Installing Central Heating from Storage Heating....

[Teacuptravells]

We live in a bizarre part of a 1980s modern boxy estate that doesn't have central heating. However we're close to the area that does and I think its "only" a few hundred to get it piped to us.

We're considering installing CH - mainly so that the house is sellable in years to come. We've kind of come around to storage heating as we've finally worked out how to make it work, we get warmth all day and at a fraction of the cost of CH, no maintenance etc..... BUT I think long term we need to invest in it!!

How do we find firms that do this? Presumably we're quite odd needing conversion in a modern property. What sort of quesitons do we need to ask them?

We have a v.crappy electric shower - we'd like a good shower, does this affect things?

Presumably we need radiators in most rooms, and space for a combi boiler?

Any other advice....

THANKYOU :D

Thanks ever so much for taking the time to post :)

I've got a third recommendaiton now so will contact him tomorrow and hopefully get some quotes in :D

Presumably if they're serviced yearly they're ok? I do get quite anxious about fires (friend had a fire in their bedroom...) but we'd stick to a servicing schedule.

So he came today - Suggested a Worcester (although also does "glo worm) boiler. Copper piping, Combi boiler in kitchen (gas to come into backgarden next to kitchen) 3 radiators downstairs and 3 upstairs. Will have to have a couple of pipes going up through to upstairs as cant be hidden easily.

Told him we were also interested in decent shower and gas hob. He said the problem with a combi is that you lose heat for the shower if people using hot water elsewhere.... so said we could keep electric shower or have a shower piped to the combi .

But was keen on a combi.... I'll see what hte quote says.

The other 2 haven't got back to me sad

I have rung a VAliant guy (ha!) and another one so I will have 3 quotes.

Does anyone know about removing Storage heaters. The guy we had said it would save us money if we did it ourselves but htey're astronomically/dangerously heavy aren't they? Is it possible to DIY....

you can disconnect the power, then remove the case and lift out the bricks you find inside. There may be a film on videojug. The electric heater itself is not very heavy. It will (should) be screwed to wall brackets.

Unless they are modern, try to find out first if they have asbestos insulation. The maker's website may say.

"He said the problem with a combi is that you lose heat for the shower if people using hot water elsewhere"

a cylinder (unvented or not) would not have that problem

Second plumber has been and also recommended a combi - this time in the airing cuboard (not external wall) as it could go striaght up and not lose us precious space in the small cupboard. I like this one better but I guess that's just feelings.

Rather confusingly we also had a surveryor round to do an energy check (came as part of the free loft insulation/cavity wall top up) and he said we'd be better off with the all new storage heaters which you can set and leave and were more efficient due to the thermostat/not needing human intervention each night. He said it would be cheaper etc but we'd like to sell the house in about 5 years time and I'm still not sure it would sell as easily. It would save a lot of upheaval just to replace the storage heaters I guess?!

Oh and he said all houses built as of next year will be electric (?!) as they have to be energy efficient. Am I mad converting the house (at cost) to gas?!

energy from electricity costs about three times as much as energy from gas.

Many UK power stations generate electricity from gas turbines. As I write this, I see from the National Grid meters that it is 37.6% of current demand, but in winter it is higher.

Any electric heater is exactly as efficient as any other electric heater inside your house however there are enormous losses and inefficiencies in the generation, distribution and supply of electricity. Because they are not inside your house the "surveyor" may think they don't exist. It is these losses that contribute to the high cost of electricity.

Mr Cameron has guaranteed to pay the French more than the market price of electricity if they build some nuclear stations for us. I can't see how guaranteeing a high price to the generator will move electricity prices in any direction other than up.

starting to veer off course, but the UK's energy supply is looking very iffy thanks to years of neglect and stupid renewables policies. Nuclear is not the complete solution, but because building new plants has been stalled for years we are now in deep trouble.

the Germans are already there - their daft greenies banned nuclear power because Japan is on a fault line and now they've got real supply problems.

if you have the opportunity, look at backups for your house; solar (if it will work without the grid), LPG bottles and woodburners. But this is not practical for many.

if you want me I'll be in my cave...

I guess maybe they include replacing the boiler/ getting it checked each year in their calculations and add that on to the total?

I was a bit flummoxed. We've already started the ball rolling with getting connected to gas (just behind us). I assume he had no particular axe to grind - he had an ipad with buttons to update the energy efficiency with each change (showed us that the insulation/cavity wall was the main thing) that updating iwndows woudl make a small, but not nec cost efficient change (already have double glazing) and that updating storage heaters would make another change. I think its not the heater itself thats inefficent perse but the controls - the newer ones are thermostated?

www.dimplex.co.uk/products/domestic_heating/installed_heating/quantum/quantum/index.htm

I guess maybe they include replacing the boiler/ getting it checked each year in their calculations and add that on to the total?

I was a bit flummoxed. We've already started the ball rolling with getting connected to gas (just behind us). I assume he had no particular axe to grind - he had an ipad with buttons to update the energy efficiency with each change (showed us that the insulation/cavity wall was the main thing) that updating iwndows woudl make a small, but not nec cost efficient change (already have double glazing) and that updating storage heaters would make another change. I think its not the heater itself thats inefficent perse but the controls - the newer ones are thermostated?

www.dimplex.co.uk/products/domestic_heating/installed_heating/quantum/quantum/index.htm

Oops - posted twice without finishing post! The link suggests theyre 27% cheaper to run?

So I'm paying £100 a month currently (we often dont bother heating the emmersion heater)- I'd save £317 a year with the modern ones.

At 2200 that's still 7 years before they'd be paid off!

Gas installation I think is going to cost 3-4000 so presumably wont be paid off through savings, and some money will need to go towards replacement boiler/ checks. However it will presumably make it more marketable as long as the pipes dont look out of place.

specialsubject. I'm open to suggestion (so to speak) but in a tiny box of an ex council house, with very little space. I think we could have solar panels but hope to sell the house in say 5 years and not sure they're advised.

I think you are right - at the moment solar panels don't make economic sense (crazy, huh?) although an EPC will happily tell you to put a wind turbine in a tiny garden!

as panels get cheaper and electricity prices go up, it will make sense - but at the moment it doesn't.

you certainly don't want cowboy panels from those people who rent your roof, that will make the place unsellable in the same way as the green steal deal loan does.

much further upthread someone was saying that storage heaters do in fact work well, but as PJ points out, they will probably get much more expensive to run. So I think you are on the right track with gas.

Oh yes - I think the guy who came out to see us was able to offer the "green deal" but didn't actually pedal it - just mentioned various incentives were available etc. I twigged I hadn't wanted anything on the house! We happen to have a lump sum (not high income self employed but had a good run) so thought we ought to bite the bullet.

I'm not sure we'd recoup the money unless we sell, but we really would like to move eventually.

I am just surprised that the energy guy/surveyor/EPC guy wasn't in favour of installing gas ("I'd say differently if you already had gas - I'd update the boiler... but as you have storage heaters its more cost effective to update those.") He completely assumed we were housing association (we're not, we're owners) and I think they do alot of work with housing associations/pedal the green deal so maybe that makes a difference?

"Up to 27% cheaper to run than standard storage heater system and up to 47% cheaper to run than an electric convector or radiator system "

I just love the words "up to"

I will earn up to a billion pounds this year. That includes £10 and it includes 1p and it includes zero.

I don't like a storage system that you fill up with heat on Monday night in the belief that on Tuesday it will be cold, and you will be at home.

Specialsubject - "you certainly don't want cowboy panels from those people who rent your roof, that will make the place unsellable in the same way as the green steal deal loan does."

Can I jump on this as I've been eavesdropping on your thread? Why does the green deal loan make your house unsellable?

I think its a loan thats tied into the house/suppliers to the house. In theory it could be paid off at point of sale?

Piglet - we've already committed to getting gas connected in next 3 weeks, and have the 3 plumbers quotes lined up - just really confused why the energy guy/surveryor/EPC guy would give us conflicting advice to what seems obvious in a way! I'm so scared of spending 4-5grand and getting it "wrong" or spending it unnecessarily.

I had the green deal guy come round to check the roof insulation and he recommended gas central heating!

I really don't think you can go 'wrong' by having it installed. I suppose it could be 'unnecessary' but when it comes to sell if one house has CH and the otherSHI know which I'd pick.

That's interesting Agrestic - are you on storage heaters at the moment? MAybe it was linked inot their current deals/cost-effectiveness.

My husband is saying we're not exactly going to regret moving to gas - but it does come wiht additional costs - saving towards next boiler (do they ever last loger than 10 years?) and the gas check. Do i need gas insurance/british gas plan ?

Its a heck of alot of money for us - but we're thinking we'd rather do it now than if we were trying to sell in 5 years...

the green deal loan is indeed tied to the house, not the person - so while 'unsellable' may be a bit strong, many will be very wary of buying a house with this lengthy charge on it. I certainly wouldn't.

the 'free solar panel' lot have a strong tendency to damage roofs by poor practice and not checking loadings, and you see a lot of installations on the wrong side or on shaded roofs. MIL had a visit from this crew (which she smartly fended off) wanting to put the panels on the north side. In the UK.

How are you doing teacup? Any further in your decision?

The guys came to connect us, however they hadn't booked the road closure with the council... They decided to crack on anyway but there was too much traffic to continue safely. So now I've just got the box on my wall and a big hole underneath it! God knows how long it will take them to actually arrange the closure, at the start they said it would take 3 months to arrange! Hope I'm not putting you off

Hello!

The gas connection is really quick here.3 weeks phone call to finish. Cost 900 and is going in next week. Luckily we don't need to close a road as it's behind us and going to come through the garden!

However it's taken a while to get quotes in and the first one is 6000 for valiant boiler, 6 radiators and all the piping. Was a bit more than we were hoping to be honest! I want a shower and that wasn't included in the quote either.

We don't have much money but feel it will need to be done longterm or to sell it. Not overly convinced well recoup costs especially when you add in that the boilers need replacing and servicing.

Has your installation started?