Failure to go through with a tenancy - can you sue?

[firstchoice]

Earlier this year I agreed verbally and via a number of emails to take a 6m tenancy on a holiday property. I explained that my marriage was on the rocks so it might be myself and my husband (and our children). Or by then, it might be just me and kids and I would need to claim housing benefit. The landlady asked for references. H being a guarantor was discussed and agreed. references were offered and taken up and H's work details were given.

Fast forward to now. I would be reliant on HB as it turns out. I don't know if it will come through as I jointly own a house with my husband. It seems that you must move in and then claim HB. The claim will take a couple of weeks and I would have to sign the tenancy first. I dont think H will stand guarantor now. I am nervous about this as I would have to move my children's school on the hope 'it would all be okay' and HB would help me pay the rent.

I explained this to the landlady today and she was understandably upset that I might not be able to go ahead with the rental. I said that, without HB I could not. She said that H was guarantor and that we must.

I feel awful. I certainly didn't / don't want to mess her around.
She is really nice.

My Qu is: if I have agreed verbally and via email and supplied the details above, but cannot go through with the rental, can she sue me for breach of contract or anything else?

I am in Scotland, but the tenancy is in England.

Please advise if poss as it is Sat eve and I cant get any advice till Monday and I am really really worried

I have posted this in legal too - hope that's okay to double post - just trying to get some advice (I will delete one if advised not okay).

Please don't flame me for being an idiot. I realise I have been .

I am not an expert, but am an accidental landlord. A tenant of ours threatened to pull out of the tenancy the day before they moved in. As they hadn't signed the formal contract, our managing agents told us that they couldn't be held to the tenancy. So, assuming that's correct, you can't be held to the tenancy.

There are such things as verbal contracts. They don't all have to be written. How would you feel if the landlord said you could no longer have the house and you had nowhere to go? I would be prepared to pay something to the landlord but you may not have to.

Yes, I would feel I should offer something.
I just don't know if I'd HAVE to.
I couldn't offer 6m rent, for example, as I don't have it.

If you've signed the tenancy agreement, my understanding is that it's binding and she'd be entitled to claim from the guarantor (I'm not a lawyer, but my friend is a landlord and she claimed from a guarantor when tenants didn't move in)

The way I'd see it, neither of you could have agreed to your DH being guarantor without his agreement.
If he agreed at the time to be guarantor, then he is the one in breach of contract if he now refuses.
You'd be able to rent the place out, except that the landlady won't accept you without references or a guarantor.
She could, alternatively, request a higher deposit to cover the period until you are supposed to get HB.
As for such contracts, that's what proper contracts and deposits are for. To compensate her if you pull back at the last minute and to ensure you'd get the place.
If she hasn't insisted on a deposit, she'd be just as an "idiot" as you have been, IMO.

I haven't even got a tenancy agreement yet.
She is sending one recorded delivery?

Is it best not to accept that delivery if I am not sure I can fulfill it?

OR accept it, take it to HB and hope all okay so I can pay and fulfill after all.

I haven't paid a deposit.
I haven't signed anything.

If you haven't signed the contract yet or paid the deposit then you can just walk away without any problems.

The law in England is crystal clear - if you haven't signed an actual tenancy and haven't moved in, then nobody can force you to proceed with it or sue you for any losses.

I don't think you've been an idiot at all, and the landlady is being ridiculous saying you "have to" go ahead.

In your shoes, I would be polite enough to inform her in writing that your personal circumstances have changed and you no longer require the tenancy. As soon as she looks at the law, she will realise she doesn't have a leg to stand on.

DH owns rental properties, we've had tenants pull out the day before they were due to move in, and there was nothing we could do as they'd made excuses and delayed actually signing.

Firstly, you haven't signed the tenancy agreement and neither has your guarantor. Without this there is no tenancy - it doesn't matter what you have agreed to date. You have kept the LL informed; if that were me I would continue to market the place because there are no guarantees you'll be in a position to sign. Don't sign anything if you are not comfortable.

Think about this logically: LL knows you would be relying on HB and that potentially your H would be guarantor. You clearly don't have the funds for her to recover so it would be a pointless exercise to sue you as it would cost her money and she'd get nothing apart from vindictive satisfaction from doing so. She's putting pressure on you to sign so she has some confirmation she'll get the rent paid - she needs the money so she is not going to spend money she doesn't have suing you. Hope that makes sense, don't worry.

The landlady is bullying you, refuse to accept delivery of tenancy agreement or if you do sign for it or someone else does just return it . You have no legal requirement to accept the property , do not give her any money either you don't need to.

Thank you, everyone, this seems encouraging.

I DO feel bad as I had hoped we could sell / rent our house out and potentially move as a couple - therefore H wages could have stood guarantor. This was discussed. Also the possibility it might go pear shaped and it might be just me on HB. This was also discussed.
This is what I am facing. Llady is upset at this.

I would like to receive contract and take to benefits office and ask about timescales and benefits to make sure it is all possible. THis is the only way I could proceed with the rental which I would still like to do if I can.

I am just worried that signing for a registered delivery / taking to benefits office to discuss starting a claim might get me further enmeshed legally????

(I need to ask, but I need info from them re amount of benefits before I can actually go ahead and give them the paperwork to start the claim as I have been given different figs on the phone each time I have called?)

You can a verbal contract over anything EXCEPT land. So a verbal contract means nothing in the context of buying/selling/renting houses. You can just walk away without repercussions.

Sorry missed "make" out - "you can make a verbal contract out of anything except land" etc

You are still negotiating and deciding whether you can actually go ahead. You could receive the agreement and send it back with modifications. Just receiving it isn't a contract surely, because it's not a notification.

If the landlady is worried, she should set a deadline or keep the house on the market.
No need to sue you IMO.

Have you even asked your stbx if he will sign as guarantor?

Are you certain H won't act as guarantor short term, what has changed to make you think not ? Will he not have to contribute something towards the dc anyway? Could you find work so you would be less reliant on HB etc and could claim TC. If you dither once you have the contract be prepared for her to have let it elsewhere, do you have a back up plan.

Taking delivery of the contract doesn't matter, and discussing it with the benefits office doesn't matter.

Until you actually sign the contract, the tenancy is not binding on you at all.

cremeeggs has the definition. All you can do is keep the landlady informed. If you can't afford the place, you can't afford it. You can explain what you are trying to do but you are NOT committed as things stand. She is running a business, you have not deliberately messed her about and while she may be upset, 'screaming about it won't help you', as they say in Star Wars. Although maybe best not to put it like that...

In fact until you have both (you and LL) signed the tenancy agreement there is no contract between you. You can each sign different copies of exactly the same contract and exchange them and that would be binding but far better to each have a copy with both her and your signature on it. Taking delivery of a copy that arrives in the mail does not complete the tenancy agreement - even if the LL has already signed it (there should be two copies btw).

thank you for all this info.

I don't think H can / will sign any longer, for various reasons, and I don't think she will accept without, sadly (I can see her point entirely!)

I guess she and I would both be reliant on the benefits situation being as described and not changing, at least for 6m. That doesn't feel very secure to me and I am sure it wont to her.

It is very hard to take on a private rental if you are reliant on benefits, even if you have been a diligent employee and payer of your mortgage in the past.

the reason for that is because many landlords cannot get insurance for HB tenants. Something else that the government could address?

but some can. So I wish you the best of luck.

Thanks specialsubject!

Yes, the Govt could do a lot to help both landlords and tenants wrt better laws and guarantees for both sides.

how kind!

swerving off-piste, but there is so much landlord-hate (and it happens on here) which is the easy option. Yes, there are bad landlords (and they should be dealt with) but there could also be ways to make things easier and cheaper for both sides. There is regulation which should certainly stay, but not for the agents..

I do hope you get sorted out ASAP.

Thanks!

I think precisely because it is so unregulated that landlords are resented / feared and tenants (esp HB ones) not trusted / or can even be despised.

In my case, she is scared I wont follow through, I am scared the benefits wont allow me to, and also that she will want me out again in 6m when she has filled her holiday house over the winter?

Oof. I'll wait for the contract and go see the benefits folk and see whether it is still possible.

the 'out in 6 months' bit can be solved by agreeing a longer lease; IF she was happy to do that.

but sadly all a bit academic.