Do I need smoke alarm to get electric certificate?

[SNM007]

I am installing fire doors throughout the 2 story house except for 2 receptions and kitchen, which will have 15 panel glazed (obscure glass) internal doors. The builder want to charge more on the basis that he will need to install a separate fire alarm in each of the three rooms with glazed doors, otherwise his electrician will not give me electric certificate (I am getting the whole house rewired at the same time). I will not be renting the property. I can't understand what fire doors or smoke alarms have to do with electric NICEIC certificates? Surely the electrician can't fail the certificate just because I installed a non-firedoor with no smoke alarm in that room? Please can you help me with this?

Sounds like a building control issue. The electrician can certify the electrical works but they need to meet building regs.

Thanks. The building control are not involved as the electrician is qualified to provide a certificate. Surely the smoke alarm bit must be outside of the electric certificate scope?

Ask the builder - is the kitchen area building regs compliant without fire doors or smoke alarms? I suspect that if smoke alarms are fitted and mentioned on the electrician's certificate then there will be no need to get an independent building inspector or get a building control officer from the council to visit site (at extra cost) and sign off on things. They tend to charge per visit and want proof that their compliance recommendations have been carried out.

I dont know whether you've done renovations / improvements but when we had an extension a couple of years ago we had to had smoke alarms throughout the house (kitchen diner, hall, landing and main bedroom iirc) and they had to be wired into the electrics before we got sign off from building regs.

Thanks. I am happy to put smoke alarm in kitchen. But I think it may be unnecessary to put one in the 2 receptions that have non-fire glazed doors and unreasonable for electrician to deny certificate based on this.
Also can he simply deny issuing a certificate, or can he issue one, but qualify it if he has nay concerns?

Yes he can refuse you because you will not be compliant with building regs. When we had roof conversion into 2 bedrooms and shower room we had to have electric fire alarms in every bedroom, 2nd floor and 1st floor landings, hall, lounge, dining room, conservatory and kitchen. This is our home with just our family living in it. This tradesman is not ripping you off but just not explaining it to you very well.

But isn't that a building regs issue? Building regs are not involved as the project does not require appointing a building control officer.
Whether or not smoke alarms exist in each room seems to be out of scope for the electrician. But appreciate your experience (which seems to be similar to mine) and really appreciate your help

You say it is a 2-storey building and you are fitting fire doors.

Is this on a whim, or is there some obligation, such as an HMO or a basement or loft conversion?

Who wants to see the certificate for your fire detectors?

No basement/loft conversion, No renting or HMO. Standard Owner Occupied Residential ground and first floor victorian house. Got a few cheap fire-doors so decided to use upstairs (random decision). But want glazed non-fire doors downstairs in 2 x receptions and 1 x kitchen. Electrician arguing that he wants to charge hefty amount to install 2 extra smoke alarms in each of the reception rooms with non-fire doors, despite us paying for another 5 smoke alarms in rest of the house (2 x first floor hallway + 2 x ground floor hallway + 1 times kitchen). Given this qualified electrician is rewiring the whole house and charging me for this, I wanted to obtain an electric certificate that he has done his work properly.

Not sure what NICEIC certificate has to do with fire doors and smoke alarms that do not exist at present??

Someone pointed towards BS7671 regs but I don't know if that covers electric "installations" (which is what the electrician is doing) or just periodic "inspections". I also heard about some sort of smoke alarm certificates which are a separate thing i suppose.. Really don't understand how fire doors and non-existent smoke alarms fall under the electrician's remit?

Building regs are not involved as the project does not require appointing a building control officer.

The electricians work is periodically checked to ensure compliance and allow him to remain a member of NECEIC. If thos project is chosen it will fail and he won't be able to remain registered.

Can I just clarify - you are not doing an extension, you are just rewriting and replacing the interval doors - is that right ?

In that case, why do you have a builder?

QforCucumber - thanks. I agree, but he can't lose his license if "checking that a smoke alarm exists in every non-fire door room" doesn't fall under his remit? What if I don't hang any doors in 2 receptions, get the electric certificate, and then ask the builder to hand the doors?

WH1SPERS - No extension at the moment (but may have in future). Builder is here to plaster, paint, replace some old plasterboard walls, install new bathroom and kitchen.

Fact sheets here

www.niceic.com/find-a-contractor/factsheets