Low EPC rating - advice

[Yellowranger]

Hello, we are looking at a 3 bed house with bags of room, that is our dream home. It's not listed but dates back 'to the 1700s'. It's stone built, and looks in decent condition but it's at the top end of our budget. The EPC rating is really low at 17, with the potential to be much higher. I know it's impossible to say without seeing the house and its needs, but does anyone know, is insulating houses like this likely to cost £££?

it's more what can be done without getting lots of damp - I live in a house with some parts of this age with the solid walls. Internal drylining has worked in some rooms but you will be limited for places where you can put up pictures, put furniture against walls etc.

check for idiocies such as vinyl wallpaper (the inside of that was dripping when stripped!), non breathable paint both inside and outside and so on.

you may also need to look at proper outside drainage so that walls can do what they were designed to do - needs a specialist in these things not the usual damp proof cowboys.

quite a lot can be done to insulate the roof, I hope. Also look at window sizes, and if it is has stupid filmy curtains then thick ones with linings should be first on your shopping list. And of course location and orientation, make sure it gets plenty of sun.

plus side is in the now-frequent hot summers it will be lovely and cool inside!

Problem with EPCs is that stone walls don't compute in the parameters they have. We had an EPC done when we rented the house out. The final addendum says that the computer programme doesn't recognise the type of walls we have (stone). It says we should consider cavity wall insulation (but the walls are solid stone , duh), but there might be a problem installing said cavity wall insulation (no shit Sherlock - no cavities).

An EPC takes no account of actual running costs, just their crappy calculations, and takes no account of the fact that making older houses airtight doesn't suit the houses. They were built to breathe.

Epc are pretty pathetic and useless for old buildings. They are really only useful to make sure new builds meet the required energy efficiency. I had one done on a flat and it didn't get a high enough rating for renting. The guy suggested I double glaze the windows (it's a listed building so not possible). And insulate the walls (in the middle floor of a listed building housing 50 flats??). He then said to put more heaters in - I had just put in special high efficient infrared heaters with better than required kw output for the rooms. He said the form didn't distinguish between types of electric heaters. In the end he said I needed to get a double meter system (for day and night). The flat already had that (guess he didn't notice) so it just about passed. A little common sense would go a long way.

Yes EPC are crap. Suggest cavity wall insulation for a stone house which has cavities but no one will install it now and if you google it the reason is obvious as there are stacks of complaints and court cases about damp issues.

A property can score this low due to a combo of the type of heating or having no fixed heaters in the habitable rooms. Or if it has night storage heaters but the property has a single rate elec meter. A no access, cluttered or boarded loft with no insulation visible can drop an epc by about 10 points for a start. (even if you know there is insulation under the boards- if it cant be evidenced it cant be included) It wont necessarily be just the fact it is solid wall, but a number of factors. From an epc point of view - always take photos of any insulation works and the materials used/ thickness whilst being done. This can then be used as evidence for any future epc.

From an epc point of view - always take photos of any insulation works and the materials used/ thickness whilst being done. This can then be used as evidence for any future epc. I did just that as some work had been done about a month prior to the EPC, but as I hadn't used a ' registered installer' to fit the insulation, but the local builder, the EPC guy wouldn't take it into account.

We have thermostatic control valves on all the radiators; I had a brand new oil fired Stanley with a central thermostat in the hall ('why hadn't I had a condensing boiler?' Cos it doesn't work in the house you twat). I couldn't 'evidence' the insulation under the boarded floor of the attics, as dh had done it (sucked teeth at non approved installation), but I pointed out this was before EPCs had even been thought of.

The twat proceeded to tell me off about the size of the open fire in the sitting room (installed before we even owned the house); didn't want to look at the actual bills for heat/light, and then proceeded to produce a useless document that suggested we rip everything out we'd just done, and pay shedloads to never make the money back.

EPCs are not suitable for older houses, (mine was built circa 1835) so why do them?

Yep, similar issues with multiple old stone properties, cavity wall is 'recommended' but they would literally have to build an internal wall for that! Plus stone is very naturally insulting anyway.
I currently live in a new house but even with its cavity insulation etc is not as warm as my previous stone build houses. The modern ways of checking efficiency seems to focus on current insulation methods rather than the ones the builders have been relying on for hundreds or fb years.

all a bit maddening, isn't it? I have an EPC for a 2 bed semi (modern, well insulated and warm) - recommendation was to put a wind turbine in the back garden. That would delight the neighbours.