Dangerous electrics

[StarlitTrees]

To those who know about electrics...

I’ve just had a couple of electricians around to quote me for a few odd jobs around the house.

They both looked at the fuse board, but one of them has told me that it isn’t safe.
He said the RCD switch is only for the sockets, not the lighting. So if one of the kids had wet hands and touched the light switches (which are low down) they could get a shock and it wouldn’t trigger the fuse to turn off giving them a continuous shock.

He wasn’t pushy but it has worried me.
He says we could change the switches to plastic as all the kitchen switches are metal.
But the safest thing is to get a new fuse box, which will be about £350.

From what I’ve said and the picture of the fuses I’ve attached, can anyone tell me if this is right?

It's not entirely an accurate description of the issues, but RCD is a better safety measure than a normal circuit breaker (MCB).

An MCB trips if the circuit is overloaded, an RCD monitors whether more or less power is flowing through a circuit and trips in either case.

My fuse box is ancient and I would like to replace it - and put it somewhere my short husband can actually reach it in an emergency(!), but it's not a legal necessity.

Thanks for replying. So my circuit board isn’t really dangerous then?
He’s worried me that my kids will be electrocuted through the light switches and there is no safety measure there to protect them!
I want an inspection of the electrics doing because there are a few issues I have and want to make sure the whole house is safe. He said a big thing on the inspection will be that I should really get a new fuse box

I'm not a qualified electrician, but my $0.02 worth is as follows:
Under current regulations, I believe all circuits should be protected by an RCD. Ideally your setup should split across 2 RCDs so you never lose all circuits at the same time in the event of an RCD tripping.

But that's the current regulations. That doesn't necessarily mean your setup (like the vast majority of people's consumer units) is unsafe.

Your lighting circuits are protected by MCBs today which as SilverHairedCat has explained uses a different methodology for tripping vs. an RCD. Simplistically speaking, think of an MCB like an old fashioned fuse that will trip when too much current flows, where an RCD will detect when there appears to be 'leakage' (to earth) on a circuit.

I'm not convinced that replacing your switches with plastic will actually improve anything unless there is no earth on your lighting circuit. The electrician should clarify this point as if there is no earth, your setup could be argued as being dangerous. (Probably no more dangerous than the house you grew up in, but by modern standards, dangerous). If you have no earth at your switches, then swapping out to plastic will be a cheap improvement to the overall safety.

If you do have an earth on the lighting, I'm not convinced that replacing the metal switches with plastic would actually do anything. That said, if you would like to upgrade to the best available protection you could:

1. change the CU (fuse box) and add separate RCD protection. Whilst the figure of £350 quoted seems about what I would expect, you can often find that previously 'hidden' electrical gremlins cause replacing a CU to be more problematic than originally anticipated. You should clarify with your electrician whether this fixed price is really fixed or not.
2. A much cheaper alternative would be to replace your MCB "fuses" with RCBO units. These are hybrids that include RCD protection (simplistically speaking). Assuming there is space inside your CU, this is just a matter of removing the MCB and plugging in an RCBO unit in it's place. This could be a much cheaper job will add exactly the same level of protection as your electrician has proposed (others may correct me on this point?) Each RCBO is around £25.

Your CU conforms (I expect) to the standards in force at the time it was put in. In which case it is not unsafe.

At that time (and still) lighting circuits were required to have an earthwire, which was attached to any metal lamps or switches, so that in the event of a fault, the current would run to earth and trip the MCB. This has been the case for at least 50 years.

Unless your lighting circuits have no earthwire, and you have foolishly installed metal switches and lamps, there is no particular reason why anyone should be electrocuted by touching them. Did the electrician tell you that was the case? It is possible, if it was last rewired 50 years ago.

BTW look up his qualifications on the website of his Competent Person Scheme. Is he a recently-qualified Domestic Installer (the lowest grade) or a higher registration?

We've had similar suggested, ie that it was old and dangerous, and £350 sounds totally reasonable.

Thank you all so much for your advice it’s all really helpful.
Ive actually just had another electrician reschedule and come over now for me and I ran this by him. He took one of the light switches off and says that it is earthed. He says there’s no need to replace the fuse box and we are safe.
I really felt after the other guy said all of that that my kids were in danger (as that’s what he actually told me!). I’m glad they aren’t and I’m annoyed I was made to feel that way!

Standard behaviour from a trade. They identify a weakness or vulnerability and sell into it. In this case electrical safety. Always get a second, and usually a third opinion. Don’t tell them what someone else has said until they have finished and told you what they think. We had one almost persuade my wife to change toilet and tons of plumbing on basis of something that was, shall we say, completely spurious.

Be reassured. Your box looks normal and was a safe installation and is still safe. The new regs from a few years ago made it safer still.

I hate it when people do that kind of thing. An electrician who worked on the kitchen of my old house said he'd noticed I didn't have an alarm and as I lived on my own I might want to think about getting one. I just thought was off and I wouldn't use him if I did want to have alarm fitted.