Fence and planning error

[TroysMammy]

I live in a house with a corner plot which one side faces the road and a side where there is a driveway to a communal car park for residents. Two years ago I had a fence put up and was told by the landscaper (who happens to be a relation) that as long as the fence is not over 2 metres high and as it's on my property it's fine.

However I have just received a letter from the Council that it's not fine and it should be no more than 1 metre high and because the street view has low walls I have to reduce the height or reposition the fence no less than 1 metre into my garden. To say I'm gutted is an understatement. Firstly believing the landscaper and secondly with a 1 metre fence I won't be able to eat out in my garden, sunbath, hang my knickers out to dry, my greenhouse will be at risk from any vandal with a brick, every time I wash dishes in the kitchen or make a cup of tea people passing can see right in and veg I grow could get stolen.

At expense and losing a metre of garden I would have to have privacy screening installed.

What would you do? Should I challenge the council, apply for retrospective planning and if turned down appeal given the lack of privacy and security considering it's my back garden and there is no longer enjoyment in having a garden or would you think it's not worth the hassle and just do what they want. They did give me 3 weeks to rectify it but I told them that's not feasible.

Don’t mean to be rude here OP, but are you sure the letter was from the council?

I ask because there was a thread recently about some land where the OP received a letter from a ‘solicitor’ explaining why they had to give away some land - except it clearly was made up, to look like an official solicitors letter.

Assuming it is from the council then I’ll ask you if you live on an estate where the houses and gardens are all alike.
If you do, and you have a look around the estate , can you see any fences similar in height to yours?

It could be your out of luck here and the estate has a ‘design’ that is meant to leave properties open to view.

I think the rules for fences bordering a road might be different.

Yes. It's right, only 1m: ...it is next to a highway used by vehicles (or the footpath of such a highway) and it would not exceed one metre in height (from ground level); or

My colleague had this. It went to appeal but they lost as it was a corner plot and the council argued it restricted views from be junction. It was a long time ago but I think they moved the fence inwards where required but kept the height (they didn't need to move the whole fence, just part of it.

How about planting a hedge next to the fence?

Yes it was unfortunately. I've subsequently corresponded with a Council email address. Bit annoyed that the planning officer replied Dear first name. I know I don't go for titles but no point in getting arsey about it won't make me feel any better.

No there are no similar fences because there are only 3 properties, mine is one of them that are corner plots. The rest have a front garden and back garden as they are terraced houses. Mine's end of terrace.

Can you buy some fast growing hedge plants and put them on the inside of a 1m fence or are hedge heights restricted as well .

ruthieness I've toyed with that idea but the garden is not level with the pavement so it would take a few years for a hedge to grow 2 metres. I'm in my 50's and I don't want to be trimming and cleaning up hedge cuttings. I'm falling apart every day I get older, that would finish me off .

It only applies to the bit at the bottom of your diagram onto the adopted road I think. Once 1m back from that the bit onto the shared garage can be 2m. Do check on the planning portal and the technical guidance doc too.

I'd plant a dense hedge just behind the fence. Hedges are not a planning concern unless they are 'high hedges' which is pretty specific, and 2m wouldn't be that. This is your back up.

Then do as others have said, talk to planning, look at other houses on the road to check for precedent.

Then i would submit a planning application (about £250 if you do it yourself) for the fence.
If that is refused then you can appeal (don't know the cost), or take the fence down. Hopefully your hedge has grown somewhat in that time!

A hedge looks nice, provides privacy, absorbs noise. But does take up a bit more physical space (but less than 1m if you choose well and keep it trimmed).

Actually - I think I'd just plant a hedge in the first place!

It's approximately 1.5 metres from my garden for a hedge to be at the 1 metre height from the roadside. I can't have cherry laurel as it's poisonous to cats, I have one and leylandii suck out nutrients out of the soil and need quite a bit of water. Ok it rains a bit in Wales but I'm also on a water meter. There is no restrictions on the size of the hedge. One part of me feels spite and get something to grow as tall as it wants but as the garden is south facing it would cast a shadow over it.

Yes - adjacent to the highway 1m is the maximum allowed without PP.

As the Council have already raised concerns about the appearance, I am wondering whether there are additional restrictions on the whole development - has your house been built within the last 40 years or so? If so, there may be conditions on the original planning permission.

It's probably worth putting in an application and if the Council refuse it you can lodge an appeal (no fee for an appeal).

Rollercoaster1920 They said I've got to reduce the whole fence on the side of the driveway as well.
Unfortunately there is not 1 metre between that and the back of my shed and greenhouse. There wouldn't be any space to comfortably trim a hedge on that side.

I think I'm going to have to cut down all the fence and put 1.8m privacy screening/trellis in the garden, 1 metre away from the wall. At least the garden will have light, the greenhouse will be protected to some degree and have light and I can grow flowering plants, or beans up it. There will be no topless sunbathing that's for sure .

There's nothing I can do about the fence at the side of the drive and I'll get cctv installed too.

I'm just waiting for some fence companies to get in touch now. Funnily enough I haven't heard from my relation when I pointed out he was wrong about fence height.

Seeline it was built nearly 60 years ago. It's a council estate but a lot of properties, including mine, are now private.

It's just annoying because as it was before the fence it was like living in a goldfish bowl.

Someone I know always would be walking past when I had my hands in the kitchen sink and I'd have to wave back with suds flying everywhere. I even had to be careful when planting veg just in case I was flashing my bum or boobs when bending down and i had to make polite conversation with a neighbour who would always stop to discuss runner beans!

We front into a very busy main road. The planning law is 1metre when next to a road. 8ft or 2 metres when it isn't.
BUT - here's the good news. . . We applied for planning, gave valid reasons (like yours) that it needed to be higher. Permission granted!! Cost about £200 I think but guess that depends on which council. Happy days. Good luck. Go for it. X

Shouldbeworkingnotreadingtalk Thanks, I think I'll contact them again as I imagine they only saw the fence from the road and not the impact of a 1 metre fence would have to myself even though I have emailed them some information but seeing it is different I suppose. I could give it a try. £200/250 pounds to see if they will relent is a lot less than a few thousand in redoing it and if unsuccessful then I've delayed the inevitable for a while.

I think the planning department saw it because a neighbour contacted them about a cock up the council made when they installed a dropped kerb for her a few years ago which has been bugging her husband. I can't imagine a neighbour complained because they could have done that when it was installed nearly 2 1/2 years ago.

It's definitely worth putting in a planning application, and then you do have the right to appeal that decision. There is no cost to lodge the appeal with the Planning Inspectorate, and it is up to you whether you want to employ someone to do the paperwork - there is no need for that, you could easily do it yourself.

I've contacted them to enquire about planning. I realised last night that with a 1 metre fence people on the street can watch me cooking, make a cup of tea, wash dishes as my house is nearer to the road, where people park, than my neighbour opposite with a house which is a different style, which is on a corner too. It would feel very intrusive without a fence being there.

I've also checked my deeds and it doesn't specify which part of my garden must be the back or front if that makes a difference, little bit of ammo if the council say "well that's your back garden and the side is your front garden". I'll wait and see what happens next week.

cafe curtains are useful in an overlooked kitchen.

You really do have to check before you build I'm afraid.
The neighbour at the end of my garden has just built a giant 9 foot fence shutting off my garden from all sunlight and its like looking out onto a prison gulag.
He told me to "get stuffed you old busybody" when I said to him quite politely that it would have been nice to have been asked about that fence before putting it up.
I now have the greatest of satisfaction of watching him fume and pull it down after the council told him to get rid of it.
The whole street complained to the council but naturally it's my fault because i'm an old hag who won't let people live their lives.
That's nice coming from a fat gammon.

madcatladyforever "a fat gammon" . My fence is under 6ft and it's only my garden that gets some shade from it. Unfortunately I listened to the relative who put up the fence because he'd had his landscaping business for 30 years so knew all about regulations. Obviously he didn't.

Im just wondering if this has got something to do with the view onto the road when exiting the car park. A splay is usually required for vision and possibly a high fence reduces vision. You need to check if this was an issue too. Has the letter come from planning or the highways dept?

I think you are worry about nothing. Who cares if people can see what's on your line, people who want to vandalise you greenhouse won't be put up my a fense and veg stealing isn't a massive problem. Take proper advice and calm down.

Ex council properties in my village had a similar problem, as the way they are set out sometimes means the back garden is on the road. One's that have wanted a 2 metre fence have applied for, and got, planning permission. No one has been refused. Can you just apply for retrospective pp?

I cannot see why they want you to reduce the height of the entire fence.

I live on an estate built in 2000. The entire estate has 2m high fences banking entire roads due to lots of back gardens backing onto the estate roads. You literally drive down a street with 2m high fences/walls on either side of the pavement.

The 1m "adjacent" to a highway bit is to give driver visibility when coming out of a road or off a drive so on your diagram the entrance to the communal car park. But again, it shouldn't be the whole run just the end panel.

Do they realise this is your entire back garden? How can they say the street view when all the other houses have a different frontage to yours?

I would apply for retrospective planning. Have a little drive/walk around your neighbourhood to see if you can site other houses that have a similar thing. Take photos to go with your application.

This is the sort of visibility that will be required.