Heating help....please!!

[Absolutechaos]

Thought I posted this last night but can't find it so trying again (apologies if I have now doubled up).

We are fairly new to the UK so central heating is a bit of a mystery to us. We are in a rental so I need to work out whether we have major problems (ie landlord issues) or if I am just being stupid and have maintenance issues that we need to take care of (we have only been in this property for 1 week and our last house had underfloor heating which worked differently).

This house has radiators (most with TRVs) in each room and a single one which heats the hall way and stairs. We are getting really patchy results from the radiators - some are nice and warm and other are barely warm at all, even with the TRV turned right up. There are no noises coming from them at all, just really inconsistent heat. Is this a simple fix or do we need someone to come out? The temp on the cylinder is set to 65.

Also, there is one room thermostat which is quite close to the single rad in the hallway. I have the thermostat turned up to 22 to try to stop the whole system turning off when that rad heats up. I'd rather not turn this rad off as it is the only one for the stairs/hallway. But is turing the thermostat up the right approach?

And finally...(sorry for my essay) something in the cupboard which houses the cylinder and pumps (but not the boiler) is making a very loud noise which goes for about 3 seconds very regulalry (it is every 1-2 minutes when water is being heated and less often when everything is off but it does still happen every 10-15 mins I think). This noise can be heard right through the house so it is quite loud. It sounds mechanical so I was thinking it is a pump or a valve. Is this normal? The landlord is a nutter and will go mental if I ask to have someone look at this and it turns out to be a normal noise for central heating!

Any help would be greatly appreciated as we are clearly heating dummies.

You might need to bleed some of the radiators if they are cold at the top and warm at the bottom. You would need a wee radiator key for that (and a cloth to catch the dribble of water when it reaches the valve - that means close the valve again). Is it your hot water cylinder in the cupboard? Do you have water tanks in the loft?

Bleeding radiator:

Noise might just be air in the system.

Can you take a photograph of the boiler? It might be a sealed system and might need topping up:

Thank you for responding! The hot water cylinder is in the cupboard on the first floor and the boiler is in the utility room on the ground floor. There is a water tank in the roof/loft - I have no idea what it does!

The rads are either fairly cool all over (very slightly warm but not enough to heat anything, even when the TRV is fairly high whilst others with the TRV set at the same level are toasty warm) or they are cool in the centre/on the bottom and warmer on the edges and top - these are longer rads which are fairly large.

Hi op, the tank in the loft is probably your cold water tank and should be covered but not sealed.
As ops have said, you need to bleed the radiators. Loosen the valve at the other end of the radiator from the TRV, and you’ll probably get a hiss as air bubbles come out. Keep going until the hissing stops and water starts sleeping out. Then retighten.
If you get water straight away, there are no air bubbles there so retighten immediately.
Sometimes I have to do it and then redo it a week later.

One of water tanks feeds your central heating system and the other feeds to your hot water cylinder and some of sinks (ours feeds the upstairs ones)

Grumpyolderbloke - I am away from home at the moment but the boiler is a valiant eco tec. I will check tonight but I don't think it is a sealed system (I assume you mean like a megaflow type set up - we have had one of these previously?) as there are no pressure guages that I have seen, just a pump, pipes and the hot water cylinder in the cupboard and the boiler sits on an external wall by itself with nothing attached other than the pipework which is hidden in the wall.

Would air in the rads cause the noise in the cupboard? The rads themselves aren't making any gurgling sounds so I didn't think it would be an air problem? The noise starts and stops very suddenly and it is very consistent in terms of length so I assumed mechanical?

This house has radiators (most with TRVs) in each room and a single one which heats the hall way and stairs. We are getting really patchy results from the radiators - some are nice and warm and other are barely warm at all, even with the TRV turned right up. There are no noises coming from them at all, just really inconsistent heat. Is this a simple fix or do we need someone to come out? The temp on the cylinder is set to 65.

This happens when the system has not been properly balanced. Most likely the boiler has enough power, but the circulating flow takes the easiest route (perhaps through the nearest radiators) and hardly a trickle goes through the more arduous route. For the moment, turn down the TRVs on the hot radiators. Do some of the cool ones now heat up?

I can explain the correct method of balancing later.

even with the TRV turned right up

there is no point in turning the TRV right up. It's basically an on/off switch which turns off when the room reaches the preset temperature.

Turning right up will not make the heat up faster.

Turn them all to about 3.

Also, there is one room thermostat which is quite close to the single rad in the hallway. I have the thermostat turned up to 22 to try to stop the whole system turning off when that rad heats up. I'd rather not turn this rad off as it is the only one for the stairs/hallway. But is turning the thermostat up the right approach?

No.

We will cover that when we get round to Balancing.

The room-stat-in-the-hall design used to be very popular in the 1950's. It is unlikely to be suitable now.

The radiator in the room with the room stat should not have a TRV on it, but it should have a manual knob that you can turn down (say, one turn from fully closed) so that it heats up slowly. Do not turn it fully off.

The temp on the cylinder is set to 65.

The temperature on the cylinder stat does not affect the radiators. If you have separate timings, have the cylinder come on half an hour before the CH.

(And finally...(sorry for my essay) something in the cupboard which houses the cylinder and pumps (but not the boiler) is making a very loud noise which goes for about 3 seconds very regulalry (it is every 1-2 minutes when water is being heated and less often when everything is off but it does still happen every 10-15 mins I think).

Whirring? Clicking? Bubbling?

Is it one of these?

What colour is the cylinder?

Post a photo of it, and the pipes, cables and accessories around it please.

This is the key for bleeding radiators. Buy at least two. Tie one with a loop of string under the boiler and put one in the kitchen drawer where you keep your unidentified keys, batteries, rubber bands and screwdrivers.

Thanks Piglet John. I will take some photos tonight. I have just ordered 2 radiator keys and a digital thermometer for the balancing process. The loud noise is a whirring sound (definitely not clicking or bubbling). The cylinder is covered in insulation (a blue/green colour).

the motorised valves whirr for a second or so when they close.

Thanks Piglet John (you are a font of all knowledge!). I thought it was likely to be a valve. Would it still open and close when the heating and water are both off? I think I will ask for this one to be looked at by a professional as it's is extremely loud and I can't think it would be designed to make that much noise.

Hope you get the hang of it. I've been where you are when we first moved to the UK. Still unsure and convinced we don't use our system optimally.

Bleed the radiators as suggested above and then see how things go. In terms of the noise, we've had the valve switches cause problems in the past and I agree, assuming it still happens when you've bled the radiators, it is almost certainly worth getting someone to look at it.

Does your landlord have an inspection / servicing agreement for the heating system? That might be worth asking about prior to calling anyone out.

the motors whirr when the heating and/or the HW go on and off according to the timer and the thermostat.

if you sit by the cylinder while someone tinkers with the timer and the room stat you may hear it, and possibly see a small lever on the end of the motor case moving.

Photos of the boiler and the hot water cylinder

Photos of the pumps etc attached to the cylinder

After more investigation tonight I've worked out that the loud noise is coming from the black pump in front of the cylinder. I'm not sure why it's running after the timer for everything is off or why it only goes for 3 seconds at a time.

To add to our issues, a significant amount of hot water was dumped outside tonight via an overflow pipe so we now need to work out what else is wrong!!

I can't see your "pumps" pics.

The pump should not make a noise, unless the bearings are worn out or it is clogged with dirt. It should be perfectly horizontal along its axis.

The pipework around the cylinder is very whimsical. Unless you do a great deal of clothes-drying in there, you can improve fuel economy by adding pipe lagging (rigid plastic foam sleeves). I expect the pipes are 22mm, but check that before buying it.

Offset on the top of the cylinder you can see the round cap of an electric immersion heater. This will have a thick rubbery electrical flex coming from it and going to a switch. Keep this turned off, unless your boiler breaks down. Heating water electrically costs about four times as much as heating it by gas, especially bad when the pipes will be losing heat to the air.

Have another go at loading pics please.

ps

Was this overflow pipe projecting from the boiler through the wall behind it? Or did it come from the loft or cylinder?

this is important

Be sure to turn off that immersion heater please.

It won't let me upload any more pictures today . I can see them in the app but not the website version.

No room in there for any clothes so I'll lag the pipes.

The immersion is unplugged at the wall socket so it should be ok.

The water overflow came from very high up (near the eves).

Renting sucks....

This sort of thing. You can bend it round gentle curves (use the tape to hold it) or mitre elbows with a serrated knife. The foamed polythene is very durable, it has a stiff, waxy feel.

Economy range is adequate indoors. In lofts and outside you should use the "Bylaws" grade which gives better frost protection. At this time of year insulation is widely sold but the cheaper soft plastic foam (like a cushion) doesn't last.

"The water overflow came from very high up (near the eaves)."

That means it is coming from a loft tank. These should not get hot so there is a defect. If you are sure the immersion heater is turned off then, you probably have a sediment blockage interfering with the circulation in your boiler pipes.

This will need a heating engineer.

It might possibly be due to the individualistic style of piping I see around the cylinder.

the boiler looks quite modern so if it was installed correctly, the system should have been cleaned before commissioning, and anti-corrosion chemicals added, and preferably a system filter to trap any sediment.

BTW an hot-water overflow caused by a faulty immersion heater overheating can be very dangerous, but it doesn't sound like that is the case here.