Are we stuck in this in-catchment house?

[caughtincatchment]

I'm very sorry this is so long, and also for namechanging, but everyone knows primary school catchments are such a sensitive area, so I really don't want to risk being outed...

We moved out of London last year, to get better quality of life (air, space, etc.) and schools, and also because we wanted to finally buy: the places we were renting kept being sold (all of them in a row, right back to when DD was a year), and we just couldn't face paying so much to buy so little in that London area.

In the new town, not a lot was moving, property-wise, so we eventually decided to rent again when we moved, so that we wouldn't risk a chain collapsing right before the school aplication deadline, and we got a long lease, so we couldn't be kicked out before school started, either!

Well, DD got into a school nearby, and we are happy with it, and just want her to settle there, as she is a very anxious and awkward child (keeping being moved on hasnt been good for her) and finds it hard to make new friends.

For months we looked for a house to buy and it seems DH's reseacrh about the area (a work colleague lives here) was totally inadequate, because not only was very little coming on the market, it was all crazy asking prices (don't want to say how much, for fear of outing where we are). DH has also found the commute a struggle due to the extra ?leg? from this part of town to the train. So we started looking closer to the centre, where the trains run from.

We've now found a house which is close to commuting links and a real fixer-upper, so much more reasonably priced and better value for money than anything else we have seen. However, it is further from school, and I'm not sure it would make it into the catchment for this school. Yet the owner is pushing to exchange this month/early Aug (long before school starts ? aaagh)! It also needs a lot of work before we can live there (electrics, plumbing, walls, floors ? all very old and possibly dodgy ? we don't have the survey yet), so we do have to buy well before our rental lease runs out (again, probably meaning at the latest, the week before September begins).

Our new borough wants you to be properly resident in the in-catchment place with all the supporting documentation in January before school starts (we were) and when school starts (we will still be living there, but our lease ends three and a half weeks after DD's Reception class starts ? maybe a month after the actual school start of term). Not sure extending the lease would help, either, as we are being pushed to complete/exchange, and there is the period of works to factor in, so the two ? ownership and lease ? would have to run along side one another for a couple of months anyway.

But when we notify the school of our change of address, they'll be able to look back at the Land Registry as early as October (three-month delay in reporting of transactions), and see that the purchase went through (in my worst imaginings) in July. Is that early enough in the school term to withdraw DD's place? It's an academy, so I understand that means it's its own admissions authority.

It doesn't help that I haven't taken to life here, being a SAHM in a place where you need to get in the car to get to most of the parks, which is a pain with a 4yo DD and new baby (who was born here); I haven't made many friends, and nor has my DD (whereas we had a great support network in London). It's hard not to feel carpet-bagger guilt given that I sometimes actually hate this place and wish we'd never moved! DD's not happy, either, but she's been uprooted now, and I can't bear to do that again to her (except to the new house, where she can have a mural on the wall of her bedroom and a wigwam if she wants ).

Sorry for that essay. Is anyone able to give advice on how the school/LA might view the date of our house purchase (especially given that it won't be inhabitable until after school starts, and given that our rental lease doesn't expire till October)? It's one of those hardline boroughs which will withdraw a place not just through fraud (which is right) but also even if it was offered through the LA's error.

We did act in good faith with cutting our ties with London (much as I regret it), but the timing for this house is unexpectedly tight, and a nightmare!

Thanks for getting to the end of this! I've also posted this in Primary Education, but schools are such a big part of property that I've cross-posted here, for the knowledgeable footfall!

I don't know anything about the schools stance and how far they check, but presumably you are meeting all of the criteria. Does it actually say you must stay in catchment for a set time? I'm presuming not as you haven't mentioned. So if they have not made that a rule they can not withdraw a place for breaking it IYSWIM.

WRT when you purchased the house - it isn't relevant. When you move into the house is relevant. Untill that time your address, where you live, pay council tax, are registered with the doctor all that carry on is the rental house.

So it doesn't matter when the LR says you bought the house, only when you declare that as your main residence - council tax etc.

they'll be able to look back at the Land Registry as early as October (three-month delay in reporting of transactions), and see that the purchase went through (in my worst imaginings) in July. Is that early enough in the school term to withdraw DD's place? It's an academy, so I understand that means it's its own admissions authority.

Surely you are paying council tax on the property you are currently in, and have other ways of proving you are at that address - ie registered at DR's, etc.

Like Happy's post I think you will need to look at that schools admissions policy in detail as they vary.

Good luck with your new home!

If it is still really expensive and you don't like it, I'd personally move back to London. Sounds like the reasons for your move are eroding imho.

I think you need to look at the LEAs exact wording. I know Buckinghamshire seems to be funny about this, although how legal some of their stuff is I'm not sure. On the other hand Surrey is more flexible, and anyway as they would have to find her a school place and schools are full, would probably leave her where she is anyway.
You could even phone and talk to the admissions people. Also even though the sellers might be pressurising you, I kind of doubt it will go through.
Finally do try to visit parks etc. over the summer and then visit a few toddler groups in the Autumn. The library is another good place to get to know the local pre-school events.

If the criteria are that you are living at the in-catchment address in the Jan before and the Sep of starting, and you will be doing that, then you will fulfil their criteria and they could not withdraw the place. The fact that you exchanged in July on an out of catchment house is not relevant. The only difficulty is if they don't believe that you were actually still living in the in catchment house in September. Do make sure you can prove this by whatever means you can - utility bills, council tax, letter from landlord etc.

It does feel a bit uncomfortable though that you are committing to a house purchase - and a fixer upper at that so a real commitment of time and energy as well as money - in a location you're not really happy with... Are you sure this is what you want?

Don't underestimate the cost of a doer upper will you - do get quotes for building works before you commit. And detailed electrical etc checks if your survey doesn't give much detail. I slightly wonder if the seller is pressurising you because there is something to hide

if they see someone keen and you've expressed why you like it etc. they can use that knowledge and bully you into something what you might have not agrred for had there been a bit of distnace and perhaps anopther property :)

I wonder if you are talking Redhill or Reigate ;)

Being able to walk your child to school when she starts has so many benefits - you will get to know the parents and children more easily and it will be great for playdates and sharing pick ups if ever needed. Driving to school just doesnt give you that window of opportunity. If you are new to the area and wanting to make friends Id really consider staying in the local area. Its not hugely kind but I do think parents at our school are a little unfriendly to parents who have got into the school then moved away - whatever the reasons, genuine or not, some will assume you have played the system, especially if their neighbours or friends did not get in. Not an easy start to school life for you either. Not saying its fair but it is a factor.

depends on how far away the OP will be, newgirl - I got the impression she'd only just be out of catchment in the new place?

I am 600m away from our local school (so easily walking distance!) but still out of catchment.

Sorry, we have been busy for the last few days. Thank you so much for all the responses. To address some of the questions:

• if an applicant has been resident there for less than a year, the LA want to see evidence of a house sale or a closure of tenancy, plus a tenancy agreement (if renting). However, they don't explicitly state that they want to see similar evidence for the "other side" of the time frame, IYSWIM. They only state that you must be resident there when school starts. I've beenthrough the documentation quite thoroughly, but it just isn't mentioned, yet it isn't explicitly allowed, either...

-We have not had a survey yet, but it will be the full one, believe me! If there are structural problems, we are walking away (thank goodness). We have the help and tradesman-recommendations of a good friend of DH's, who has done a number of renovation projects. If the numbers don't add up, we aren't buying, either.

• Thanks to posters suggesting how to settle in. I admit we do sound very much like we have only just moved here, yet we have now been here a year! Sadly, local parks are not the

• newgirl, I think you are right about resentment, too, and that's just another factor in making me dread this whole bloody thing. I already feel awkward at preschool pickup/dropoff.

Yet another: DD has been to school a couple of times to familiarise herself, before the end of term, but that hasn't been going very well, either. I actually think she hates her teacher - it's a chemistry thing with her - and this whole thing is getting more and more nightmarish.

Sorry to be ranting and moaning. I guess this underlines the multiple dangers of moving for "good schools"....

Aargh.

Sadly, local parks are not the same as we were used to "back in London" (what a metropolitan snob I am!). There isn't the population density here for them to have a cafe, library, etc.

(crazyhead, I'd love to, but if we went back now, there would be no school place at all, as it's a primary school blackspot! )

If there are structural problems, we are walking away (thank goodness).

Ok . This, along with your other posts, just shouts to me that you do not want to be here and do not want to be buying this house.

Please don't trap yourself in an area you don't like with a money pit renovation project to complete. It just does not make sense.

Here's what I think you should do:

Stay in your rental until December. Take stock in December: is DD enjoying the school? Are you happy with it? Are you making friends through the school? If so, then look for somewhere to buy (or if there's nothing suitable, a different rental nearer the transport links). If not, consider your options - including a move back to London (not necessarily the same bit of London, but somewhere you could still access old friends).

Minipie said exactly what I was thinking. Do not do this. We are renovating. It is hugely expensive, stressful and a major unheaval (in a static caravan). But we can bare it because we love the area, love the house. I cannot even begin to imagine the misery of doing it if I hated the house or the area. Happy Mummy = happy children. Total barf-making cheese but has some merit and truth. A "worse" school in an area you are happy to live in would beat a great school with you feeling unhappy.

Thanks very much for the sympathetic suggestions, and yes, indeed, there is is lot of merit in that. However, we don't have anything for September if we don't have this school (schools are oversubscribed in this neck of the woods). Schools in our old area are even more oversubscribed, and I am definitely not made for Home Educating! (nor is DD)

Also, I'm not (at the moment!) as stressed about a renovation as about this bloody school question, which has now expanded to : a) could we lose the place by moving, and b) why are we doing it anyway, as DD seems to hate it!

We've been renting for so long that having the freedom to do whatever we want is actually really exciting. DD has found all our house-moving traumatic, but having her own bedroom, clothes pegs at her height, etc., could make her feel a bit more settled in life.

Going back to work could also make a big difference to me, personally.

Just getting to that "settlement" is proving very hard!

I feel that the issue wouldn't be with your dd but getting your baby in if you are then not within catchment. Have a look at what it says about siblings.

Our school is siblings in first but if it is over subscribed on siblings it goes on address and closeness to the school.

We moved out of catchment after ds2 got a place in the outstanding primary because I couldn't take the risk of him not getting in.

We originally moved into the area for the school. Now I drive, it is bollocks to say that you only make friends if you walk to school. You make friends in the playground and because your child is friends with another child, so you talk to their mother or father.

My children do playdates and people drive here to collect them and I drive to pick them up. Some parents drive 500 yards to school

It doesn't sound like you want to be there. I would consider moving back to London but perhaps a different area.

Thank you all again for posting. I have been giving this a lot of thought, and in fact the online discussion has helped me to see that it's not the new house itself that I hate - so there's no point not buying it (assuming it's sound!) - but the whole town and the nerves as we go through these last few months before school starts, and the first few months at the new school.

I'm checking up on the Council Tax notifications we will be giving when we move, and will speak with the wife of DH's colleague, who lives locally, to see whether she knows anyone who knows anything.

Thanks also for making me feel less alone in this.

Fizzylemonade - you already had a child in the school so I guess you already knew people. Op child is her first - I think it is a factor that she might find it hard to get to know people if she doesn't live near the school - its happened to people i know - not bollocks at all - sounds like you've played the system

you have no guarantees this school will work out for your dd in the long term - you may want/need to move school again anyway in a year or so.

so the catchment thing could be totally irrelevant. make sure there are also other possible schools too.

get a house where you like/love the location. not just for a school your dd hasnt even started at yet.

if you arent happy then this will feed into dd's anxieties too.

move back to your support network in london...

Well, we're about to have the survey, which will make it clear if we are going ahead or not.

However, I'm feeling more positive as I've been plotting the distances on a map, and it's closer than I thought, and I've also been making a real effort with other preschool group mums recently, which has made me feel better.

Thanks again, all, for responding.

get a house where you like/love the location. not just for a school your dd hasnt even started at yet.
I thought schools were the number one thing on families' lists, pushing everything else into the compromise zone! You're right emotionally, of course, but it's not a point of view which is often heard, so much so that I hope I may be forgiven for having repressed such sensible and sensitive thoughts!

newgirl firstly, I relocated 100 miles with Dh's job so I knew no one all the mother and toddler groups were completely awful as everyone seemed to have established friendships and weren't very willing to let anyone new in. I am a SAHM so couldn't make friends through work. Ds1 was 16 months when we moved.

I did used to walk to school but never met anyone that way at all, only met people in the playground and made friends with parents whose children were in pre-school nursery with mine.

And I sure as hell didn't play the system I merely used the term catchment as lots of schools use an actual catchment area, ours does not. It is an open to all policy, and they will take from far and wide as long as it is not over-subscribed. It is a 90 child intake for reception, it is a huge primary school.

I have friends who lived miles away who managed to get children in where it sure as hell isn't their nearest school by a long shot. So the term catchment does not apply to my primary school.

caughtincatchment good luck with the survey, I think gut instinct plays a huge part when house buying, if it feels right, then go for it. My friends and I travel to each others houses in cars and it hasn't diminished our friendship.