Buying a house with a vertical crack, had collapsed drains....

[Bigpaintinglittlepainting]

Has anyone done this ? Got the survey back and there are issues in the survey with the crack running vertically down the stair and back store room. Advised to explore the drains, so discovered that there are four drain routes in the garden, two working well, two collapsed and redundant.

I am assuming that the collapse of the drains has caused movement to the house.

I wouldn’t normally even go there but the plot and garden is massive and it’s the only house we found with 3 double bedrooms.

Are we mad to even consider it ?

You’re mad. Sorry. Sounds like a nightmare!

Haha I know ! Thing is I work in construction albeit landscape and we won’t be living there except school holidays so we could carry out work without having to live there.

I assume that the seller will deduct the cost of the work ? Or is that ridiculous

Drains with problems do not necessarily cause cracks to buildings. Why would they? They are not supporting the building. The foundations are? Has a trial pit been dug to look at the foundations? Is the crack where there are two different ages of building? I would ask for further evaluation because the drains (unused) may not have caused this.

Broken drains can leak water into the foundations, softening the soil underneath the footing which will cause structural movement.

When I visit a property that has cracking to it, drain investigation is one of the first things we do.

Why is the current owner not going through their buildings insurance to get this investigated?

Are the owners aware and does the price they are asking reflect the problem?

If yes and yes - can you afford to have the work done? (will need more surveying/building quotes to find out potential costs, which in reality will be higher than any estimate given)
If yes and no - if you're not afraid of the building work then drop your offer massively
If no and no - tell them, give them a copy of the survey, and look elsewhere while they work out what to do next

Oh Lord please reconsider this. If the house is subsiding you are in for a world of problems. It can cost 30k to re-pin a subsiding house and you'll be limited to the same insurer forever as new insurers won't take on houses with structural issues like this so youre premiums will be enormous. Plus you'll have to declare it when selling which will put others off. Dont do it!

Drains with problems do not necessarily cause cracks to buildings. Why would they?

They can- leaking drains cause water to soften foundations - especially if the foundations are clay, and they can wash away soil causing foundations to sink. Drains are a major cause of subsidence

The drains might be a symptom, not a cause of the crack. Our drains collapsed due to tree roots, and then a crack in the house was attributed to the trees - because they sucked all the water out the clay soil during a dry summer, so house moved slightly.

So, don't assume the drains caused the problem. They could have been affected by the same problem.

Unless you have an unlimited pot of money, just no!

Pull out unless it is an absolute bargain and you have a MASSIVE contingency fund for this sort of remedial work.

Also, it may well be unmortgageable in the state it’s in, so there’s that think about if you need to borrow to buy.

If it’s subsidence then they monitor any issues over 6 months or longer. You really don’t know what the cause is of the crack.

What are the neighboring houses like?

If the house is for holidays why do you need 3 double bedrooms and a large garden?

Is the house currently insured ? If so get the vendors to instigate an insurance claim. This will trigger loss adjusters to have a look to assess damage and cause. Most mortgage companies wouldn't lend in this state as the house isn't suitable security in this state. Current owners will have a problem selling to anyone but a cash buyer so they should really seek to fix it. This will take time! However, once done quite often the insurance company will reinsure the house for new owners.

Thank you so much everyone, very interesting advice. Sounds like no one would touch it with a barge pole! I am aware that the mortgage company may not go ahead, I’m meeting with a structural engineer on Tuesday to see how bad it is. I guess then I will have an idea of the size of the job. I’m not interested if it’s going to cost 10k to fix, I just have to find something else.

Unfortunately the vendor is in a care home, so it’s difficult to get any communication going as the executors have to visit her to ask information. I will definitely suggest her insurance company get involved but I’m sure the estate agents will advise that. I have asked to find out when the problem with the drains happened.

There are no trees on the site so unlikely to be that, definitely think it’s drains which collapsed and washed sone soil out. I suppose it depends on when that happened and how bad it is. To be fair there really doesn’t look like anything is wrong apart from a fine crack which I noticed as the paint work and decor is so pristine.

Bummer as it’s a cool house and the garden is mahooosive 😭

The house is for us as a family to go to during school holidays as we live at work normally, we need to get back on the property ladder, mainly cause we are cracking on a bit !

We did this. We bought a house where the extension was cracked away from the main house because of a collapsed drain underneath. We got insurance with the mortgage and after a few years we rebuilt the extension. We have insurance now on the house. Our insurance isn't excessive now.

It won't be executors visiting her in a care home - executors only come into play when someone has died and the will needs administering.
From what you've described, 10k won't be sufficient funds I don't think.

Sorry yes you’re right I think they might just be friends helping her as there is no family.

I suppose I’m just holding out on the structural engineer telling me that it’s not a huge job to fix it.

You have to see what the structural engineer says - but it’s probably something that needs to be resolved by her insurance because you won’t be able to insure it now the problem is known. The cause could be anything really but the drains may well be implicated. Which part of the country is it in? What’s the soil like? I think I would buy a house that had previous (fixed) structural concerns provided I could date them, but even then I would be wary. I wouldn’t buy a house with an ongoing concern, it could bankrupt you. And I definitely wouldn’t if it wasn’t a primary residence - you’re not there to monitor. And the huge garden will be a nightmare if you don’t actually live there. Our garden is unmanageable and we are here all the time

I think that’s the solution isn’t it get her to fix it under her insurance and after it’s fixed we can come back to it.

Well I regularly go back to the village as my friends live there so I was thinking I’d cut the grass etc at the weekend, I’m a gardener by trade which is why it interests me. To be honest it’s not a huge garden it’s just large for our budget, there is another house in the village I’m going to view, I’d just be kicking myself if this isn’t a serious problem and we let the house go.

Certainly anyone trying to buy the house will have the same issue so it is in the seller’s interest to resolve it. It sounds like that may be complex for this seller, but hopefully it can be sorted. You can’t stop someone else wanting to take on a massive risk, they may have deeper pockets than you. But I think you definitely need to know exactly what you’re dealing with and why.

When you say crack what do you mean? Is it a crack in the plaster/render or is it more concerning. We have one iffy crack in this house but we know the reason (upstairs masonry wall built on an inadequate timber) and will rectify it during some renovation work that is planned/ongoing (add an additional steel specifically for that wall). So cracks are not insurmountable but it does depend on what is happening to the building and why b

The attached might help you decide how bad it is. It also might help you evaluate likely costs. You don’t need to run away but you should get the house reduced in price, after you have a good idea of costs. Any other buyer will do the same.

However, if the lady has insured her house then it should go through the insurance. Is anyone taking care of her financial affairs? Can this be progressed? I assume she has not decided to sell the house on a whim but needs to sell it. Are relatives involved? Someone will be negotiating all of this for her. Who are the agents dealing with?

Attachments!!

I was also too literal in my first post. Obviously water leaking from drains can cause problems but there does need to be further investigation of the soil and a reason for the crack to be established and then work put in hand to correct that and prevention for the future. As you can see from the above, most claims don’t end up with underpinning and vast expense.

@ BubblesBuddy thank you that’s super helpful, crack runs vertically down the stairs and corner of bedroom parallel to the stairs crack. Also follows downstairs, don’t think it’s 3mm wide but could be wrong. The vendor expressed surprise at the drains so it may not be to do with them if that happened so long ago.

Anyway the structural engineer will asses and we can decide if we are invested enough to wait on any work being done by the vendor.

We have probably got it under the market rate for a house in that condition but there are also issues with the chimney stack and windows which need replacing, I can of see that as part and parcel of buying an old house though.