsolete
It may have been put in the deeds as part of the original planning consent from the council
Talk to your conveyancer , ask if he thinks it's related to the loft conversion and if it can be covered by an indemnity insurance? - should really be him asking you this but sometimes you just need to jump in and push things along yourself

Our conveyancer doesn't really know either

I find this very hard to believe. This is their job. This is what you are paying them for.

Perhaps time to change to a conveyancer who will do the job you are actually paying them for....

Thanks all, sorry should clarify that when I said our conveyancer didn't know that's not strictly true - he knows what is meant in the deed but didn't know why they would be bringing up a question when nothing has changed to the exterior of the property. Many other identical houses in the street have had loft conversions or extensions so I'm sure it's nothing we can't overcome, but all of your points and recommendations are much appreciated.

If you have done a loft conversion could it be there has been velux style windows put in which then alter the external appearance?

The insurance is usually pretty cheap. On selling our last place we realised the previous owners hadn't got a buildings reg certificate for a conversion which our buyer wanted. It cost £100 or so to insure.

So you didn’t put windows in your loft conversion?

So indemnity insurance will cost £60, that's far simpler than faffing around trying to trace the people who were on the 1957 deed (the company doesn't exist any more). Thanks all

You can't have converted the loft with no alterations to the exterior. Unless there are no windows.

Velux Windows don't count as altering the external as they are in line with the existing outline of the dwelling

Just get defective title indemnity insurance - cheap as chips in reality as you probably couldn't contact the person who has the benefit of the covenant in any event

No way would I advise any client to accept indemnity insurance in these circumstances

Then surely your conveyancer should reply "Please clarify in what way you consider that the covenant has been breached?", rather than passing it on to you.

*do you

You're employing a conveyancer but need to ask MN? You need to change that OP.

You should buy the indemnity insurance, which won't cost much.

As a PP has said, unless the loft conversion does not have velux windows or a dormer, then it will have altered the external appearance so you "should" have obtained approval.

Most of these are when estates were built and it was a way of ensuring some sort of uniformity.

Agree with the other PPs, if your conveyancer doesn't know why a buyer might be asking, he/she is either very lazy or very dim. Take it from someone with some knowledge that it's reasonable for him to ask you and then to draft a suitable reply and/or suggest indemnity but not to know.................. frightening!

Why doesn't your conveyancer know how to deal with this?? We had this on our house but as, with you, the original land owners are unlikely to still be alive. The answer is for your to take out indemnity insurance and that resolves the issue.

Windows don't count as altering the external as they are in line with the existing outline of the dwelling

Eh? Of course they do. The convenant isn’t saying don’t alter the outline it’s saying don’t alter it full stop. You need to alter it to put a window in.

Now you know why employing a conveyancer is a false economy.

Solicitors cost more but well worth it.