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Original poster

Landlord insurance - any recommendations?

22 replies

sillysillymum · 17/08/2013 11:22

Can anyone recommend any buildings and contents insurance policies for a tenanted property please? We are renting out our much-loved family home and I am looking for a good, belts n braces policy to hopefully give some peace of mind. I'm happy to pay the extra premium to get some cover for malicious damage, accidental damage, theft by tenant, legal cover etc. I keep coming across exclusions and endorsements and I just don't seem to be able to find a policy that gives a good degree of cover. I have spent sooooo long looking through small print and I should be doing fun stuff with the DC instead . Please, can anyone recommend any good policies?

TIA

OP posts:

Crutchlow35 · 17/08/2013 18:48

The first problem you have is that you are still calling the house your much loved family home. You need to completely detach yourself from that. It is a business.

Look at endsleigh. They have malicious damage as standard. Don't touch direct line as they don't cover it at all.

Why do you need contents? Are you leaving it furnished?

Crutchlow35 · 17/08/2013 18:48

Aviva are quite good too.

Crutchlow35 · 17/08/2013 18:49

And I would say lots of insurance companies have malicious damage as an add on to their standard policy which you need to request by telephone.

specialsubject · 17/08/2013 20:28

I would second the idea of detachment - while it is unlikely to get trashed, your tenants are different people from you and will live in different ways. (one of our sets made the place look like a show home with expensive furniture and an army of staff, another lot let the kids scribble on the walls - you never know)

you do need contents insurance unless you are removing all carpets, curtains, white goods etc etc. And I doubt you would be renting a home with no carpets!

this is a business and will take time. Check your agent is a member of some trade association and monitor what they do.

Original poster

sillysillymum · 18/08/2013 07:18

Thanks for the replies.

Yep, detachment is on my list of things to do

I'd looked at Endsleigh but ruled them out for some reason. Will have another look. I'd discounted Direct Line for the reason you said, Crutchlow35. I'll have a look at Aviva, thanks.

The house will be part-furnished and there are some expensive appliances and fixtures and fittings etc so I would be much happier with a policy that gives cover against damage and theft in as many circumstances as possible.

Anyone else happy with their insurance policy and would be kind enough to tell me who they use? I cannot wait to get this sorted!

OP posts:

flow4 · 18/08/2013 07:33

My broker has sorted my landlords insurance for me - with no fee, presumably because they pay him commission. It's a company called Select and Protect, available only through brokers, underwritten by Aviva I believe, and includes 10% contents cover as standard on its buildings insurance.

DawnOfTheDee · 18/08/2013 07:38

I work for a commercial insurer. It's a few years since I did any real property owners stuff but off the top of my head you shouldn't have any problem getting malicious damage/accidental damage added in.

The policies you are looking at may have this as an exclusion solely because it isn't priced in their standard cover, rather it is an add on that you can specifically request. They will then add it in (for a bit of extra premium of course!).

I think where you are going to have trouble is theft by tenant. I can't remember any of the policies I worked with covering this, nor can I actually remember anyone asking for it. Theft tends to be offered on a 'by forcible entry to/exit from the building' basis, which obviously wouldn't apply if it was the tenant nicking stuff! It's similar to shoplifting not being covered under most shop insurance policies. The cost of providing cover would be prohibitively expensive.

DawnOfTheDee · 18/08/2013 07:39

Oh, and I second flow4 - going through an insurance broker will be your best bet. The will have access to schemes and binders where better policies and wordings will be on offer. They can also help guide you to the cover need.

Original poster

sillysillymum · 18/08/2013 09:37

Thanks for that - it didn't even occur to me to use a broker...

I've had a quote from a company called Amlin UK Ltd (anyone used them?) and they offer 'theft by tenant' cover. (I know these things are really unlikely to happen but the cooker alone cost twice the amount of the rental deposit so I would like to be able to claim if the tenants do turn out to be the tenants from hell!) Maybe I should go with them? The only thing is, they have a minimum security requirement which stipulates that the burglar alarm needs to be used at all times that the tenants are out of the house, and also used (on the night-time setting) when the tenants are in bed. We have hardly ever used the alarm as it is a low-crime area (now why did I go and say that...). I don't think we could even try to enforce the use of the alarm, and I wouldn't want to either. It will be their home and they should be able to live as they choose. I certainly wouldn't have wanted to have the burglar alarm on at night when I was up and downstairs with babies/young children etc. It doesn't feel right to choose a policy that makes requirements that I know won't be met, but then the rest of the cover sounds good...

OP posts:

flow4 · 18/08/2013 12:30

There's no point choosing a policy that makes a requirement you know won't be met, because if requirements aren't met your policy is invalid and won't actually pay out!

I'm not a lawyer, but I have a feeling that a 'theft by tenant' policy wouldn't be worth the paper it's written on. For a start, you'd have to prove it was the tenant - and not their friend or associate; and if you could, I bet you the insurance co. wd then expect you to pursue through the criminal and small claims courts before they'd pay out. Plus I bet premiums are so high that they'd pretty much pay for a new oven every couple of years!

DawnOfTheDee · 18/08/2013 12:36

As far as I can remember that security requirement is not the norm on property owners policies simply for the reason you gave - the policyholder (i.e. you) has no control and cannot enforce the condition. I've just checked on my company's policy wording and we don't have the condition on it. However, I'm pretty sure we wouldn't do theft by tenant so I guess it's swings and roundabouts.

I've heard of Amlin though I'm not mega familiar with them or their wordings. If they do theft by tenant for a reasonable price it might be worth a call to discuss the security condition. This is where brokers come in handy - as they know who gives what cover and when it's up for discussion.

Original poster

sillysillymum · 18/08/2013 16:11

That's interesting. I have found it hard to even get quotes for the 'theft by tenant' cover. I don't think I'd have to prove it was the tenant who stole anything, although in the situation I'm thinking of it would be pretty obvious (eg tenant moves out and takes all the appliances, furniture etc). It's more that the insurance companies seem to exclude cover for theft by anyone who is allowed to be in the property. That's how I understand it anyway - that they'll cover you for burglaries but not cases of theft where there wasn't actually a break-in. I hope that makes sense! I'm just trying to get a high level of cover for a little peace of mind. I'd rather pay higher premiums each year knowing that in the worst case scenario I won't have to worry too much about funding the cost of replacements and repairs etc. I'd just have the hassle of sorting it out, and the cost of the excesses too of course. Looks like I'll be getting in touch with some brokers tomorrow then.

OP posts:

flow4 · 18/08/2013 22:10

silly, I think maybe I didn't explain myself well... I understood what you want cover for; but I am suggesting that even if you find a company that claims it will provide it, you need to read the small print v v carefully... I bet that in the situation you describe, where you know your tenant has taken appliances, any insurer will require you to take them to court and try to recover costs direct from them before they pay out, which could prove very time consuming and expensive. I honestly don't think you'll get what you want, and you're better off trying to get some security by asking for a bigger deposit.

holidaysarenice · 18/08/2013 22:37

I use cia or towergate for mine, they are usually cheapest and provide good cover. I don't do contents tho - its completely unfurnished.

holidaysarenice · 18/08/2013 22:50

I would probably advise you to remove sentimental/valuable furniture and get an excellent and detailed inventory with signed photos to provide evidence.

Original poster

sillysillymum · 19/08/2013 11:02

Thanks again for the input everyone :-)

The insurance company who gave me the quote have passed my request (for the security requirement, ie use of alarms, to be waived) to the underwriters. I am praying they will waive that condition as it will be sooo much easier than starting all over with a broker etc.

I've looked through the small print and it says that the theft by tenant cover 'excludes amounts recoverable from the tenants' deposit'. I can't find any further details about what they would deem to be 'recoverable'. 'Recovered' would be less open to interpretation obviously. Maybe they could insist that if we took tenants to court then the amounts would be recoverable? I dunno. I'm loving thinking about all these worst-case scenarios though!

Oh, and yes there will be a very detailed inventory and no sentimental items left in the house.

We asked the letting agent about asking for a larger deposit but she thought that we might struggle to find tenants as other houses in the area just requested a month's rent as deposit. It is the way I'd prefer to go though.

OP posts:

DawnOfTheDee · 19/08/2013 16:02

I think what 'recoverable from the tenant's deposit' means is that they would expect you to replace any lost/stolen items out of your own pocket up to the value of the tenant's deposit. So if the tenants nicked £800 of stuff and the deposit they had given you was £500 then the insurance company would only pay out £300. It's essentially applying probably quite a large excess to the cover.

Fx the underwriters will waive the security requirement though! I'm an underwriter and i'd waive it for sure I'm a nicey though

MaggieW · 19/08/2013 16:22

We use a broker based in Wimbledon - Bedford Insurance or similar. They've always been good at getting competitive rates and good cover. We add legal cover in too and it has proved useful recently in getting an unauthorised subletee, who refused to move out, out of our property after the official tenant had given notice and moved.

Original poster

sillysillymum · 19/08/2013 20:06

I so hope I get a nice underwriter like you then, DawnOfTheDee ?? I cannot face finding a new policy. DC are sooo noisy and I cannot concentrate on all these terms and clauses etc. My head hurts!

Hopefully the insurance company would only deduct the amount of the deposit if I had actually recovered it? That would be fine. It probably seems like a waste of money (it may well be!) but it makes me feel better about the whole thing.

Hmm maybe I need to go for the legal cover add-on too. Getting someone evicted must be a nightmare. I so wasn't cut out to be a landlord ??

OP posts:

DawnOfTheDee · 19/08/2013 20:11

Just think of the amount of the deposit like an excess where the theft by tenant cover is concerned would be my advice.

Legal expenses cover isn't usually too expensive and is very good value for money in a lot of cases (sometimes you get access to a 24hour legal helpline, things like that).

Good luck with everything OP

Mendi · 19/08/2013 20:50

I am also renting out my home for the first time and have arranged landlord cover through a broker. I just googled "landlord insurance", filled out a form and got a call. Quite pleased with what I have as my usual broker quoted over £200 more per year for the same cover, so worth shopping around.

With mine, I have got rent arrears cover and home emergency cover too (the latter as a separate policy) which I think are important. Check whether the policies you are looking at include rent arrears cover.

Original poster

sillysillymum · 21/08/2013 18:02

Just thought I'd update you all -I know you're all desperate to know what happened ??

The underwriter finally responded and they've waived the condition about the tenants having to use the alarm! Thank flip for that. It seems to have taken weeks. So I don't have to think about worst case scenarios and small print tomorrow, hurrah!

Oh and I went for the legal cover too. Thanks for the advice everyone

OP posts:

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