Deductions from tenancy deposit - advice needed

[ASuitableGirl]

I have moved out of my rented house although tenancy has not yet ended (will end on Friday 17th April). Have been there almost 5 years. Whilst I was still living there the letting agent and landlord came round and I was told it would be completely redecorated once I had left.

Letting agent went there on 2nd April with the contractors to discuss what is needed. I was called on 9th April and told that of my £925 deposit, £900 is going to be kept. This is due to grease marks from having used blue tack. The total cost of redecorating is £1,700. I have been told it is unfair for the landlord to pay for my damage.

I realise I shouldn't have used it (never will again) but feel the charge is disproportionate. Have spoken to shelter who agree the amount does seem large. Having looked at various websites, it seems that the deposit can be taken where landlord has suffered costs they would not have otherwise incurred and so I have asked for a breakdown of how the £900 is made up.

I have been summonsed to a meeting at the old house on Tuesday with the letting agent so I can be shown the marks. I have been in over the weekend and used various methods I have read about and feel it is now in better condition than it was but am worried about this meeting.

The contractors are coming in on Wednesday with my check out on Friday so I am uncertain whether the letting agent is going to count the condition as being on 2nd April, 14th April or 17th April (when I expect some marks will have been painted over?) as the condition at check out. I have done a thorough clean as I was told this had to be done before the contractors came but once they have started I am unsure how I can make sure it is spotless.

I am going to take photos showing the condition tomorrow and going to be firm that I need to see the precise breakdown. And will also not sign anything agreeing to the deductions tomorrow.

I feel the date of checkout seems a slightly grey area. When I was told a few weeks ago that the contractors were likely to start work earlier I said that if I had checked out sooner than the 17th April that I would be looking to get some of the rent back. I am slightly concerned mentioning this means they are being harsh with the deductions.

If there has been an additional cost of £900 that is what should he thane but I honestly don't feel it should be that much.

Any advice greatfully received.

I have spoken to Shelter, the tenancy deposit scheme (who have said that given that the decorator has come it will be difficult for the landlord to show when anything was damaged) and looked into making a complaint through the property ombudsman in terms of the intimidation. For that I will need to make an official complaint to the letting agents, which I will do once I have ended the tenancy.

I have emailed the letting agents using most of the words suggested above. XH is going to come with me tomorrow morning - I'm not sure he quite appreciates what is going on but will be good to have someone else there. I also (briefly) bumped into the decorator who said he will be there for much of next week too (was suddenly worried he would actually finish today).

I will put up lampshades that are meant to be there but I think that will be the limit of what I do.

Thank you everyone and I will let you know what happens tomorrow (and after that)

Check out is at 11. Haven't had any response to the email - will take a printed copy with me. I know that things should be on my side but I am still very nervous.

You'll be fine! They are trying it on.

How did it go?

How did you get on?

Will reply more later but was rather different than might have been expected given what happened before the check out...

Deduction less than £900 at any rate.

Come on OP - a proper update please. Remember you should get all your money back as the decorator's presence has voided the check out.

There ARE no Deductions , remember?

Your reply to any mention of deductions is "good luck with that"

I hate it when people don't update their threads.

Oh no news yet? I expect she's just busy! chill out peeps.

Oh, I was hoping for an update too! Still I suppose the OP probably has a life elsewhere.

Sorry about the delay - have had visitors here (my parents) and have been having some real life

Check out was scheduled for 11 so I got there for 10:45, as did the letting agents. She brought another one with her as she's away in Australia on holiday now. I had XH with me and the decorator was there too so a full house.

She was generally being nit picky and attempting to intimidate but XH mainly stopped her in her tracks. She didn't mention the email I had sent. I said I'd been surprised to find the decorator there and she said she was sorry I'd misunderstood what she'd said on the Tuesday (where she had said he'd be coming in to do a few bits and pieces).

She mentioned the blue tack grease marks in one of the rooms and then started looking at the hall curtains for cleanliness (luckily there was no condition on the opening inventory so she gave up on them). Upstairs she said another set of curtains were dirty with cat hairs on. I took a photo and XH removed the (one) cat hair. She then said upstairs was fine and she was glad I'd done some extra cleaning (not what she'd said on Tuesday...)

Downstairs she opened one cupboard in the kitchen and found a mark. Was going to get annoyed with me but luckily XH cleaned it off in front of her.

The wooden part of skirting board my cat weed on was mentioned and tbh I can't see how that could be argued with. It was soaked with wee and had rotted away so I accept there was an additional cost there.

The curtains in both the front and back rooms were mentioned. I'm not sure whether any wear and tear could be attributed there but the back room ones did have some dirt on and the front room ones did have some cat hair on. And in the inventory they were down as clean.

She then spoke about deductions and the total was £85 for the wood and one wall and whatever two pairs if curtains cost for dry cleaning. I received an email later on clarifying the items that would be deducted and I will get the breakdown within 10 working days.

So very different from £900. As I said the part for the cat wee is definitely me. Not sure what part of the £85 is for the blue tack marks but not sure whether I can/should try arguing against it. And curtains - can any proportion be wear and tear? It obviously wasn't the decorator?

I am going to do a separate claim relating to the intimidation - have looked at the property ombudsman website and need to make a complain to the letting agent first so once the deposit stuff is done with I'll be doing that.

Apologies again for looking like a poster who doesn't return but I do generally get there in the end :)

Hang on - it doesn't matter what has now been said or even that your cat did cause the area of damage: by sending a contractor in during the tenancy the check out is void. Stick to your guns and don't pay a penny. You want the deposit back in full. Everything said/noted against the start of tenancy inventory is immaterial. Don't treat the intimidation as separate - that's further evidence together with the contractor going in - when raising a dispute over the proposed £85 deduction.

< rolls eyes >

Would you just READ what you've been told?

DUSPUTE IT ALL ON THE GROUNDS THAT THE VENDOR HAS TAKEN BACK THE PROPERTY PRIOR TO YOU CHECKING OUT AND THEREFORE VOIDED YOUR CHECK OUT.

tell them you're not accepting anything, due to their illegal entry into your home and the compromised check out. You'll expect the FULL DEPOSIT in your account in 10 days.

Failing that, if you're intent on giving YOUR money away you anyone that has the nerve to ask, pm me and I'll send you my bank details!

But why shouldn't she pay when she let her cat pee on something and left it to rot?

That's what I'm thinking MrsMorton. The landlord has an additional cost they would not have had - I can't see why I should not pay. Am slightly less sure about any element due to blue tack marks though.

I accept that the check out could be voided by the decorator coming in but all my googling doesn't seem to find anything. If you could point me in the right direction it would be good.

And of course I am not wanting to just give my money away - if I felt that way I would have just said yes to the original amount of deduction I was told about.

And how was it illegal for them to enter? Did I actually need written notice (which I didn't have) or would the fact I was told about it verbally and didn't firmly say no mean that I did agree? I will accept I felt intimidated into agreeing though but not sure that Would stand up in a court.

Quote for curtains has come back at £80 per pair. So £160 in total. Doesn't include back up for their figure so I presume I can ask for that. Am pretty sure I've seen that Johnsons are doing it for £35 a pair (I realised I should have got it done earlier but none of us are perfect are we?)

A tenant has the right to quiet enjoyment during the tenancy. Unless you freely give your permission for any agent of the LL to enter - so that could be the EA conducting viewings, the decorator painting, basically anything other than an emergency situation (think gas leak, flood or similar) - the LL is violating that.

You've said you felt intimidated. It was wrong IN LAW for the decorator to go in before the end of the tenancy without your permission; from what you've posted you were just told it was happening. It matters not one jot what the actual tenancy agreement states, this violation voids the LL's right to make any deductions from your deposit monies.

You don't need to say, in court, that you didn't agree to them going in. The only people you need to tell are the deposit protection scheme. It'll never get as far as court and complaining to the body the agents are members of will not win you any money. You only have power against them while they think they are getting some of your money!

In your position I'd be livid and I'd be writing to the agent and telling them you accept no deductions for those very reasons.

legally the condition at check in vs the condition at check out has been voided due to the LL accessing the property, taking it back effectively and allowing 3rd parties to enter the OP's HOME without her EXPRESS PERMISSION.

the minimum the LL should have done is to seek permission (and accept it may not be given) a MINIMUM of 24 hours prior to each and every access.

They didn't and as a result of their decisions they have rendered the chance of getting ANY deduction from the deposit IMPOSSIBLE.

until the check out, the property remains the home of the tenant and NO-ONE has the right to enter it without OP permission.

the LL and the agent have broken the contract and on top of which intimidated the tenant.

The tenant does not need to accept any demand of of payment from her deposit as a result of this.

Only IF you want to give money for the skirting board as a gesture of goodwill should you do so. forget the curtains, forget the carpets and everything else. Your agent and LL blew it.

This will teach them the lesson they need about being professional, informed and respectful.

Dear LL/Agent

As you are aware, my check out date/time was scheduled for....

Due to your having accessed the property and carrying out work with a contractor, you have voided the inventory/check out process and as a result I will be refuting any deductions from my deposit.

you gained access to my home without permission, allowing free access to the same by your contractor and as such have breached the tenancy contract.

I expect my full deposit returned within 10 days.

Yours
OP

If your inventory states scuffs to walls, but no photos to back anything up, your LL has NO chance of getting a single penny as they can't prove anything.

the tenancy money is yours - if a LL wants it, they have to prove real financial loss and need for recompense prior to relet.

Your LL, is she reletting or selling?

As a former inventory clerk, it was my job to establish condition at the start of a tenancy to protect the tenant from being charged for existing damage etc. at check out it was my job to ensure that any damage caused within the tenancy was NOT left to the LL to cover.

this covers cleaning, marks, holes, burns, pets etc.

I had a LL want to deduct money from the tenant for damage to a property they had SOLD at the end of the tenancy. The deduction was refused as it was not a loss to the LL, he had sold the property AT the price acceptable to him, he had not incurred any cost/expense as a result of the tenant's actions etc.

I had 2 landlords take possession of their properties before check out and my instructions were to merely take photos of each room only to prove attendance, but not to look at ANY condition at all as there was absolutely NO point whatsoever as it would never hold up. One of the tenants had done a superb job of cleaning etc, but hadn't been there for long, the other had been a lot harder on the house and hadn't cleaned it at all, so potentially some deductions could realistically have been achieved. Neither one was a viable check out and full deposit was returned to both - even though the 2nd one really didn't deserve it tbh.

Refuse the deductions - all of them - and tell them to take it to dispute to get their take on it. They won't get a thing.

As I say IF you are daft want to make a contribution for a skirting board/wall that would have to be sanded down and repainted anyway, go for it...

Well done op. And for what it's worth I would probably pay for the cat pissed wall too.