Indemnity for lack of building regs cert?

[Mitzimaybe]

I am selling my house; the kitchen extension was done in the late 70s / early 80s, long before I bought the house. The buyer's solicitor asked for a building regulations certificate; I wasn't given one when I bought the house. Now they have asked that I provide them with an indemnity policy which will cost me £145 (possibly +VAT but I'm not sure about that.)

Is this normal? Do I have to do it or can I tell them to go whistle? Not in so many words - basically, my feeling is that if the buyer wants an indemnity policy, they are perfectly at liberty to

My concern is that, if I agree to this, it could be the thin end of the wedge - they will then ask for indemnity policies for all the other things done by the previous owners e.g. knocking down a wall to make a through lounge, replacing the roof, the dropped kerb etc. - all done about 30 years or more ago, and none of which have any guarantees or building regs documentation. If there were any problems, surely they would have arisen in 30 years or more?

Our mortgage company asked for one of these on the house we were buying, our sellers refused to pay it and we ended up splitting the cost. Seemed the fairest way to keep the sale moving. Maybe you could offer to go halfs?

Call your local council and ask if building regs were required at the time the conversion was done - if they weren't, then how would you have a certificate?

I've been in exactly the same situation and done this... there was no certificate because there were no regs required! My buyer was happy with this and we proceeded with no indemnity. If they aren't happy to proceed then I would go halves as Jane suggests - it's not a huge amount when your're talking about houses sales.

We got one off our sellers - ours was potentially more serious though in that there's a shared archway with next door over a passageway. Of course when we sell we'll probably have to pay for the same thing for our buyers.
Personally I'd pay it, its not a lot compared to the cost of the house and the hold up. If you get another buyer their solicitor might well notice the same thing.

Your buyer's solicitor will look at the local authority search to find out what planning permissions, building regulations and completion certificates were issued for all of the alterations done in your house (assuming your buyers had searches done). If certificates were issued, you would be expected to provide them or pay for indemnity insurance. Some duplicate certificates (i.e. FENSA) can be obtained for a fee of around £10 but it would be you who would be expected to provide (and pay) for this. If no certificates were issued then obviously nothing would show up on the local authority search and then you could quite rightly state that considering the time lapse you won't be providing an indemnity policy. Your solicitor won't know whether or not you hold certificates so when the buyer's solicitor asks for them your solicitor quite rightly will enquire whether you have them and respond accordingly. Lots of people choose to buy a home without doing searches, but that is at their own risk.

You can look at the planning website of your local council to find out whether certificates were issued yourself. At least you will know whether there are missing certificates or if you can't find anything, it's likely none were issued.

Just to clarify Poltergoose, it should be the seller's cost. The house is defective and will affect the seller's ability to sell without correct paperwork. Some buyers are happy to bear the cost (since they will be living in the property), but who wants to pay for an indemnity insurance if the purchase ultimately falls through?

Polter - you can call the council and ask a question hypothetically.

Absence of building regs consent is not enforceable once a year has expired, unless the works render the building unsafe. Presumably if it was unsafe the surveyor would have pointed that out.
However, many lenders will not take a view on this, and insist on an indemnity policy. I'd offer to go halves as a gesture of goodwill.

Thank you everyone for responding.

janesaysl If their mortgage company makes it a condition then I might consider that, but AFAIK they haven't done.

Bovril It's good to know that your sale went ahead without one. I don't know exactly when the extension was done, I just think (from the decor and style of the kitchen and what I recall the previous owner saying) that it was late 70s or early 80s.

AbbeyRoad I thought the indemnity insurance was a one-off and so your (future) buyers would be covered by the one you already have.

PolterGoose It's always been at the buyer's cost? Interesting.

Spickle I have supplied the certificates (FENSA, ELECSA) for all the work done since I have owned the house and accept that if I had lost them, I would have to pay to replace them, because any work done these days has to have building regs approval or equivalent certification. I just don't think it's reasonable that someone now expects me to pay to insure work done by the previous owner under a different set of legislation / standards. The other side's solicitors asked if I have building regs certificate and, when I said no, that's when they have asked for the indemnity. The purchase will only fall through if the buyer doesn't get their finger out and get on with it.

Delphinium Not enforceable after a year has expired - what does this mean? I think that at least 30 years has expired since the extension was built! If it were unsafe, I think someone (including the buyer's surveyor and indeed my own surveyor when I bought it) might have noticed by now.

Since posting this thread, I've seen that the British Insurance Brokers Association recommends that, in this situation, the buyer should pay because they are the only ones to benefit from it, but they accept that a lot of sellers get forced into it because they're scared of losing the sale.

In my case, two similar houses in my road have gone on sale since mine, and both sold (STC) extremely quickly, for more than I accepted on mine. (Well, I don't know the actual agreed price but I know the asking prices and they wouldn't have been taken off the market so quickly if they didn't achieve somewhere near it.) My estate agent has confirmed that he could find me another buyer immediately if the house were to go back on the market, quite possibly at a higher price. In view of that, I've instructed my solicitor that I won't be paying the indemnity insurance... and now I'm waiting for the response.

Just a thought - if you buy a medieval house, which had an extension built on it 300 years ago, would you require indemnity insurance for that extension? If not, when exactly between 300 years ago and 30 years ago is the cut-off point?

Interesting point on the mediaeval house! I know you are advised to buy some super duper survey on a very old house where they open up walls and such like but in guess there was a point when building regs came in? I bought a Victorian house so as a buyer I knew to expect some issues which I wouldn't probably have accepted on a modern house. I think a lot depends on if it's a buyers or sellers market where you are on who pays. Good luck! House buying / selling is no fun is it?

Totally normal in my experience. Just pay it and move the sale along.

We got one for the house we have just bought, and provided one for the buyers of the house we just sold.

We paid up for our buyers. They were nervous, we were desperate to move. Solicitor said it was totally normal for sellers to pay.

AbbeyRoad You're right, it's no fun at all. I can't understand these people who move house every few years. I hope the one we're buying (if it all goes through) is our "forever house" and my next move will be to the funeral parlour or possibly the old folks' home, although I don't like to think about that.

We've just exchanged today after lots of Buildings Regs issues on the house we are buying so I've done quite a lot of research on this (but am by no means an expert!). I would suggest that your solicitor's first response should be that as the work is pre-November 1982 it is pre-Buildings Regs and they are therefore not applicable in this instance.

Then see what their solicitor's response is. My experience over the last few months is that some solicitors ask standard questions without knowing much about the detail of Buildings Regs (which surprised me as they are supposed to be the experts!). My vendor's solicitor kept spouting a load of incorrect nonsense about Buildings Regs not being due on the en-suite we were insisting on papers for (which were due in our case) until I quoted the relevant sections at them.

That said, if your buyer pushes back on this then for £145 as a seller I'd pay for the indemnity to get the sale moving along.

I would tell them to go whistle, OP.

You can only regularise building work done since 1985 and an indemnity policy for an extension is meaningless.

BadgerFace has it spot on in her first paragraph - I have just experienced the exact same thing as a seller.

My local council confirmed that they only keep records from a certain date as they aren't required to keep them indefinitely. Both solicitors were fine with this, the estate agent on the other hand managed to completely confuse our buyer and nearly jeopardise the sale....

1982 or 1985? Or does it depend on the council?

And you have to have building regs for an en suite? (Not relevant to the house I'm selling but is for the house I'm buying.

BadgerFace, congratulations on your exchange of contracts! You're so nearly there, now.

My understanding that the key date is 11 November 1982. The en-suite in my case was an addition to a loft conversion and a new en-suite in 2010, hence the need for Buildings Regs. An en-suite original to a house (or pre Nov 1982) would not require them.

It is Nov 11, but 1985.

Thank you, everyone, that's all really helpful.

Hello everyone. Sorry to bump an old thread. I was just wondering how it can be proved or established when building work was done?

I am buying a Victorian house and there is an issue of when a chimney breast was removed downstairs. The surveyor was happy that it’s all sound and fine but cannot confirm if any planning was approved.

A lot of the work in the house like knock throughs etc was done in and around 1983 but I cannot confirm when the chimney breast was knocked out as the council have no record of it in there records which are limited in time frame.

As I say it appears all sound. My issue really is whether we face issues in the future when we go to sell and a buyer wants documents around the chimney and I can’t provide them.

Could I just say they must have been done prior to 1985 so there will be no record? How could anyone say any different?

Thanks