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Original poster

Please Pigletjohn!

75 replies

SantaClauseMightWork · 16/12/2017 20:41

I badly need your help to save us from freezing in our home.
We tried to put the central heating on timer. It is not enough and I want to override the timer but can't. I want to be able to switch it on and off manually, like I used to.
I have no idea what I was doing when I did this. It is an ancient system and I can't really afford to get an electrician or plumber to look at it for me.
Please please help me! Sad

Please Pigletjohn!
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Original poster
SantaClauseMightWork · 18/12/2017 21:01

Thank you for so many detailed responses. I will try to check/answer every one of these points.

pigletjohn
"it's possible, but not common, and very poor practice (because the heating will be running even when the house is warm)."

That is exactly what was happening last winter. We used to switch the heating on, the flat will warm up, then will boil, at which point, we had to manually switch it back off. We were quite efficient in saving energy in that we used to promptly switch it off as we had enough heat to last the night or make the mornings easy. That's why we never really bothered. This yer, we are trying hard to save money. Hence the try to put it on timer. That has backfired sadly.

We have checked every single room, every single wall. Nothing anywhere.
Why do you ask about "thermostatic radiator valves"? I have googled them and it looks like we do have something like that in our radiators but terribly ancient-looking. This place has not seen much renovation for about 15 years I imagine. But we have plans to start slowly. That's why trying to save as much as possible. Your idea of installing a wall thermostat sounds like the first thing we should do now. Can you guess how much it should cost ideally? Sorry. I know I am asking too many points. Really appreciate Mumsnet being there when I need it the most.

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Original poster
SantaClauseMightWork · 18/12/2017 21:04

DancingLedge
How do you fit a wireless thermostat that could regulate what we have (first pic)? We will need to install both the wireless thermostat and the central heater timer (first pic)? Can you please explain a bit more? Thanks

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poisonedbypen · 18/12/2017 21:06

We had no thermostat when we moved house and finally got round to getting a Hive, which is great.

Original poster
SantaClauseMightWork · 18/12/2017 21:09

parkview

I will try o answer your questions one by one. Thanks for such a long post.

If I understand correctly, you can (through various means) get the boiler to fire for ~20 minutes, but then it stops. Is that still the case?

Yes. We switch off the boiler, then back on. It fires up the heating for about 20 minutes, all the radiators get hot, then slowly go cold again. The whole cycle can be repeated I know but I am afraid of putting unwanted pressure on the boiler by switching off and on so many times. We are literally freezing so we would be doing it for at least 10 times, if not more.

During that 20 minutes, do the radiators get hot?
In between the periods of the boiler being on and off, presumably the radiators get cold?

See above answer. The radiators do get hot and cold.

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PigletJohn · 19/12/2017 09:56

Opinions vary about wireless stats. IMO they are less reliable as they sometimes lose contact due to thick walls, batteries running down, or for no particular reason.

Even a wireless one will have to be wired into the boiler (or timer) at the receiver end.

Honeywell stats are probably as good as you can get. I'm sure there are people who are happy with Nest, but it does generate a high number of problems and queries.

As your boiler goes hot and cold, it may be useful to put a Pipe Thermometer on the Flow and the Return pipes on the boiler to see what it's doing. It might be that you have poor flow, perhaps from a worn pump or sediment in the pipes.

Pipe thermometers are a couple of pounds each on ebay, maybe a little more at a DIY or plumbers merchant. You clip them onto the pipes with a spring, and they are so cheap you just leave them.

parkview094 · 20/12/2017 08:29

Did you have a chance to check the Hot Water Cylinder and run the test with the Hot Water turned off?

Although it may seem counter-intuitive to check the HW settings, it's possible a central heating valve has failed which means it's only when you need hot water that the heating is coming on..

Original poster
SantaClauseMightWork · 23/12/2017 11:39

I have two updates finally. I wanted to come back and report after trying the pipe thermometer idea. While trying to find a place to attach the thermometer, I found a boiler thermostat! I have attached a pic with this post. I am not touching/doing anything with it till I know what I am doing so I will wait for your comments.

Second update is, I heard from Honeywell. This is what they asked me to do:
"Try putting the slider on "24 Hours" or "All day" position.

Also, make sure that the temperature on the room thermostat is above the actual room temperature."

As in my first post, the slider is already on 24hours/all time position I think. Please correct me if I am wrong.
And for the room thermostat: I am going to write to them that I have no room thermostat but I have found this boiler thermostat.

What do you all think? Thank you very much for all the comments and guidance so far.

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Original poster
SantaClauseMightWork · 23/12/2017 11:45

Picture of thermostat

Please Pigletjohn!
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PigletJohn · 23/12/2017 11:55

that is a cylinder thermostat. It controls the maximum temp of the hot tapwater. It does not affect the temperature of the boiler or the radiators. It must always be set below the boiler temperature, otherwise the boiler will constantly be trying unsuccessfully to satisfy the cylinder. If the tapwater is scalding, turn the cylinder stat down, 5 degrees at a time, then see how it feels the next day. The cylinder will never be hotter than the boiler.

Is the insulating foam round your cylinder yellow?

Stand back and photograph it so I can see how neat the thermostat is to the bottom of the cylinder, and the height of the pipes.

emwithme · 23/12/2017 11:55

You need to turn that dial so the arrow is pointing to the number you want.

It's currently at 60F which is about 15c which is COLD. 70 would probably be better (I'd go for 72 but I am a little bit like Sheldon Cooper )

PigletJohn · 23/12/2017 11:55

"near" not "neat"

emwithme · 23/12/2017 11:56

Cross post with PigletJohn. Ignore me.

PigletJohn · 23/12/2017 11:57

emwithme

its °C

PigletJohn · 23/12/2017 12:02

p.s.

set the "hot water" on the programmer to "twice"

It's possible that your radiators will be always on (or always off) when the cylinder is being heated. Or it might make no difference.

Original poster
SantaClauseMightWork · 23/12/2017 12:02

Thanks for such quick responses! Love you all.

Here is the picture of the full cylinder and things/pipes around it

Please Pigletjohn!
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PigletJohn · 23/12/2017 12:06

what are the dimensions of the cylinder?

Does it comfortably fill a bath?

Original poster
SantaClauseMightWork · 23/12/2017 12:11

I have just set the hot water on the programmer to "twice". Looks like this now.

Please Pigletjohn!
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Original poster
SantaClauseMightWork · 23/12/2017 12:13

We don't have a bath. Shower runs absolutely fine. It is an electric shower and the hot water works completely fine. The bathroom is right behind this cupboard though (don't know if that makes any difference).

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Original poster
SantaClauseMightWork · 23/12/2017 12:15

The radiators throughout have valves from Honeywell. Don't know if it makes a difference.

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PigletJohn · 23/12/2017 12:21

Have your pipe thermometers arrived?

I have been looking at the photo of your boiler again. The black knob is probably the boiler thermostat knob to set the boiler temperature (the cylinder is NOT a boiler)

The front panel of the boiler is missing. It would probably have a hole for the knob to poke through, and an arrow or window to indicate the setting. I notice that the word "Min" is readable and the word "Max" is upside down. Perhaps the arrow or window would be pointing at the 9 o'clock position. I deduce that the knob is set to "Min". See if you can turn it, try half-way between "Min" and "Max".

There are probably two large pipes coming out of your boiler, probably at the top. Clip your thermometers on them, or feel them by hand.

Original poster
SantaClauseMightWork · 23/12/2017 12:39

There is only one pipe coming out of the boiler too. Attaching the pic of that point. (Haven't got the delivery of pipe thermometers yet by they should be here soon. That's why was having a look.). However, this single pipe coming out of the boiler is really hot, nearly boiling. I can't hold it more than a couple of seconds.
Here is a clear picture of the black thing. Hope you can see clearly now.

Please Pigletjohn!
Please Pigletjohn!
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PigletJohn · 23/12/2017 12:42

that's the cylinder, not the boiler.

PigletJohn · 23/12/2017 12:43

and the dull red thing with the black label is the pump.

Original poster
SantaClauseMightWork · 23/12/2017 12:53

Ah ok. Blush

I have just tried to turn it halfway between max and min. BUT, it just sprang slowly back to min. Then I turned it anti-clockwise towards zero and switched back to midway between min and max. It gave a little click, and now sitting happily between min and max.

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