Home purchase - cracks in walls, HELP!!

[hs6114]

I am looking to purchase a property in SE London. I recently had a buildings survey done which highlighted cracks in the walls in the rear bedrooms and kitchen extension. I then had a full structural survey done which said the cracks were due to a tree in the next door neighbours house. The report seemed really inconclusive and basically said maybe it's the tree, if not check the drains and if that doesn't work try underpinning. When I called to speak about it he sounded really unsure and I wasnt convinced with what he said. I then took my friend to see it who is an engineer. He said the tree was WAY too far from the house to be causing any problems. Upon further inspection he said it looked like the cracks were due to the newly built extension. He said they looked to have settled and it didn't seem to be a big problem. I trust his opinion but at the same time the house costs 710k so I am debating whether to get another engineer to take a look. Problem is, given the first report was so poor I'm reluctant to spend another £500-1k. I have attached the pictures of the cracks. Can anyone provide any advice?? Not sure what to do??

Here are some pics

And another

I’d walk away. Sorry.

Sorry having to upload one by one!

My parents had an extension in the 1990s added to our 1960s house. Within a few years there were massive cracks appearing along the wall between house & extension. Apparently it was differences in building foundations over the years, the new building work settling in plus clay soil.
So we underpinned - costly & messy - and had to provide full documentation of the work when the house was sold.

I'd walk away whilst you still can!

Thanks for the advice! Jocasta - do you know roughly how much the underpinning cost? Also, does it impact the price massively when you come to sell (when a property has been underpinned)?

Not sure what to advise but round here- another part of London- all the terraced houses have cracks. We had a full surveyors report and he wasn't too fussed by it. The front bay window was underpinned about 20 years ago now- the main problem is that makes the insurance a bit more expensive as there is technically a risk of subsidence, but I think that is a risk in the whole area.
We had a particular crack that kept reappearing and when we had building work done we did put some steel in the wall and that has stopped the problem but the surveyor we had for that project also want too bothered by it.

how old is the house?

the first pics look like they have recently been filled and painted but have come back.

If it is a subsidence problem the existing owners should be claining on their insurance before they sell.

I wouldn't buy a house that was on the move. Let someone else fix it, then wait 5 years to make sure it doesn't move any more. You'd be guessing on the cause; therefore guessing on the cure, and the cost, and on whether it would start again.

There are plenty of other houses you can buy.

If it was subsidence tis would be very obvious. Tjere would be very visible cracks on the outside of the house. through the bricks and windows would appear a misaligned.

These are just minor cracks inside the house so your friend is probably right. Not subsidence. Engineers will monitor cracks for subsidence but these are so small they could bot be monitored. Therefore they look like shrinkage cracks. Probably where the new building joins the old building. Not really anything to worry about.

However, that looks like a lot of damp and is it mould on the ceiling. the paint is coming off too. Therefore is the guttering leaking? Is driving rain getting into the wall? Has anyone said what is causing this? I would be more concerned about this. By all means get another engineer to report, but I think those minimal cracks are nothing of any great concern and they prpbably cannot be monitored.

Please excuse typos! You get the gist.

We had a crack running down the wall in one bedroom when we bought our house. It looked bad but the survey came back and said that it was caused by settlement after some building work had been done downstairs, which included knocking down walls and putting in supporting joists and an extension. Is there any damage to the outside or is it just internal?

Thanks for all the advice! As an update, I had a structural engineer come to view the property today and he, too, said that the cracks were settlement due to the extension. He noted that the floors were slightly uneven which could also be due to the extension. His main concern was whether the extension had the correct buildings sign off and whether the foundations built were sufficient. He gets the sense a structural engineer was not involved as there doesn't seem to be enough support for the building. I really like the house but I'm trying to be rational as well. Has anyone had these issues before or can comment on an extension which needed modification after being built?? He suggested I may need to put a box frame (I hope I remembered that right!) where the kitchen extension meets the original house to further support the building.

Thanks Bubbles! The buildings survey didn't mention anything about damp there - I will look into it. The cracks are only internal there are non outside and they are all below 2mm. The extension was built in 2012. The cracks look like they have previously been covered. There are no trees nearby and the engineer ruled out any subsidence. It mainly feels like bad workmanship - but is that a better or worse problem to have??

I’d walk away.

You’ll find another house which doesn’t have these problems.

I would be concerned about an extension with possible dodgy foundations etc. If that is the case a few settlement cracks will be the least of your problems.

Quite often you need deeper foundations for an extension, particularly on clay. It’s sensible to get structural advice when building an extension so that the new and the old sit together properly. I would ask the Engjneer for a ball park figure for the work. Then try and run reduce the asking price! However unless they do a trial pit they won’t know exactly what the problem is with the foundations or that they are not deep enough.

I might be concerned about walls being taken out too. I would want to see the calcs for any beams snd be satisfied that they have been tied into the supporting walls appropriately. They must be supported by piers and be of sufficient strength to hold the floors above and deflect their weight into the walls and foundations. Ask to see any calcs for beams.

Thank you all! Bubbles - I've asked for the buildings sign off and the drawings which they have said they have. So once I have this I can see whether it has been done to the proper standard! I'll then look to negotiate based on this

Our house has lots of cracks that somehow we didn't notice when we looked round! They do worry me but I got a surveyor out who said they are historical.

There are some truly wonky houses in my street though (Victorian) with dropped lintels, windows and doors totally slanty etc and they are all still standing (our house is 1930s) so I've decided it's ok.

Update - the estate agent has said that the cracks were there when the vendor originally purchased the house and they had their own surveyors report done. So annoyed that the estate agent never told me before when I've spent the past two weeks investigating it all! Although also concerned that the cracks have been there that long, although if they're not bigger than 2mm is that okay??

I lived in the Cotswolds and cracks were part of a problem for a lot of old houses that had extensions

The original house built of huge boulders of Cotswold stone in 17th and 18th century had no foundations. They built the walls really thick and the house “moved” as one
Then in more recent years people decided to add extensions. They dug down and laid concrete so the extension didn’t move

The original part of the house still “moved” but the extension was solid so cracks appeared

Personally if you are doing an extension I think you need to only put in the same amount of foundation as the original house then it would clear up a lot of the cracking issues in houses.

My ndn has had a lot of cracking and spent a fortune on a company trying to work out why they had massive cracks in there 1920s built house till I pointed out the house had undergone a massive extension just prior to them moving in and look at that as a reason.

Estate agents always tell the truth and never conceal anything

[//sarcasm off]]

Yes very true! Lol. They have been talking utter rubbish to me this whole time. Anyway they've said they'll send the report and building sign off for all the works so once/if I get this I can make a decision!!

@bubblesbuddy - they have provided both the buildings sign off and engineering drawings. Is this sufficient to assume the extension was built correctly?

It should be. However it doesn’t mean it was designed correctly. It just means everyone accepted it as correct at the time. The foundations should have been inspected. So should how the extension is tied into the house. I would be a bit concerned that the vendors seem to have left it. I’m not sure I would have confidence in this house and you have a structural engineers report which is negative so you don’t really know if the extension was built to the designs or not. I would be cautious.