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Property/DIY

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Original poster

Grade 2 listed

21 replies

noddyholder · 01/03/2012 17:27

Pros and cons Please be v honest! Have only until tomorrow am to submit a bid and want to hear horror stories and ones that went smoothly. It is a complete refurb but structurally sound

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fresh · 01/03/2012 17:40

Pros: you end up with a beautiful building (caveat: as long as you do it properly which I'm sure you will). You get a lovely warm feeling because you've saved said building.
Cons: Anything requiring consent (so anything, really) takes ages as you have to submit planning and LBC applications. If you get a difficult officer at the council this can be a nightmare. If the house is surrounded by nimbys, they can also drive you nuts arguing about the precise width of glazing bar you need. And everything costs more because it will take longer, require a really good conservation builder, and need materials that may not normally be available on a pallet from Travis Perkins! .

MrsMagnolia · 01/03/2012 17:43

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

Original poster

noddyholder · 01/03/2012 17:43

I have been reading online and books and talking to conservation officers all week. It is in a terrace of 6 and the others have all been done. We had discounted it initially but as the sealed bid date came closer we viewed it again and liked it more. There will be no prob with nimbyism as they are all the same iygwim. I am just worried it will take forever and we will still be in our rented hovel at xmas!

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Salteena · 01/03/2012 17:48

It will cost. A lot. Good builders who understand the concept of working sympathetically with old buildings are hard to find, usually booked up, and expensive. I won't go into my horror story but we've had a seriously bad experience, and this was with a firm specialising in period buildings.

Having said all that...... I have great admiration for people who have the desire to take on old buildings and cherish them. Characterful old buildings are fab and knock spots off new, bland boxes.

But the question really is, do you love the building enough to lavish all this time, money and effort on it? You do have to be really committed. Good luck if you decide to go for it.

Original poster

noddyholder · 01/03/2012 17:52

I have renovated 10 houses previously but not listed and tbh I think I am at a disadvantage rather than an advantage as I am used to changing everything and can't quite get my head round the level of involvement with the heritage dept at the council! The officer in charge of the street is on holiday so I have only had general advice. She has told me not to rely on being able to extend or excavate the basement and if when he comes back and sees it and says it can be done that is a bonus but she has suggested I bid assuming I can restore as it stands but no structural changes aaaaaaah!!!!!!!!!!!

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Salteena · 01/03/2012 17:52

Sorry, x-posted and wasn't sure how much work was involved. But we didn't do anything majorly structural to ours but still easily spent £££££ (daren't say how much ).

A point very much in your favour is that you would probably have loads of advice and recommendations from your neighbours who've already been through the process.

Original poster

noddyholder · 01/03/2012 17:55

I have done calculations based on previous houses and added 20% but fear thats not enough. All windows need restored not replaced bar one that needs a new one. the current kitchen is a lean to with a plastic bag for a roof we would want to re do and enlarge it but could just about live with it. I am worried more about the walls and ceilings etc. the builders I usually use have limited experience and so I would be starting from scratch BUT I do like it and ds keeps passing it saying thats my house ! (he is 17)

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schloss · 01/03/2012 17:59

There is one plus point on cost though, anything which is done under Listed Building consent and deemed a "change" is not subject to VAT!

Period Property is a good website and is Society for Protection of Ancient Buildings (SPAB).

You will also experience conflicts between building regulations and conservation officer requirements, for example windows, conservation officer will normally want single glazing, building regs will want double glazing!

Original poster

noddyholder · 01/03/2012 18:01

The other houses have secondary glazing I've had a look! No double at all

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fresh · 01/03/2012 18:17

Be careful about replacing the lean to kitchen - if it was in situ when the house was listed, you won't be able to change it without great difficulty. Nuts, I know. We have Georgian houses in Bath with leaky, single skin 1940's extensions and there's massive difficulty over these because they were there at listing.

I think you're right to be very wary of adding only 20%.

You should be able to see the original listing at the council (not helpful when you have to bid tomorrow, I know) which will tell you what state the house was in when listed.

fresh · 01/03/2012 18:21

Sorry Noddy, am being a bit doomy, but have dealt with so many clients who now have grey (or no) hair as a result of dealing with LB officers. But once you've gone through the pain, you'll have a beautiful house.

schloss · 01/03/2012 18:22

I have always found using builders used to older and/or listed buildings keeps the costs reasonable, as they are confident with using lime plasters, breathable paints and repairing rather than replacing. Speak to local surveyors who specialise in older builders, they are normally very good at recommending tradesman.

As all the other properties have single glazing at least you know there is no point in applying for double glazing!

Original poster

noddyholder · 01/03/2012 18:23

Thanks. The lean to is virtually outside iygwim no roof and side dropped off! It was built in the 70s. I swing between excitement and terror! The houses either side both have extended the lean to up to the next floor and across and the conservation woman said she thought there was a good chance but no guarantees. There is only one thing for it WINE!

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schloss · 01/03/2012 18:24

Sorry should have said older buildings, rather than older builders, although they may only recommend older builders!

Original poster

noddyholder · 01/03/2012 19:54

Am getting cold feet now

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GrendelsMum · 01/03/2012 20:27

I wouldn't for you, Noddy. I know you've got a huge amount of experience in house renovation, and I think you'd find the project you've described simultaneously too limited and too boring. You've got all the hassle of having to put in a listed building application every time (and it is a hassle, a really surprising amount of hassle), the materials and specialist craftsmen cost a fortune (I think it might be worth adding at least 50% to prices rather than 20%), but it sounds like the project is too small for you to look at it and really feel pleased with the result. I think you'd just feel like you'd made a whole series of compromises.

My sister is a conservation officer and her advice is never to buy a listed building if you wouldn't be happy to live in as it is.

But on the other hand, it will be huge fun for all of us on here hearing about it if you go ahead!

greyvix · 01/03/2012 20:43

What do you lose by submitting a bid anyway? Presumably, you don't have to put down a deposit. It would give you some research/ reflection time.

Original poster

noddyholder · 01/03/2012 21:14

I did put in a bid today and there was a problem with the document I sent with my bank details. It was a format that the agent couldn't open and he said I would have to bring proof of finance to him tomorrow morning by hand. He rang me several times and I have bought/sold with him in the past and I could tell my offer was probably acceptable as he was so attentive and keen to see me. In the time I tried to sort out the bank statement and make it pdf I spoke twice more to the council and a builder. It gave me the jitters. Dp is at work tonight and I think I am going to retract my bid first thing. I love what I do but agree with grendel I think I would feel stifled and dissatisfied with the end result. This is a home for us if I was going to sell it it would be different. I think I am not in love with the whole history thing enough and am a bit too sledge hammer happy!

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GrendelsMum · 01/03/2012 21:48

I think loving the historical is what keeps you going at times with a listed building, and if it's a home for you it really doesn't seem worth going with a small listed terrace house. My BF has one, and she gets all the hassle that we do and really the result is so dull.

Original poster

noddyholder · 01/03/2012 21:54

I am glad I have really thrashed it out! I think I got carried away with everyone saying it would be great for me! Thanks for all the advice I think I had my ego in mind tbh

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igetcrazytoo · 01/03/2012 22:01

I have lived in a listed building for the last 15 years. In that time we have extended the house, once on the back (permission granted as it replaced a falling down lean to.

Also have put on a conservatory, and have added an extension on the side. Each time we have to submit to building regs, planning and the conservation officer.

The conservation officer has caused the most problems, but can usually negotiate something out of it.

However we had to have single glazing on the new extension (front and back) to match the older part of the building although the new extension looks completely different to the main part of the house. Also had to submit samples of the roof tiles, and they insisted on a colour I liked the least.

We love our house, and don't regret buying it at all.

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