Fire regs for loft conversion? Mist system - any experiences?

[pomegranate15]

Hello all, we've just had our loft converted and, due to the open plan living / dining room downstairs, we've been told that we need to install a mist system (like a sprinkler system) to comply with building/fire regs.

In all it's going to cost us £3k so we're not at all happy. And I can't find anything online about it, except from the companies who manufacture and install them.

Does anyone have any similar experience or knowledge they can share? I wonder whether putting up a fight is pointless...

Thanks so much!

That's very unusual. When you say "we've been told" who by?

weren't you offered the option of fire-resisting doors?

Wasn't it mentioned when the plans were submitted prior to starting build?

The loft company's usual building regs firm (private not council, called Aedis) have said they can't pass us unless we get one. It was mentioned on the plans. We have a 'FD30' to the loft room but were advised we didn't need fire doors elsewhere. We asked about having FDs instead of mist system but advised this no longer complies. Thanks for any thoughts / info.

I would get a second opinion from the council.

We were in this position when we did our loft conversion 3 years ago. We couldn't afford the mist system so we got the loft company to put up a temporary wall downstairs to create a corridor from the stairs to the front door. The building inspector then came and passed the work and the builder then took down the temporary wall. We are now in the process of selling our house and I was a litle concerned about this being a problem and talked to our EA about it but he said it wouldn't be a problem and we sold at asking price very quickly. However we sold to people who want the house as their home. If you wanted to use the property as a rental or sell it someone who might want to in the future then it could be a problem. As a householder you can do things to your own property which potentially make it less than 100% safe in the event of a fire, but as a landlord you would need to be 100% complient.

many thanks nickEcave. Really useful advice. I hear that this (not having mist system or taking temp wall down) can negate home insurance too? Good luck with your move.

My council had never heard of the mist system and didn't think they'd meet regs. We had to use fire doors in end.

Can you rung your council and get someone out - or email your layout to them?

Hi pomegranate15,

Did you manage to sort out the misting system?
We have a similar layout - open plan living on ground floor.

We have also had a quote for the misting system at £6000.

Thanks

My quote was the same, Windrest, from Automist - small London terrace. Sprinkler system came in around 3K but there'd be extra if mains pressure wasn't suitable (additional 2Kish) so not much in it.

Yeah, I would not recommend going with a 'dummy wall', you will end up having to put it back up if you sell your house. There are quite a few different watermist systems available these days but sometimes you can even go with a fire curtain. Both can be used to meet regs. The price and suitability depends on your property.

I think it's really irresponsible to put up a dummy wall just to get it signed off. These measures are in place to keep the occupants safe - they're not plucked out of the sky - they are as a result of stringent tests.

It is not remotely unusual. If a house has aloft conversion and an open plan ground floor, a suppression system is necessary. It's usually sprinklers, but automise is becoming more popular.

If you had it signed off as having a protected route (i.e. with fire doors) and then removed this protection and there was a fire affecting means of escape - your house insurance would be invalid.

We are going through the process of a loft conversion and our builder gave us various options. It apparently used to be that fire doors were the main option but having alarms and detectors in every habitable room (wire free) is now also an option rather than replacing all the doors. For us the price worked out about even (and they calculated a lot of rooms! ) so we have gone for the latter as it is less disruption and also would give us more warning, or so we like to think rather than let a fire build up behind one door which may contain the fire for a good period of time but end up getting such a hold it destroys your home. I don't pretend to quite understand it all but mention my experience more as a note that other options are available. I personally would never circumnavigate building regs, they are there for a reason.

We have just had a loft conversion. We had linked mains wired fire alarms installed in every room. Then I think we only needed fire doors on new room. We had to replace a wall due to open plan downstairs and actually I really like it. If we didn't have that rebuilt we would have needed sprinklers. They did mention that building control would never know if you took it down. It I am guessing it would come up on resale. Our linked alarm was so loud when it accidentally went off I think the whole street would be awake not just us!

It is a bit worrying how people are more worried about a completion certificate and the house insurance than their own lives.
When you're thinking about what regs you can bend or abuse, first imagine that reg doesn't exist and you know someone who just had a fire in their tumble dryer/laptop charger/TV at night. Then think about what would save you in the event of that happening in your house any time in the next 30 years. You'll probably find the regs are pretty sensible on reflection.

Hi I know the original thread is a while ago but I'm in the same position - new loft and fully open plan ground floor. All doors fire rated. First I was quoted for 1 mist system and pump then just as about to have installed the parent company said I had to have two and the price double to 3.2k ... 4 months on still trying to get system in but how do I know that I'm not being duped into having 2 pumps room is 32ft x12

Meant to add - their website says cheaper than sprinklers etc makes you feel uneasy with quotes as they have a captive market as still a fairly new system so can push up the quote - I want my home safe and insured I just don't want extra pumps and nozzles if I don't need them taking up valuable space in my tiny Victorian terrace

Have you looked at Plumis?

They are very good and their website has good technical advice regarding areas covered per spray head.

I will try Plumis.

Whatever you do. Don't use Puck Fire. I'm absolutely livid, got this message last month after forking out for one of there systems. Buyers beware:

"Good Afternoon Linda,

Not the news you are wanting to hear but please see the below:

You have within the last 12 / 24 months had a PUCK Water Mist System / Nebula System installed within your home or site.

The system was manufactured by PUCK Fire Limited or MFS Ltd who have recently ceased trading and a company Hi-Pro Industries Ltd has bought the rights to the manufacturing and sales of the PUCK system which means you now have no manufacturing warranty. MFS Ltd are also no longer in Business along with another company that was set up called Elan Ltd

It has come to our attention through some of PUCK Fire Limited distributors, that there is a potential concern with the systems sitting at high water pressure over a prolonged period of time. The issue has come to light because some pipes have come out of fittings which have been ok for months causing flooding.

The problem occurs with the red flexible pipework and fittings supplied by Puck Fire Ltd, these parts have been withdrawn from sale by Puck Fire, the reason given by Puck Fire Ltd was there “was a bad batch of fittings” As distributors for Puck we have to follow there manual and install and commission their systems to this manual.

The manual has now been changed and currently asks for hydraulic hoses to be installed instead of the red flexible pipework. As Puck is under new management you have nowhere to claim if you have a problem.

We highly recommend the new system modification is carried out to limit potential excess water damage following a system activation or system pipework failure.

This means you will have to replace all the red puck pipe work and Nozzles – We can adapt the pump to take the new hydraulic pipe work.

The cost of the modification will be £TBC + VAT per system,

We as a company understand that you may not want to pay the additional cost or even want the modification carried out. If you DO NOT have the modification carried out we cannot accept any liability for any damage caused by Puck Fire Ltd equipment.

If you wish to have the modification carried out please turn the water supply off to the pump, turn the power supply off to the pump and contact us. at

Please give your name and full address and the date the system was installed and commissioned, there should be a sticker on the pump with this information"

Hi we've also just been told we will need a misting system or fire curtain in our open plans down stairs, because of our new loft conversion. We are thinking fire curtain,. Does anyone have any experience please?

Hi all,
Firstly my apologies if this post is not allowed - 1st post on here but hopefully one that you may find useful.

I work for iMist Fire Suppression (www.imist.co.uk) and I would be happy to assist any of you with any queries or if you have a requirement for Fire Suppression.

Please don't hesitate to get in touch.

All the best

Eddie Sibley

Hey all, hope everyone is well.

Just a heads up, based on a post earlier in this thread regarding PUCK.
They have recently gone into administration but have rebranded as ICO (ICO-Products).

I can't dissuade anyone from using a supplier of their choosing but would have reservations about handing my money over to a "phoenix" firm.

Have a great weekend all

Eddie, iMist Fire Suppression (www.imist.com)

We are being told we need a most system and a wall/fire curtain that separates our kitchen from the open plan area. Do I need both or will one suffice?

Hi Faithfulspies,

I have message you directly regarding your post. But please feel free to mail me [email protected]

Eddie

So what’s the point in the fire curtain? Surely the sprinkler system is all I need?