Vendor wants a higher offer

[stargirl04]

Hi guys,

I am a first-time buyer, with mortgage in place, a big deposit (60% LTV), solicitor organised and can move within weeks, and have put an offer in on a flat in London.

The asking price is offers in excess of 170k (for a one bed flat in grotty neighbourhood but near the station). I offered 175k on the same day I viewed it, which the vendor has been "considering" for the past week, obviously trying to get a higher offer from other viewers. In London properties in good condition and close to good transport links are selling for over the asking price in auction-style situations.

This flat is in fairly good condition but has a horrible kitchen (which I would replace) and virtually no storage space, and the communal areas (stairwell and hallway etc are quite grotty - dirty carpet etc).

Today the estate agent rang me back and said the vendor wants more than I've offered but said he was "unable to give me a figure".

I asked if there were any other offers and was told that there was a cash buyer "who might put an offer in", and that they had had another offer verbally, but that it hadn't been put into writing yet. However, the vendor "likes me" because of the fact I want to "get on with it and not mess about".

I can easily go up another 5k or more, but am concerned that if I pay over the odds I will suffer when it comes to resale value etc.

Anyone got any advice for me please?
Thanks for reading.

just keep looking so you are not pinning your hopes on this particular one. The more you see, the more idea you will get of prices vs. location and condition.

I think you should keep looking. There are so few houses on the market now, people want to get Christmas over and done with. Wait till the new year.

This is actually your "out" and you should grab it with both hands.
Withdraw your offer before you get pulled in to buying a flat you are not really that enthusiastic about.

they're taking the mickey.
Tell them your offer remains on the table until Friday only. In view of the state of the communal parts and therefore the likelihood of a significant managing agent charge for the repair / decoration, you're not minded to spend more on the property but remind him (in writing) that you have mortgage approved and are in a position to exchange within weeks.

I would state that it is my final offer and remind them that I am chain free, want to get on with it without delay and am not likely to piss them about because of wanting to make a quick profit.

Things are very hot in London. Depends how much you want the flat really. BUT your Vendor/ea sounds unscrupulous. A friend of mine offered on a flat in London and got up to exchange when suddenly the vendor wanted another £50k as the market had moved on in the 2 months it had taken to get to that stage! Sounds like your vendor wouldn't have second thoughts about doing the same. I wouldn't go higher simply on principle unless I really loved the place.

nobody needs more than a week to "consider" an offer, so there is a learning for you there - as has already been said, it is always preferable to give a time limit on your offer, to avoid being used as leverage to attract another offer.

its not entirely clear whether there is another real offer on the table or not; you mention another verbal offer, but don't provide any information as to whether the level of this offer was higher than yours or not.

it does rather sound like you are being messed around here, and possibly even being played off against yourself. you also don't sound like you are particularly in love with this property.

my advice would be to brace yourself, and contact the agent to give a date of expiry of your offer - maybe 24 hours from the time of the call. you are in a good position, with a good deposit, able to move quickly, and you have shown yourself to be a serious buyer coming in with an above asking price offer. i would make your offer conditional upon the property being taken off the market.

don't let them mess you around - but understand that your ultimatum may mean walking away from the property, which, while hard to do, may save you a load more hassle down the line.

good luck!

disengage from the emotion of the sales process. they are not behaving badly - just trying to get the best deal for themselves.

which is what you must now do.
you can of course look around. but do you think the next one will be different?

you need to get into dialog mode around the price and always keep the door open for you or them to change their mind

I would tell them a sob story that 175 is as much as you can afford. you would really like the house. can work around them on completion etc.

and ask them will they accept it?

...when they come back and say ...its not quite enough.... tell them you really like the house so will ask your {widowed mother} but what price do they want?

..see if they mention a price....

tell them you can only borrow Xk - say 3k - from your {widowed mother}.

which means 8k more than the asking price.

and ask them will they accept it?

if they say no I would offer 2 k {from your great aunt} and say you really cannot borrow any more from aging relatives so you love the house but will need to pass on it if the vendor wants more than 10k over the asking price.

of course you can always borrow from your {brother} or anyone else that springs to mind.

having a dialog will help you get a sense of what they want/what else is really going on. so keep the door open and keep talking until you are convinced they wont accept a price you are happy with.

even after you walk away you can always go back and reoffer a price they have rejected (if the house has not sold).

the worse they can do is turn you down. the best outcome is you get a good price.

No, the worst they can do is accept an offer, let you pay for surveys, solicitors fees and give notice, and then pull out on exchange day. Which happened to my friends TWICE. We also had the 'give us ten grand more or we pull out' on exchange day, and we had to pay up because we'd spent so much and had to be out of our old place asap. London prices meant we didn't lose out in the end, but we did have to borrow the money from the in laws and were then beholden to them for the next two years until we could remortgage. Was NO fun.

Personally, disliking being yanked around, I would withdraw the offer and look for a different flat. Where are you looking in London, I enjoy a rightmove hunt...

which is why you make sure when you agree the price everyone knows you 'have no money left whatsoever' and if the price goes up you will unfortunately have to walk away.

they will only up the price if they think you have more money.

but also buy from someone who is also incurring costs and needs to move/wants an easy life. we bought from someone very old.

e.g. I would not buy from a LL selling up as they are likely to want to squeeze money from you.

stargirl, I agree with those counselling you to think a bit harder about whether you want this property.

1. I would be very wary about a flat with grotty communals. It is a sign of dysfunctional arrangements between the leaseholders. IME, this is much more likely to affect the money you make off resale than the 5k extra they're asking for. At the least, I'd want to understand:

• what are the arrangements for maintenance of communal areas
• when will the communal areas next be updated

before committing to a sale

2. Area really matters in London. You want to feel safe walking to the station. Your money is safer in a nicer area, although you have less chance of benefiting from a Hoxton-style rapid increase in property values

3. As others have said, there will be lots and lots of new stuff in January, and you can easily be moved by Easter. I would not be panicked into taking this place.

4. Incidentally, it's fairly unusual to have such a huge deposit for a first-time flat. Is there any chance you could push higher eg to 200 and then find something quite a bit nicer?

Our flat was in Haggerston smug Although I got mugged twice and we were burgled twice before it got 'naice'.

Oooo, I lived in Haggerston 1988 - 1994, before it got posh. Used to love swimming at Haggerston pool.

I agree about being upfront about your true maximum. Also because, if you hold back then find a bit extra later, it might be too late. That could be really annoying all round, if the vendor would rather have sold to you but has accepted a higher offer in the meantime (yes, I'm thinking of you, 'buyer one').

Don't assume these offers aren't real. They may be tactics but they may be real. I'm not at all surprised the vendor wants to flaunt your offer in front of other viewers to try to get the best price they can, for a week or so. If they want to sell quickly, they won't risk it for much longer than that but, if they an afford to hang on, they might just see your offer as a benchmark, to be beaten later.

So, do accept you could lose the flat, probably just at the point you've realised it is good value, prices are going up and you're going to end up paying £20k more for something worse.

Knowledge is power.

Agree with other comments about withdrawing. You need focus and strategy. Are you certain you want to be in London? You could get something nice to come home to hAlf an hour out of euston

Hi guys, all your comments gave me much food for thought, and made me question whether this flat would be a good buy, given the grubby communal areas and the fact it is already in a not-so-good neighbourhood. (Iffy neighbourhood bothers me a lot less than the grubby communal area issue).

In addition, what some of you said about the fact there would be a lot more property coming on to the market in the new year made me think twice.

I can afford to go up to 220k if there are no service charges, and if there are service charges of, say £1k to £1.7k a year, I can still go up to about £200k anyway. This flat was well below the top end of my budget.

So when the estate agent called me I told him I'd made a decision and that I was withdrawing my offer while I reconsidered my options.

He seemed fine with it and said that my offer fell "just shy" of the "other offer", and he asked me to confirm my withdrawal in writing.

So the deed is done! However, am now feeling a bit panicky about the fact I am still without a flat, prices are surging in London and there is nothing of interest to me that's come on to the market today. (I want big rooms, which this flat has, and to live away from busy roads).

So the search goes on... sigh! Here is the flat:

www.rightmove.co.uk/property-for-sale/property-44119985.html

Must you be in Sydenham? How about going towards Bromley?

this looks nice near catford

Hi Quintessential, no I don't need to be in Sydenham. I will really live anywhere within easy reach of transport links. I will also consider further afield: Welling, Bexleyheath and Bromley.

The flat you've posted details on is indeed very nice, although the lounge is a bit smaller than I'd prefer.

Greenfolder, do you have any suggestions for nice places half an hour from Euston? Thanks.

2 bedrooms though, and a garden......

Genuine question because some people genuinely want to live in london. Put leighton buzzard into rightmove with 180k. You will see the difference in what you get. Many within 10 mins walk of station and euston genuinely is half an hour away. Just to give you food for thought.

that's a nice flat for the money, Quint! was it on rightmove? near the station too. Personally I wouldn't want a ground floor though, with flats above - you just never know whether the neighbours are noisy, then you are stuck with it.
Same search as the OP i my case with somewhat bigger budget - ANYWHERE where it's near a station and the place itself is nice internally. I'd be happy to look out of london too but quick commute.
Rushing off to look at Leighton Buzzard, greenfolder! is it a reasonably safe area/town?

This search may help

Good luck!

I feel for you OP. I seem to remember your thread about Welling. Decisions are not easy when you can move anywhere and your budget is variable. No wise word of advice, but I had the situation of “another cash offer” many times and all of the times it turned out to be genuine, otherwise I won’t be still looking for a house – this is London and South East for you!!! You are lucky if the property has not sold even before going on Rightmove. It must be much different in the rest of UK.

A couple of times I regretted massively that I didn’t offer over the odds. So it really depends on how badly you want the flat.

I have a friend who had a very limited budget of 120k in London (this was 3 years ago), but she needed 2 bedroom property. I thought she was never going to get it for that price, but she put up the whole London in her search and finally ended up buying a flat in Woolwich. She is happy enough there (not that I recommend Woolwich).

You're offering 5K over the asking price, you're (by the sounds of it) the only person with an offer on the table, you're not in a chain and can move fast...you've got a lot going for you as a buyer and it does indeed sound like they're messing about.

As others have said, give them till Friday to decide and then I would withdraw your offer. Good luck!

Get the train line from Euston and look at areas outside London, you may get a two bed house no gritty communal areas, service charges, a freehold all your and the banks.