Paintwork when leaving a rental + some other issues

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We're about to leave our rental property after 2.5 years as the landlords are selling.

The walls in every room were magnolia when we moved in. We don't know how recently they were painted.

We'd like to maximise our chances of getting our deposit back as our landlords are arrogant, rude and unfeeling bastards (long story, nothing to do with their right to sell) and we don't want to give them any leverage, but at the same time we don't want to do more than we should because our landlords are arrogant, rude and unfeeling bastards. I swear to you this is a genuine decent tenant/accidental and power 'n' money hungry landlord situation.

We have four young DC and one in particular is rather destructive (we're about to get him assessed for SN) despite our very best efforts as we are very anal about damage ourselves. So in a few places the wall has been drawn on and even with magic eraser/regular eraser depending on the medium we can't get it off. Plus, well, the paintwork is a bit grubby in places.

I know nothing about paint so please forgive me if these are silly questions! I am also not very neat at it from past experience.

1. Will we need all the walls of a room repainted even if the damage is restricted to one small part? Or just that wall? Or just the patch? Can you match paint especially if it's faded and old (or not, we don't know!) Won't it look odd with a patch? Argh.

1. There's also a few dings in the wall we presumably need to fill in (what with?) and repaint?

1. If we sugarsoaped the walls where it's mucky (fingerprints etc) is that okay instead of a repaint? It looks okay to me when we've done it before.

1. What about little chips off paint on the skirting boards? Would that be wear and tear or should we patch that too?

1. DS has torn off a few bits of wallpaper, but after I posted on Chat it seems said wallpaper is most likely at least 30 years old. He wouldn't have been able to tear it had the glue not been failing I suspect. So we're going to fight that one at least as I'm sure they're going to try and charge us for redoing it all which would totally be betterment in my book after that amount of time. Might not have objected so much had they been reasonable with us over everything else. Do we have a leg to stand on over this?

1. If we repaint it ourselves, as mentioned I am NOT very good at it (nor is DH) and it will most likely be a bit messy. If it's not as good as it was before, are we going to get charged even more than if we'd just left it? There's no way we want to pay a professional to get it done, we're broke enough as it is.

Thanks!!

PS - out of interest, when we moved in there were some flowers in planters out the front of the house. It gets the sun badly and unsurprisingly they died after we went away for a few weeks and couldn't water them. Do you reckon we're supposed to plant fresh ones before we go? Seems kind of pointless if new people are buying the place but the landlords strike me as the sort to be ruthless.

PPS - if there's a small (inch square) mark in the carpet we can't get out even with professional carpet cleaners, are we liable for the whole sodding thing?

Torn wallpaper (whatever it's age), children writing or drawing on walls and bad dents to walls are not wear and tear.

But before going into that, first of all, is your deposit properly, legally protected in a deposit scheme? Do you have an inventory from when you moved in? Does your tenancy agreement state you are responsible for maintaining the garden?

Im a landlord and I think I expect high standards (from me too!). But I think most of what you are describing is wear and tear - with 4 kids and 2.5 years in a house, grubby, chipped, marked walls are a certainty. Infact with 4 kids I would have factored in higher wear and tear when choosing you above another tenant. The carpet would also be OK I think, but if it isnt then no, you dont pay all of the replacement cost.

I would maybe expect there to be flowers in the planters though - can you dig up some plants from elsewhere in the garden or from friends - our garden is full of primroses at the moment, even where they shouldnt be! (or steal some from the woods!!)

Thanks both :-)

wowfudge - We know they won't think it's fair wear and tear (even though renting a four bed house in a very family area you're pretty much guaranteed to get children) which is why we're intending to fix what we can. We can't fix the wallpaper because it hasn't been sold for 30 years, probably. Short of rewallpapering a massive area in a different style which again we could be penalised for. So we're going to have to leave it and see what happens.

Yes, our deposit is protected. They hired a firm for the inventory and they were insanely thorough, which is another reason we're worried - every tiny mark on the walls was photographed and I can only assume they'll be as thorough at check-out. There are literally hundreds of photos of the place. We're basically not going to be able to get away with anything - not that we were intending to, but we'll probably end up doing up things we needn't because we can't remember if we did or not (we don't have the photos)

We are indeed responsible for maintaining the garden, which we've kept in a reasonable and tidy condition aside from those planters. Probably should have moved them into shade but just wasn't thinking. Hindsight and all that. It's been rather a frustrating garden actually because if it had been ours we'd have ditched the flowerbeds full of extremely sharp and pointy bushes that hurt the children that we've been having to maintain out the back in favour of more lawn space. I hate renting and so glad we're buying again now!

Sunnyshores - That's how I'd think too if I were a landlord. Obviously the writing on the wall isn't great which is why we intend to fix it, we're just not quite sure how.

How will they most likely work out the carpet damage cost? If the carpets were new (not sure on this, they might be) and expected to last a long time as we were repeatedly told by zealous inventory lady, does that mean we might end up paying close to the replacement cost? Or is it worked out some other way as the damage is such a tiny tiny proportion? We're a shoes-off household and food is only eaten where our massive rug has been put down in the dining room but accidents happen I guess.

It's not an issue popping plants in the planters, that's what Homebase is for. Just needed to know if it was expected as no point doing it if not!

Marks on walls such as slight scuffs = wear and tear. Drawing on walls even when there are children in the house is not classed as wear and tear.

OP I would advise you to try to clean the walls - different methods work to remove different things. So toothpaste and an old toothbrush can be used to scrub crayon off as does WD40 on lots of different surfaces.

If your tenancy agreement states you need to have the carpets cleaned and the house professionally cleaned then I would do. The basic principle is to leave the house as you found it apart from normal wear and tear for the time you have lived there.

If you can't clean the marks off then stain blocker and paint over would be the thing to do - but unless you have the exact paint you'll have to do more than just paint the affected patch.

X post with you OP. Have a look on the deposit scheme's website - there should be information on what can reasonably be deducted from deposits. Shelter is good source of info too.

A landlord cannot recover the cost of a brand new carpet from a deposit if there's a small mark on a carpet that was already a few years old when you moved in, for example.

If it's a professional inventory firm then they should know the rules and do a good job - they will lose their reputation if they overstate deductions from deposits because the law is largely on the tenant's side when it comes to getting your money back - you raise a dispute if you don't agree with what is proposed and they will need to prove the damage and the costs. The thorough checks before your tenancy started are as much for your protection as the LL's really.

I was a landlord btw - communication is the key on these things. You need to weigh up how much your deposit is versus what it will take you in terms of time, money and effort to sort the issues out.

www.amazon.co.uk/10-Magic-Eraser-Sponges-Chemical/dp/B003QITQC6

These are great for getting stuff off paintwork. Use them slightly damp and go gently. I got loads in Poundland a while back. They're amazing.

the professional inventory works in your favour. Whatever you think of the landlords, they are bound by the law and you have all the evidence that they are fulfilling their obligations.

the deposit protection scheme was put in to protect tenants and is (correctly) biased towards them. Even with the non-wear-and-tear stuff, the landlord gets back only a proportion of the value of the item. So (for example) a carpet stain is calculated according to the area covered and the value of the carpet, which is affected by its age. What this means is that unless the carpet was brand new and the damage covers a large area, the landlord gets about £20 back. For the wall scrawls and damaged paper, any compensation will be of the same trivial amount.

don't repaint, don't repaper. If you can get the scribbles off, great. Dead plants - stick in a few flower plugs but it is not reasonable to expect the same flowers back again. If you've kept the garden vaguely trimmed and the lawn mowed you are fine. The spiky plants were presumably there when you decided to take the place.

clean it thoroughly, remove all your stuff, job done.

Who is going to do the painting in your new house. Just wondering.

wowfudge - We're going to do our very best with the walls. We've done a decent job in the past for inspections etc which is why we know some stuff doesn't come off! Yawny - we've tried magic erasers and they really are great and do get most of it gone, but there's a few bits that just don't shift. WD40 is not one I'd heard of - have to try that! And yes, we were going to get in professional cleaners (we already have cleaners) and get the carpet done properly. Like I said, we're decent tenants aside from the destructive DS.

That's reassuring that the inventory firm will be fair. That's all we're interested in - fair. And I agree entirely with the whole "worth our time" thing. Time is one thing we are in short supply of especially with four DC including an almost toddler who can't be left alone for a millisecond. We're happy to lose a fair amount to remedy damage that isn't wear and tear.

Fingeronthebutton - Probably nobody to begin with as the new house is in a really decent condition! Later on if we decide to change things we'll have a lot more cashflow (our move was forced earlier than we would have wanted by the landlords selling so we're scraping together every last penny for the deposit+stamp duty+fees etc) so we'll get in professionals then.

specialsubject - That's all really helpful, thank you. Definitely no damage to a large area and I'm still hopeful a professional can get it out, although I had no luck removing it with my Mr Bissell Green Machine or whatever it is! It is good to know it is based on size, not the whole carpet as the whole carpet is MASSIVE (covers a living and dining area)

Yep, the spiky plants were there when we moved in. We got in a gardener last year to tidy it all up a bit (I had been pregnant with SPD and crutches, then a newborn so had done nothing and DH and gardening, well, just no) and even she said she had never seen such a spiky garden in her life!

One of the great thing about protected deposits is that the scheme will only release the deposit back to the tenant when all the deductions have been agreed between the tenant and landlord. This means it can take longer for you to get the money back, but your landlord can't just take money out of it.

If your landlord is angling for more money than you want to agree to, just take it to dispute resolution through the deposit scheme. This will mean an independent party looks at the inventory and check-out report to assess what damage you're liable for, and then works out how much you should pay towards it. This is based on the age of items, as a pp has said. So you'd be charged less for damage to a 20yo carpet than you would for the exact same damage to a 2yo carpet.

A lot of landlords either don't understand these rules or hope that you don't, so may try to just tell you that you have to let deduct a certain amount out of the deposit and there's nothing you can do about it. That's nonsense. If they try it on, hold your nerve and tell them you're taking it to dispute resolution.

exactly. just a matter of being informed about your rights, as all tenants (and landlords) should be.

it's all on the gov.uk site.

Thanks! Yes, I am so grateful for the deposit protection scheme. I have lost so many deposits over the years completely and utterly unfairly especially when I was a student when they know you don't have the money or the experience to fight back. I got my full deposit back at the last two places I rented even though I left them in the same condition I did all the others (as I found them if not better) - difference being I was older and wiser so they knew not to bother.

All that matters to me is that it's fair - I don't want to get one over on them at all, but I don't want them to get one over on me either but it seems that can't happen so long as I know what I'm doing with the scheme. I don't mind waiting longer to get more back - we're already losing a large chunk of it on professional cleaning and gardening we don't now have time to do much of it ourselves and pack/declutter due to being booted out so sharpish. So we want to recoup at least some of those costs if we can.

I suspect they will try it on as they have with a few other things already, but we'll just go straight to the scheme if so.

booted out sharpish?????

even if you were on a rolling tenancy, you were entitled to two months' notice expiring on a rental payment day. Otherwise your tenancy will run to its expiry, AND you would still have had two months notice before that date.

if a fixed term tenancy ends, the landlord still has to issue notice. The tenants can leave the day it ends with no notice (although in practice it is a very good idea to give it).

and yes, the scenarios you mention is what the DPS stops.

I'd be tempted to go and buy a massive tub of trade magnolia and just repaint it all. It's really cheap and at least that's one thing you don't have to worry about. Painting walls isn't a big job really.

please DON'T! You don't need to do that and (with respect) unless you are very good at decorating you could actually end up in an argument for causing damage.

I had tenants do painting (with full permission). I let them do it because the previous lot had done it and done it well. Let's just say that I won't let tenants paint again. If the place needs decorating, I will do it or get it done.

It's two months notice of course, but that's still not much time to prepare. Would have been fine pre-children but not now! We have a lot of stuff (with four DC we always held onto stuff until we knew we were done, which we are now) and we were gradually decluttering. Now every weekend and some evenings are spent doing it with not much time for much else! If we'd left under our own timescale, we were intending to move early next year and have a 10% rather than 5% deposit, and we would have had plenty of time. Sure, we can move with the clutter but we'd rather not! Got rid of 8 sacks of clothes to charity only yesterday

Don't worry, I won't attempt decorating at all I think. We did "magnolia" our bedroom in the last house we owned before selling as the walls were a patchy/faded bright red and made it look dingy. Not a very big room but it still somehow took two days (to be fair we were two hours each way distant and had to keep the DC occupied too) as it needed two coats, and it was not the neatest. Frankly we'd far rather pay what the DPS deems fair. We'll clean the walls, use magic eraser and then hope for the best.

that sounds entirely reasonable. You've got enough to do without painting (which is NOT a quick job if done properly) and there's no need anyway.

look on it as an opportunity to lighten the load. To be fair, it takes a house move to make most of us do a proper declutter.

Every time we move we do a massive declutter but more sneaks back!! This time is probably worse as we have a much bigger property than before so we've filled it up, as you do. We're intending on staying at least 10 years if not a lot longer in the new place, which has 50% more liveable floor space, so I dread to think what that move will be like

We're making Barnardos very happy anyway! Haven't got time to sell much except a few big things, so they're getting some seriously decent stuff mixed in with the usual!