Which quote to go for? (Kitchen/bathroom)

[Ragamuffin8]

Hi all,

Have difficulty finding a tradesman to renovate my very small kitchen & bathroom. I’ve been scarred by the time I got my bathroom redone 7 years ago (he left it unfinished and I’ve had numerous leaks since).

I’ve had a few quotes:

• 10.5 k labour alone (this guy has a lot of positive reviews, experience of period properties like mine, but can’t show me the breakdown for kitchen/bathroom due to saving of doing both, and is pushing me to get a kitchen from a certain supplier & initially said he’d charge more if I got flat pack cabinets)
• 6.5k labour alone (this guy won’t give me a written quote till I’ve agreed to use his services, has positive reviews, though I felt he didn’t always get the high quality look I want)
• 8.5k for kitchen alone (labour, cabinets, quartz worktop), this guy has lots of positive reviews, but I’d need to use his cabinets (which I haven’t seen in person, or viewed realistic photos)
• 3k for kitchen labour & 5k for bathroom labour + some materials (exc tiles, bathroom suite), has a 2 year warranty and small number positive reviews, though has misunderstood what I wanted a couple of times.

I’m torn. I live in a small one bed flat in London. The two with lots of positive reviews cost significantly more (way more than my expectations). But if I go with a lower quote, that I thought was reasonable, will it will be quality, or will I need to have it redone? I had quotes from Wren etc, and their installation quotes were too high, even their staff recommended I use my own tradesman...

What do you recommend? Sorry for the long post, welcome any advice :)

Where are you getting these quotes from - guessing it's a site of some sort? Why don't you order your own kitchen from DIY kitchens - if it's small, you'll probably be looking to spend under £3k on units. Have you tried using their online planner?

@Ragamuffin8

First three - definitely a NO. No written quote - bye! Pushing their own suppliers/cabinets - bye! And, while it is true, if you hire one tradesman to do both kitchen and bathroom, it is cheaper; he can provide breakdown as normal per each job and then apply discount at the end!? Sounds doggy if he doesn't give detailed quote!

Forth one seems reasonable. Were the misunderstandings about small details? If he in general doesn't understand your major requests, then I would look further.

Did any of them have shown pictures of previous jobs (before/after)? Did they provide references from previous customers (not online reviews)? Did they show you their credentials? What is their availability (normally for good tradesman you would have to wait months - don't know about now during lockdown)?

Good luck!!

I'd agree with Laughing Donkey, any builder that isn't willing to give you a detailed quote is not worth pursuing. Take it from somebody who had to learn the hard way, get a detailed written quote, which includes breakdown of materials (agree on who will provide materials - if it's you, you'll have greater control on costs, if it's them, ensure they get sign off from you before a large purchase), agree a fixed deadline and a fixed cost regardless of whether they end up taking longer or not etc - don't be duped into paying a day rate etc. Get all of this in writing before any project starts. Some people include a deduction of 5% if the project doesn't run to time. Also, DO NOT PAY upfront. Pay a small amount upfront which may cover materials, or act as a small deposit, and the remainder should be paid upon completion of project. Request invoices, and I'd also request receipts of materials, unless your agreed fixed cost for the project includes all materials. Worth finding out if they're VAT registered too, as obviously they will then add 20% to invoice - find out if their quote includes VAT.

I can sympathise, I had 5 quotes for my kitchen and 8 for my bathroom. I agree with LaughingDonkey, no written quote is asking for trouble, so avoid those. Ignore any reviews that aren’t from people you know, a lot can be fake, etc. Get some pics of their last projects, or references. Wanting to use their own cabinets, no way, what if you don’t like them? That level of inflexibility doesn’t bode well either frankly.

I’d pursue the last one, or get more quotes. With the last one, I’d make sure you spec everything and get it agreed in writing, to avoid any confusion. If he doesn’t like this then I’d move on and get more quotes. Can you find someone with a personal recommendation? Admit this can be difficult.

I agree with Smallgoon too, absolutely no payment up front other than a small amount for materials (not required on either of my projects) till the work is complete.

Also make sure it’s clear whether it’s a written quote or estimate, my kitchen was a quote, whilst the bathroom was an estimate.

I had my bathroom done in January - complete rip-off out, installed walk in shower, wall cladding all around, new radiator, new floor etc. I bought all the items needed myself and have a very good local tradesman (used him before many times) who fitted it for me. He charged me £120 a day labour and it took him 5 days in total. Whole job was less than £2k all in. Looking to do my kitchen and planning on using the same bloke for the work and ordering the kitchen and appliances etc myself I’ve priced all the goods up at £4k, so will just depend how long it takes him to do the work really.

Thanks everyone. I’ll see if I can get further info from the 4th, or keep looking.

Wow that’s good 40something 120 daily and took 5 days. I bet you were well happy

@DoubleDessertPlease

I can sympathise, I had 5 quotes for my kitchen and 8 for my bathroom. I agree with LaughingDonkey, no written quote is asking for trouble, so avoid those. Ignore any reviews that aren’t from people you know, a lot can be fake, etc. Get some pics of their last projects, or references. Wanting to use their own cabinets, no way, what if you don’t like them? That level of inflexibility doesn’t bode well either frankly.

I’d pursue the last one, or get more quotes. With the last one, I’d make sure you spec everything and get it agreed in writing, to avoid any confusion. If he doesn’t like this then I’d move on and get more quotes. Can you find someone with a personal recommendation? Admit this can be difficult.

I agree with Smallgoon too, absolutely no payment up front other than a small amount for materials (not required on either of my projects) till the work is complete.

Also make sure it’s clear whether it’s a written quote or estimate, my kitchen was a quote, whilst the bathroom was an estimate.

Can you elaborate on the fixed cost/written quote vs estimate?

I've been sent an estimate which I'm assuming is subject to proper confirmation but am totally clueless!

Have you had any other work done on your flat that you rate? If so try asking that tradesperson if they could recommend. I'm getting a bathroom quote off someone my double-glazer recommended.

We're paying a daily rate for our bathroom, make sure you know in advance how many days they think its going to take. We've brought everything ourselves, this builder didn't mind others were pushing us to use their supplier claiming they could get a good price but they didn't have everything we wanted.
My DH (who works in the very high end design/construction business) drew up a very detailed spec, e.g. I want X on the walls, (all pipe work will being hidden behind new walls), Y on the floor (its a wetroom) one builder kept saying "oh you don't need that" or "I'd do this instead", another one quickly realised my DH was going to be super fussy and basically said he wasn't interested! The one we choose said basically what my DH wanted was more time consuming and the materials would more expensive but if that what he wanted OK. We got detailed estimates from all who bothered to quote that is the norm. I agree pay nothing upfront except materials if it a big job.
Do not touch with a barge pole the one who 'didn’t always get the high quality look" you wanted you'll always regret it.

Finding good workmen seems to be a nightmare one man was highly recommended by someone on our local Facebook page (although she herself had never used him but knew someone who knew someone who had) then three people told me he was rubbish one sent me pictures of the mess he'd made of her bathroom. Do you know anyone else having other work done that's of high standard? Or if you go into local restaurant/cafe loo and like what you see ask them who did it. We found big well established and well regarded local building firms didn't want to take on a "small job" like a bathroom even though its being totally ripped out and a wall is coming down etc so you're often looking at a one man band. But with one man bands I found that commonest complaints from previous customers were that they were trying to do two jobs at once this made them unreliable. Its going cause a massive upheaval and I wanted someone who's going to totally concentrate on my job not turn up at 11 30 am because they are doing someones else's job as well. In the end we used someone my DH has worked with, his daily rate is higher than others as he normally works in London but at least we know what we're getting and he knows what my DH expects good luck!