Kitchen design advice - with diagram

[wowfudge]

I spent last night having a go at a kitchen plan and would welcome any advice and ideas. I know you love a diagram too . The area above the dashed line was the original kitchen and has 3 m ceiling height. The area below the dashed line is the orangery - brick walls to 2.1m (so wall units are out, but base and dresser type set ups are fine), central heating, glass ceiling and windows and French doors to the garden.

We have had the wall taken out between the two rooms and want to use the whole space for the new kitchen. The dining area is through the arch to the left, so connected with the kitchen space, but we don't need to put a table in the kitchen.

There are two existing alcove spaces which I've tried to incorporate as best as I can - FF in one and breakfast station in the other where there is an existing built in cupboard.

What do you think and are there any other configurations we should consider?

I wondered about that cat. I called in at a different branch of Magnet at lunchtime and their designer is booked to come out to us on Saturday afternoon.

The problem with Kitchen companies doing the design is that they only design based on the unit sizes that their particular ranges have available. If you go to a designer - or at least a company that uses more than one supplier then you might get more flexibility of unit sizes to fill awkward spaces.

I think the units in your alcove on the left need to be wider to fill the space.

I also think that ergonomically you would get a better arrangement with the hob in the Orangery rather than the old kitchen. Could it not be extracted through the wall where the FF is now or is that not an external wall.

I think your island may be too big/the wrong shape.

To make things a little less disjointed could you link the FF and hob area by taking units and worktop round the corner. You could also bring the FF forward a little and make the base units by the window narrower (i.e. use wall units which are 30cm deep rather than 60cm but at a base unit height) This would create a more connected long stretch of units along the right hand wall but would mean making the island a bit shorter.

I also think that the sink and dishwasher on the end of the island looks a bit odd as you don't have any worktop space to the sides.

Thanks for those suggestions Mumski - I've used a free planning tool called easyplanner and it was more to help us visualise where things might go and what the dimensions allowed and also get an idea in 3D.

Only part of that wall is an external wall - it's an odd dog legged party wall and on the other side from where the FF is is next door's utility room then part of their courtyard. Not sure whether we can vent out there?

Does worktop to the sides of a sink and dishwasher matter? The DW would he under worktop and an under mounted sink wouldn't need to take up the rest of that space. I put them there because of the old working triangle. Anyway - all food for thought.

I think it depends how you use your kitchen but when I wash up things (admitted rare as it usually goes in DW) then I have dirty pots on right and clean on the left where the drainer is (above DW) you also might find you are moving around a lot to empty DW.
However I get your point about the triangle which is also important for ergonomics.

We have gone with a design from an independent kitchen company that we were really happy with. There might be some in your area. It ain't cheap but I think it's going to be worth it.

A few thoughts.

Can you replace any doors with sliding doors? Or change the handling eg on cellar door? You could get another cupboard in front of it then for your mop and bucket etc and go through it to get to cellar? Appreciate this might be ridiculous

Re hob- why can't you get effective extraction on the island? If you had the hob there you could make better use of the wall with range cooker...

Maybe a freestanding kitchen with lots of shelving etc rather than units might suit the space better?

Your house sounds lovely.

Also the American style ff takes up a lot of space. We had one in our design but ditched it. Integrated will look smoother and actually give us more storage. Or you could get a single width ff with small freezer and have another freezer in the cellar?

I understand the island hob problem on second look!

Hmm - the cellar isn't big enough to put a freezer in and we came from a house with a tiny kitchen and the freezer in the cellar. Six years of traipsing up and down stairs was enough! I have considered a conventional fridge freezer - this one is pretty old. Mop and bucket live in the cellar. The only thing which doesn't is the hoover and that will need a new home as what is currently a large cupboard will be opened up to access the dining room.

Celtic it is a lovely house, just needs a kitchen to go with the rest of it. Then a bathroom....

I think to be honest it will be a room where climate control and extraction is quite important - with so much glass it could be hot in summer, cold in winter, steamy, etc. Maybe a fancy pants Elica "lampshade" hood over the island hob, (could it be suspended from the roof structure?) for de-greasing right above the hob. That and a big, quiet, good quality extractor on an external wall or ceiling with a humidistat/sensor so it just keeps the whole space fresh. Even an external motor one?

You've made a big, light space, it would be a shame to be constantly stuck in the dark bit cooking and traipsing around with pans and chopping boards.

My main concern with the proposed layout from a practicality point of view would be having the range cooker quite far from any usable worktop

Could you put the cooker in the alcove where the FF is shown? Then you would have the island behind you to prepare food/put saucepans etc. As you have the FF there then presumably that is a full wall not part brick/glass?

Our hob is on the island unit - we have a downdraft extractor which sits flush and comes up when you turn it on. We were re-doing the floor so were able to vent it under the floor and outside. It works really well and gave the uncluttered line I wanted. It was a bit of a nightmare to find back then, but I think they are more common now - not that cheap though.

As you do a lot of entertaining, you might also like to consider what can be seen from the dining table. I prefer to be able to sit at the table and not see (or have my guests see!) pots and pans piled up in the sink, so that is something I'm planning into our next kitchen design. Just another thought to add into the mix!

cashmere that is something I hadn't heard of and I'll look into them. Thank you. We will be ripping up the existing flooring - not sure how far we'll go as it's Amtico on hardboard on quarry tiles on ?

That alcove has wall to 2.1m then the internal gutter is above so I don't think it would be a good place for a job, but I may be wrong.

Yes - we told UKM that we wanted to use the whole space and not have everything stuck in the original kitchen area. Decent lighting should help in that section too.

Magnet do an island unit that you can move around to get large items past it - a friend has one and even though it's a faff to empty, it's been a godsend when they wanted to get a sofa out from beyond it.

Have you got the budget to knock it into the dining room or extend? It's such a tricky shape, it will be difficult to create a really good layout.

Personally I think an American FF is a must.

^just realised how absurd that sounds

Ha ha Gloria. Well, in a turn up for the books, I persuaded DP to come with me to DIY Kitchen's showroom today. I didn't realise they had one and it's actually not that far from us. He was suitably impressed and is saying we should price up our finalised design with them when we get it.

This is just as well as I always like the most expensive design in any showroom we look at.

We can't extend as we are at the limits of the boundary of a drive our next door neighbour's have a right of way over. For structural reasons we can't remove the wall between the orangery and the dining room - that was our original plan.

I designed mine and the main thing I did was to plan where I would stand while doing each task

• cutting up veg and then putting into a pan on the hob
• emptying the dishwasher
• laying the table

I made my main food prep area be behind my island so that even when we have huge gatherings only one person is by the hob
and I have decent work space on each sie of my hob for cooking

all low units are drawers rather than cupboards - SO much easier to use

but you need to plan how the spaces will work (the old classic fridge hob sink triangle)
and go from there.

The Ikea design tool is fab - even if not using Ikea kitchens - as it lets to test ideas again and again

Where will you do your food prep? On the island? Because it looks a bit awkward to get to the hob with stuff to add to a pan etc with your dink and dishwasher where they are. Could you have integrated freezers in your island and use the F/F space another way?

If you are having a party, your main "flow" will be between the dining room and the french doors
so that is where you need to plan glasses, booze, cutlery, tableware

at the other end of the kitchen you want your sane cooking space
but with the fridge reachable without impinging on the hob / oven area

but you need to reach the dishwasher and sink from both
and be able to cook without the island getting messy

if you are not a party person its less of an issue - but still a later selling point

That alcove where you have the fridge freezer could be used for a lot of storage for baking tins, less used equipment. Deep pull outs. You could have it so deep the cabinet next to it was flush at the front.
And you could have twin freezer drawers and twin fridges in the island where you actually want them?
Sorry I don't get the statement appliance thing..

I would first of all start with streamlining the back wall and have a walk in larder with doors to match the units? The. Add other untis where needed.

Sorry for the typos that should say and then add on other units where needed.