Would you buy in Welling, Kent?

[stargirl04]

Hi chaps,

I don't know Welling but it's more affordable than London, where I work and live (renting). Am trying to buy now before prices rocket further here.

I looked at this place yesterday:
www.rightmove.co.uk/property-for-sale/property-43207019.html

What do you think? This was before a mortgage adviser told me I can borrow more for longer, upping my budget considerably (190k ish, maybe more).

The vendor, a retired Irish lady, has lived there ten years, says it's really safe, never feels threatened there. And there is no service charge, which is highly unusual for the London area. I could live there very cheaply and not worry about paying the mortgage - my earnings fluctuate as I'm self employed.

On the other hand, when I went to view another flat in SE18: www.rightmove.co.uk/property-for-sale/property-41787344.html

.... the estate agent told me there is greater price growth in London postcodes because you could "guarantee the property is going to go up in price".

The second flat has service charges of 2000k a year!! And the room layout was such that it would be a close call trying to fit a 3-seat sofa in instead of a 2-seater.

I really liked the Welling place, but am worried I might be buying something that won't make much money in the long run. ie, a bad investment.

Would really appreciate some advice. Thanks guys.

Stargirl your area of searching has shifted a lot since you started thi thread! Have you set your preferences straight? The problems with your viewed flats are obvious and that would be a no-no to me (no parking, busy road etc.).

I am convinced that there are lots of options for 1 bed flat for your budget, you could even get 2 bed if you wanted to.

A random search in the area that I know of brought this: here

Thanks little crystal. Yes, my area of searching is wide - that's because I really don't mind where I live as long as it's within a reasonable commuting distance to work.

The flat you've shown is nice and good value, esp. as it has its own garden. I would have thought that area is a bit rough though, although you may know better than me. I love the section of garden that comes with the flat!

I guess the parking issue is a lesson learnt. And the busy roads. Do you just look at the location map and see whether it's an A road before deciding it's an option?

What about B roads - are they just as bad?

Thanks,
stargirl

stargirl The parking would put me right off. I went to visit a friend living in one of those streets off of Westwood the other year and it's like a fucking slalom course with cars parked on both sides of the road. Even on Westwood the buses are weaving in and out of parked cars. If you were a bicycle girl I'd say go for it - but if you've got a car then maybe it's not the best place.

Anerley is OK (and it is certainly quite pleasant and quiet) as it is very near Crystal Palace which has become super expensive.

Is there any SE postcode remaining that is NOT on the up and coming list?? I loathe Catford everytime when I pass it, it seems grim and polluted not to mention never ending traffic, but even so it seems to be becoming "on the up". I live in another "on the up" area, i.e. South Norwood, ok, not excellent though, but the properties sell as hot potatoes with increasing prices and I do notice more professionals moving in the area.

I think you need to check for yourself what road is busy or not. Sometimes the houses can be set back from the main road and have proper parking so that would not be an issue.

To be honest, if it were me given your current budget I would look at either:
continuing to rent, purchase a long term investment (for retirement) outsite the city and rent it out in the interim
or expand your commute zone right out especially since you commute by motorbike (unless it's a vespa .
Look at the new government scheme and establish if I could afford to borrow more.
Look at buying a wreck that needs work over the next few years so that I could get some equity out of it when I wanted to leave the city.

You can afford to rent somewhere far nicer than you can purchase. If you didn't go mad on rent and lifestyle, would it allow you to supplement the rent on a buy to let elsewhere?

Op, so the area is expanding now !
I think you can find something in Palmers Green which is near Bounds Green but I think livlier (was on location, location last yr) - I saw a few places and curious what the commute is like from there?
But you don't have a car as I understand, and wouldn't it be enough parking for a bike in Welling? I still like that flat.
Anerley flat that a poster linked is by the rail line so it 's probably noisy. I think Anerley is quite rough in the day when commuters aer away and I personally have seen a druggie walking about whic is intimidating when it's just you and him on the road. But it's fine on weekends and evenings if not that late. It'a hike uphill to Vrystal P amentities though - and I'm not mad personally about CP. NOt great for your biking to work, I'd think.

Hi Beagles, I was up in Palmers Green a few weeks ago and thought it a bit ropey; didn't even like leaving my bike parked in the street during the day. Or maybe I was just in a bad part of it.

I still like the Welling flat too and it would cost me very little because of my deposit and the fact there are no service charges! The commute would be easy - it is only the parking situation putting me off as the noise from the busy road would not keep me awake at night because the lounge is facing the road, whereas the bedroom is at the rear of the property and overlooks the back garden; it was much quieter. It's a matter of whether I could get used to the noise when in the lounge.

It had a big loft too, as you'd said it would. I will PM you.

Hi Oscar. I have had loads of problems with rented accommodation in London so would not buy a long term investment (for retirement) outside the city to rent out in the interim, although I appreciate it's a good idea otherwise. I really want something to live in, and sooner rather than later.

Expanding my commute zone is a possibility although I will probably buy a car if I do that as I am too scared on my little 125 motorbike on those fast, busy roads!

I don't want to borrow more via a government scheme because I don't want to put pressure on myself with a bigger mortgage repayment every month; I want to be able to afford it so that I'm not worrying about interest rates going up etc; also my work fluctuates because it is seasonal - very busy in the summer and less so during winter, when my hours and wages drop accordingly. Plus I am single so no partner to share costs with.

As for buying a wreck, that makes sense but I know nothing whatsoever about DIY and would have to pay builders to do it up for me as I really haven't a clue.

I disagree that I can afford to rent something nicer than I can purchase. In London you're looking at £800 per month for a teeny, tiny flat in Penge/Anerley before bills and council tax. Whereas if I buy this flat I've seen in North London it would cost me about £675pm before bills. If I buy the Welling flat it will cost me only £380pm before bills!

I appreciate your very good advice Oscar, and will bear your suggestions in mind anyway. Do you think buying in Bounds Green ten mins from the tube station would be a good investment?

Would parking issues such as those outlined at the Welling flat affect the resale potential? I guess it would, wouldn't it?

Re the Welling flat. It is v close to the station so the price should reflect the lack of parking. You can always negotiate on that basis.

The flat is leasehold, so you can't convert the attic unless you have rights to within your lease documentation. A friend assumed this and the leaseholder (living downstairs) tried to charge her £20k to convert the huge loft to which only she had access, so I wouldn't assume anything except storage options and check who has to repair the roof too.
If you are interested, you can always approach the leaseholder about parking rights. You might have to pay to have the driveway exit widened so your bike can get out if there is a car in the driveway but for a small fee on the lease, it might be feasible if they like you. Regardless of parking, if you want to put down some sort of security bolt to attach the bike to (which would be necessary in Welling I should think) you will definitely need to reach agreement with the leaseholder. Check that you can take the bike into the garden without objections from anyone.
Check if downstairs is owner occupied or rented. Sound rises.

It's a nice flat and on the basis of your numbers above, seems like a no brainer. I would get myself to Welling and see how comfortable I am walking the short walk to and from the station in the evenings now that they are gettign darker.

Sorry - no idea where Bounds Green is.

Thanks so much Oscar. Bearing in mind the "guide" price (whatever that is) is 155k, how much do you think I should offer at to begin with?

I wasn't going to convert the loft - just wanted the storage!

Downstairs flat is owned by a female senior citizen (not elderly as such, but over 60, I imagine). I think the local church owns the freehold.

I just spoke to the estate agent - don't laugh too loud folks as I am new to all this - who told me that there is a second viewing on the Welling flat tomorrow and five other viewings booked this week, with another one tonight, and that "it's only Tuesday and the property is getting a lot of interest". Is this just estate agent spiel?

It might be getting a lot of interest but practicalities like parking may be putting people off. It doesn't state on the particulars that there is no parking.

Make a cheeky offer - they can only say no. It won't stop them from considering another one. Make it an odd number too, it throws off the estate agent as it a) indicates a specific reason or limit, and b) they have to do the mental math to calculate the % they would get as a result evil
If you are offering - make it subject to survey and view of the lease**, obviously and also ensure that the agent points out that you are chain free, have mortgage approval in principle and solicitor etc lined up. You can sort that stuff quickly anyway and it sounds good.
** how long is left on the lease? I don't think you'll get a mortgage if it is less than 75 yrs or so.
Re the actual number - offer too little and you won't look serious at all, too much and you will kick yourself if they accept straight off.
Full houses on the street seem to be about the £250k, I'd offer £137,750 to see what they say, and if that's immediately rejected you can ask what they are prepared to accept and make noises about no parking and any other fault you can dream up.
You could also say that you are interested in another property [in Bounds Green] but that this is your first preference; that you need to be out of your current flat by Jan 1st and you want to make a decision this week (assuming you want to and you really want the flat - not very nice to do a lot of grandstanding if you are really still not sure and will pull out as soon as a better flat comes along)

Thanks Oscar, really appreciate this. However, I would not have dared come up with a figure of less than 140k! In fact, I was wondering if I had the cheek to offer 145k. You can tell I'm inexperienced and rubbish at this!

What concerns me is that I'll offer too low and they will just sell it to someone who offers a higher sum without bothering to get back to me to see if I want to up the offer (which happened to a friend of mine).

In all honesty I doubt they would take less than 145k at this stage because of the "great deal of interest" in it, as the estatie puts it. If they were to refuse such an offer, then, and in turn you ask what they are willing to accept, aren't they just going to say "the asking price"?

Other faults I can dream up are the noise from the busy road, the kitchen is quite small and needs updating (as the vendor said herself).

I am encouraged though and may put a cheeky-ish offer in.

Unless you are trying to buy a house in an area where people are fighting over the property (school catchment areas etc) then you can afford to be a bit cheeky. They will expect everyone to come back to them with £149k for openers.
If other flats on the road have sold recently for £155k or more then you will look unrealistic offering £137k and as you say, if someone offers them the full asking price on the basis that no further viewings take place you will have lost out. It depends what it is worth to you and how much you want the flat. You need to research what you feel is a fair offer price and also whether feeling like you offered slightly too much to start with will irritate you later or whether you will feel it was worth it to move things along and be in your own place by Christmas, saving X on rent etc etc.
If the owner wants to move out quickly and you are offering £152k with no chain, and she has someone with a chain of 3+ houses, offering £155k then you may find she bites off your hand.
Is she in a hurry to move or happy to sit out the winter in Welling? Most sales will take minimum 2-3 months to conclude.

Ooh, just saw more info on the Welling flat - be careful about church freehold! do you already have a solicitor? when I was buying my flat, she specifically was checking whether the flat isn't in church land ownership (as it's near) as it can cause issues in the future - she didn't specify what issues, but seek advice.

Also as much as I like Welling flat, I couldn't live with noise - constant hum of traffic as you say. As much as oscar says it's a good investment, and I agree, you HAVE to be confortable there. Its really not worth it if you aer miserable. Parking, I agree isn't such an issue - not for resale as close to station, and not for the bike, must bne some options. But the noise - and possibly the air quality too for your dc - I'd think carefully.
For al the 'interest' there aer no offers so far - I'd wait for other flats in Welling and pay more - because you can do - for a side road. At least I wouldn't make an offer untill someone else does - and then think once more.
As far as paying the freeholder for loft conversion - you'd paying not the lady downstairs but the church! Ithink they may not charge as much as 20k - maybe 15, but if you did covert, it would add value for resale more than 20k, it;s just you need their permission and they may not agree.

er, no way they'll accept less than 145K! it's bu the station and a roomy flat in fair condition! the prioce is like this due to the busy road, otherwise would be 155K asking.

sorry, 165KI meant

OP - Welling is 100% safe, and very must established, not like these "up and coming" dumps like Catford, honestly, some people love to slur an area - take a look at the average person to get off the train at Welling station... they tend to be city workers, suited and booted and taking advantage of the fact you can get a huge house with a huge garden for very little but not hanker after an up and coming area that you dont in reality use.

Welling has a lively high street, OK so its a bit of a mish mash but its busy has everything you need, no funky tea shops or bijou bars, a huge Tesco and Morrisons, a massive Park which is beautiful (Danson) with a lovely pub in it and lots going on, fab transport links, you can walk to Bexleyheath one way which is equally as maligned and equally as good value, and you can walk down to Shooters Hill the other way, down to a lovely open farm where you ca buy your jam and pick damsons...

Shooters Hill also got a blasting earlier on and I can confirm that is also a lovely place, not Woolwich, Shooters Hill. None of this you can do in Catford unless you carry a sawn off shot gun and a pepper spray under your coat...