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Original poster

Seller threatening to pull out if we don't exchange in 2 weeks :(

99 replies

Definitelynotme · 17/08/2015 15:07

Had an offer accepted back in June. Some trouble getting the mortgage agreed, but this happened last week. In the meantime we have moved forward, so solicitor engaged, searches completed, survey carried out. A few minor requests from solicitor but nothing major. We are first time buyers, place is currently let, tenant is moving out end of September.

Just heard via estate agent seller is now threatening to put the house back on the market if we don't exchange in 2 weeks Hmm Angry. They know we have the mortgage approved and paid out to solicitors. They know we can't move until 1 October as this is their deadline for the tenant moving out. So what are they playing at?! Also we are told by our solicitor they have not had any responses from the seller's solicitor on any requests raised.

We have done everything we can and are so close to completion, what can they achieve by threatening us now?!

OP posts:
anotherdayanothersquabble · 17/08/2015 21:03

Speak to your solicitor and have it as a condition of completion. If tenant does not vacate in line with planned completion date, your deposit is returned and abortive purchase costs are paid by the seller. I have just gone through a purchase with several possible failure points and all possible failure outcomes were detailed in the contact. Tedious and complicated but low risk! (we are not in the UK so I don't know if it's possible to do this but your solicitor will!)

Highabove · 17/08/2015 21:08

When I sold my tenanted flat they had to be out before exchange.

TheUnwillingNarcheska · 17/08/2015 21:24

Another vote for vacant possession, the last thing you would want is to own a property with a tenant who won't leave. You then become a landlord and would have to serve the correct paperwork to get them out. It could take months and you would be homeless trying to find a short let yourselves.

The fact that the seller is pushing this may be because you are first time buyers and so are possibly unaware of the pitfalls.

Our seller stipulated that they wanted 4 weeks between exchange and completion to enable them to find a rental property which was fine. I would be questioning why your seller wants you to exchange in 2 weeks when tenant isn't moving out until the end of September.

clam · 17/08/2015 21:24

So how on earth do they think putting it back on the market is going to help anything? Any potential new buyer is hardly going to be quicker to exchange than you are! Hmm

OVienna · 17/08/2015 21:34

There has to be some reason they're panicking. I don't think you've taken unduly long. The mortgage process can take much longer these days in my experience. They have to document every conversation they have with you. I agree about putting a clause in about them covering your costs if the tenant doesn't leave. Could you seriously afford the time, effort, and aggro of having to evict her?

Bearsinmotion · 17/08/2015 21:49

In some ways I am glad others agree with me that this is a concern. DP is still insisting we should be fine Hmm but will talk to the solicitor about making it a condition of completion.

We are in a rental property with 4 weeks notice, and had planned a crossover of 4 weeks with both properties so we shouldn't be homeless, just very Angry.

And clam, I honestly have no idea! Just doesn't make sense to me Confused

clam · 17/08/2015 22:10

My parents just had this - they were a day or two away from exchange and then the sellers of the house they were buying started chucking their toys out of the pram and put it back on the market. Two days later, they exchanged but I bet they were congratulating themselves that their action had somehow speeded (sped?) everything up.

RandomMess · 17/08/2015 22:13

You can exchange and complete within a day, although it's unusual. So you can counter offer to exchange and then complete 3 days later.

No-one else is going to be able to complete more quickly than you as they'll have the same vacant possession hurdles!

SWFARMER · 17/08/2015 22:19

Hope this doesn't happen to me. We also had offer accepted start of June and no chains nd first time buyers.

Our solicitor is being a complete shit and has lied loads regarding raising queries when they haven't. I wish there was someone to turn to get advice on what to do!!

guzzlewump · 17/08/2015 22:34

The other thing to remember is to take out insurance from when you exchange... Might be more complicated if it's got tenants in but other owners, estate agents, solicitors or your current insurers etc should be able to help direct you in the right direction.

We've certainly exchanged before subject to conditions like the survey coming back ok when it was taking a long time. And we did pull out and get our money back as despite it being a new house, the surveyor found some shocking faults (like a supporting wall for the garden made out of old garage panels and already beginning to slip) and even more red flags that he thought worrying enough to say he thought it was the worst new build he'd come across.

So it would certainly be very reasonable of you to ask them to take the risk on the tenant moving out and you getting vacant possession if they want to see progress!

specialsubject · 17/08/2015 22:35

no competent solicitor will let you exchange until the tenant has gone. And that applies to any other buyers unless they are planning to be landlords; and possibly not even then.

most tenants do go at the end of their notice, but not all. It is a notice of 'legal proceedings to evict start at this date' and is NOT a guarantee that the tenant will be gone. Hence the problem.

the seller's problem, that is...

do NOT give notice on your rental until you have exchanged.

RaphaellaTheSpanishWaterDog · 18/08/2015 00:49

Agree that any solicitor worth his or her salt wouldn't allow you to exchange till the tenant had vacated the property......

About fifteen years ago we bought a house that had been converted into four flats. Two of the four tenants proved to be reluctant to vacate despite having been served notice in the correct manner by our vendor and eventually they had to be evicted (court process, bailiffs etc). Our solicitor was adamant that we shouldn't even be considering exchange till the last tenant had gone.

Everything took longer than expected and we had to camp out at my parents' house for six weeks as our sale had already gone through, but whilst it was a nail-biting few weeks, I'd rather it that way than exchanging with no guarantee the tenant(s) would ever leave......

I know this is an extreme example and I'm sure your middle class older lady will not prove as intransigent, but far better to err on the side of caution imho. Hope it all works out for you x

BrendaFlange · 18/08/2015 06:50

Your solicitor is the one to advise on vacant possession, not your DP or the mortgage co.

Though the vendor is exchanging contracts on the basis of vacant possession at completion so it is their liability.

Spickle · 18/08/2015 07:39

Do not exchange until tenant has vacated! I work in conveyancing and we would never advise anyone to buy a property with a tenant in situ, unless they were taking over the tenancy.

Also, it is not up to your seller's to demand when exchange takes place, nor the estate agent.

Do not under estimate how long enquiries take - this is what takes so long because of the various third parties involved. Your solicitor is acting for you. He does the legals and would be stupid to let you exchange when he is not yet satisfied that all is in order.

If you are buying a leasehold property, the enquiries will take longer because there is a questionnaire for the managing agents/freeholder to answer and a management pack has to be supplied (hefty charge for the vendor) and your solicitor will need to go through the terms of the lease.

Good luck!

Bearsinmotion · 18/08/2015 07:54

Thanks all. Spickle, really good to hear from you as well - our solicitor has not mentioned the tenants at all, although I assume she is aware. We will raise this with her again today.

The property is freehold. We don't think there were many enquiries resulting from the searches so that shouldn't take too long. Until we got the ultimatum from the seller we didn't see anything unduly worrying - now starting to worry he has something to hide Confused

clam · 18/08/2015 08:16

I wonder whether the seller is being "advised" by some 'bloke down the pub,' who's geeing them on with all sorts of nonsense like "what you wanna do is... blah di blah." I'm pretty sure that's what happened with my parents, as their seller suddenly went from being pleasant and agreeable to making ridiculous demands.

Bearsinmotion · 18/08/2015 09:30

I wondered that too clam. Also he has owned the property for more than 30 years so perhaps has lost touch with how long current mortgages take to be approved...

Will see what the solicitor says today...

Bearsinmotion · 19/08/2015 09:45

So if anyone is interested, the solicitor isn't that phased, she says the property is sold as vacant possession and the sellers will be penalised if the tenant won't move Hmm. We are FTB and can stay longer in our current rental, so it looks like we will take the risk.

Enquiries are due back today, so we should be able to exchange soon. Just don't like being bullied into it Angry

specialsubject · 19/08/2015 10:32

You need a second opinion on what the solicitor is saying, and you also need to be told exactly what the penalties on the seller will be if the tenant doesn't go.

I detect that your solicitor wants to minimise work.

because if the tenant doesn't go, you are looking at four months or so of legal proceedings and bailiffs before she is removed. In that time the place could be destroyed and no rent paid. Where are you going to live if any of that happens?

worst case - but perfectly possible.

SWFARMER · 19/08/2015 11:18

Good luck OP. We were having terrible problems but yesterday were told we are due to exchange today and could be moving in Monday. I hope things resolve quickly for you like they suddenly did for us

OVienna · 19/08/2015 18:41

Don't take her word for it. The sellers of our cottage were appalling in all sorts of ways. She may be too. I'd consider sacking. Pm me if you want a recommendation.

JeffreyNeedsAHobby · 19/08/2015 18:44

They are probably pushing, Estate Agents are also reknowned for making these up just to check you aren't about to pull out. Sadly it sometimes has the opposite affect and makes people twitchy.
Just go with it, get you solicitor to suggest a realistic date to the other side and go from there.

JeffreyNeedsAHobby · 19/08/2015 18:48

Just seen you don't even have the tenant details or enquiries back yet - your solicitor won't be able to give you a timescale until they see these. You want the solicitor to do the correct work and not rush your purchase and miss important information and they may well need to send off for other information once they get these questions back from the seller. The seller will have to do these with every buyer so he will just have to get used to it. Seems he may be holding things up at his end if he hasn't returned them to his solicitors...

Spickle · 19/08/2015 19:59

Enquiries are due back today, so we should be able to exchange soon.

No, no, no. This does not mean you should be able to exchange soon. It merely means that the seller's and their solicitors have replied to questions your solicitor has asked. The replies could be of the very vague variety, such as "not to my knowledge", "extension done under permitted development", "don't know when the boiler was last serviced". Their replies may mean that your solicitor has to ask more questions, request paperwork be supplied or contact a third party. Until your solicitor is satisfied with the responses he will not discuss exchange dates.

JellyTipisthebest · 19/08/2015 21:53

Don't complete on a Friday if something goes wrong there is no time to sort it. We completed on a Friday the first time before a bank holiday weekend the owners moved themselves and had still not finished by 5.30pm. They ended up putting stuff in the garage and us not having the garage until the next day. The next time we moved we wrote it in the contract that if not empty by two we need a amount of money per hr to pay our removal men. They were late but in reality getting extra money out of them was impossible. I think if I was moving again in uk I would hold money back if I had any hint that they were moving themselfs